Where Do We Go From Here ?

[Catweazles ring piece]

The worst cup defeat that sticks in my mind was getting gubbed by amateurs from Queens Park.

 

Having been to both matches weeyin, the way we went about Saturday's match was beyond belief.

The Queens Park game was at the start of the demise of a fantastic 70's team, whereas Saturday was at the start of a new team already on the demise.

So I guess we could call it a draw weeyin.

[Burn_Broomfield]

The financial implications of this defeat coupled with the Aberdeen result are disastrous. If we were then to fail to secure a top 6 finish, then the consequences could be dire for next season. The Well Society AGM should be interesting.

[Yoshi-1991]

Worst defeat I have seen was Saturday by a long shot. Embarrassed to wear the colours on the way home.

[ankles]

Worst defeat I have seen was Saturday by a long shot. Embarrassed to wear the colours on the way home.

 

For me , nothing will ever come close to that cup game at Ibrox last year. Makes me want to spew every time i think of it.

[Malky79]

For me , nothing will ever come close to that cup game at Ibrox last year. Makes me want to spew every time i think of it.

 

I still feel stronger about that game than I do this one but still reckon this is more of a red neck.

[weeyin]

With some Dutch courage last night I looked up the details of the Queens Park defeat. It was 1979 and they gubbed us 4 - 1 at home in the first leg of a league cup tie. I remember the score, just couldn't remember the exact year. We never looked like overcoming it in the second leg at Hampden, although we did at least win that game.

 

That was my first real taste of feeble cup exits.

 

As for the most recent Ibrox debacle, it was a sore one, but the 5 - 1 capitulation in the CIS Final was worse for me.

[Yabba's Turd]

0-6 Celtic when Bobby Watson was in charge was a kick in the chuckies

[Frazzie]

In terms of isolated games we've obviously had some shockers, but as a run of cup exits go, the one we are on now is abysmal.

 

Albion Rovers- enough said.

At home to ten man sheep.

At home to sheep again after losing a sloppy last minute goal to force the replay then not turning up.

Third division h**s on their knees, bottle crashed.

 

We can't have had back-to-back seasons of cup exits worse than that, especially with the added boot in the stones that in both years we were papped out before Xmas.

[underboyleheating]

The Albion Rovers debacle was certainly the cherry on top of a Sevco/Aberdeen ‘Cupcake’.

[fat_tony]

We're in a bit of a sticky spot in terms of the level of performance and style of football we're playing at the moment. Everyone can see it, and most are getting frustrated with it. Looking at previous seasons under McCall though, we're currently achieving a similar level of performance in terms of results (after the first 14 matches).

 

 

2010/11: W7 - D2 - L5 - F20 - A16 - Pts 23 - Final Position 6th

2011/12: W8 - D2 - L4 - F18 - A17 - Pts 26 - Final Position 3rd

2012/13: W5 - D5 - L4 - F22 - A19 - Pts 20 - Final Position 2nd

2013/14: W8 - D1 - L5 - F16 - A18 - Pts 25

 

We had an horrendous sticky patch in 2010-11 between mid-November and mid-February,as Craig Brown left us and McCall had to come in and try and build on the team. In 2011-12 we didn't really have too many bad patches (although I remember so many complaints at the time). We were looking like we were starting to struggle from mid-December to the end of January until Ojamaa joined the club, and gave us that extra dimension we needed in attack. Last season we were fortunate enough to get our worst spell out the way in September/October, and even then people were moaning like fuck at the likes of Murphy, Law, Humphrey and Ojamaa for not having any ideas, or any speed in the build up.

 

So, it's not anything hugely new, struggling around this time of year. The difference, in my opinion, is that we don't have the options, or the attacking verve that we had in previous years with the aforementioned Humphrey/Law/Ojamaa, all of whom were capable of moving quickly and creating space. We've had pretty successful January transfer window (and after) dealings the last few years such as Ojamaa, McFadden and to a lesser extent, although they did a job for us at the time, Gunning and Ross, so hopefully we can replicate that success this season and bring in the pace/creativity we need in January. McCall was quick off the mark last year with Higginbotham, so hopefully he can get someone arranged as quickly this time round.

 

So the trick seems to be to address the elephant in the room. How to get the best out of the players we currently have. We've got some talented players. I don't doubt that for a second. But given our abundance of central midfielders and lack of fit wide options, McCall has to change his tactics. It's the only thing we have available at the moment to halt the slide. We don't have the pace and directness we had in previous seasons, so we can't expect to play like it. A lot of people have said it already, but McCall needs to realise this and change his attacking approach to suit the players we have, not try and force something that doesn't work.

 

I don't for a second think it's time for McCall to go. He's done a good job over the past few years and has his biggest job yet in building an effective unit out of our new team. If we're still playing like this in February with no sign of change or improvement, then maybe that's a question that has to resurface.

[Grant]

^^ Finally some sense.

 

Out of interest, who do people suggest we bring in if they think McCall should be sacked??

[gilmour]

1386164778[/url]' post='400447']

^^ Finally some sense.

 

Out of interest, who do people suggest we bring in if they think McCall should be sacked??

 

And where is the money for this coming from ? oh wait after 3 disastrous cup runs we ain't got a pot to piss in.

[weeyin]

Now is not the time to replacing a manager. Only at Fir Park would that patter surface when we are sitting 3rd in the league at the start of a rebuilding process after the core of our team was ripped out.

 

If any manager (including McCall) can work under the constraints of this season and get us a top 6 finish, they should get a medal.

 

Where are all the punters that were mouthing off about "I don't care if we field a team of boys that gets hammered every week, as long as Sevco aren't allowed back into the SPL?" Well, guess what? While we aren't penniless, we are working with a smaller budget again this year partly due to the Sevco affair, and this is the result.

 

The team isn't near as good as last year yet, but last years' team took 4 seasons to build. And even then we had a crap home record at the same stage of our previous campaign. I doubt McCall needs telling that some players need a rocket or the elbow, but the way the transfer windows work there days, you have to bide your time.

 

It might end up that this is McCall's last season, or he might turn things around and have the supporters clamouring for more. However, I think he has at least earned some breathing space given his overall performance in the last couple of seasons. Of course he has made mistakes; some he has learned from a few he hasn't. But that's the best we can hope for at our level - and give me a McCall over a John Hughes or Pat Fenlon any day of the week.

[chummy]

Some people on here should be careful what they wish for.

[gilmour]

Give the club and Leanne dempster some credit we haven't went down the calderwood, shields, Hughes route for a long time and their manager choice has been well left field and unexpected to say the least. So why would they go with the managers being spouted (to make people's points) now ?

[Juan Kerse]

Pish again the night. And do you know what is most evident, this team Ian't a shockingly BAD team. They are just a NOTHING team.

 

Absolutely no ideas, creativity, guile. When we play a team that is worse than us it's a scrappy 1 goal win. When we play anyone much better we get pumped.

 

Going to be an absolute shanner of a season from here on in.

[Ya Bezzer!]

Last six matches I've seen

 

Celtic 0-5 (0 shots on target)

Albion Rovers 0-1 (2 shots on target)

Dundee Utd 0-4 (1 shot on target)

Hibernian 1-0 (4 shots on target)

Aberdeen 0-2 (2 shots on target)

St. Johnstone 0-2 (1 shot on target)

 

So 540 minutes of football, 10 shots on target.

 

Or a shot on target over 54 minutes and a goal ever 540 minutes!!!

[Brazilian]

Last six matches I've seen

 

Celtic 0-5 (0 shots on target)

Albion Rovers 0-1 (2 shots on target)

Dundee Utd 0-4 (1 shot on target)

Hibernian 1-0 (4 shots on target)

Aberdeen 0-2 (2 shots on target)

St. Johnstone 0-2 (1 shot on target)

 

So 540 minutes of football, 10 shots on target.

 

Or a shot on target over 54 minutes and a goal ever 540 minutes!!!

you've given me hope as I'm pretty sure you posted an almost identical moan last season about a run of home form

[siebsbarmyarmy]

Last six matches I've seen

 

Celtic 0-5 (0 shots on target)

Albion Rovers 0-1 (2 shots on target)

Dundee Utd 0-4 (1 shot on target)

Hibernian 1-0 (4 shots on target)

Aberdeen 0-2 (2 shots on target)

St. Johnstone 0-2 (1 shot on target)

 

So 540 minutes of football, 10 shots on target.

 

Or a shot on target over 54 minutes and a goal ever 540 minutes!!!

 

That is awful truly awful.

[Ya Bezzer!]

you've given me hope as I'm pretty sure you posted an almost identical moan last season about a run of home form

 

Let's hope it works this season as well.

[MelvinBragg]

What seems clear to me is that it's pointless keeping Anier and Ainsworth beyond January. Neither have offered enough to suggest they're worth keeping.

 

We need to bring the young players in now. McCafferty is a winger I've heard good things about. Play him rather than Ainsworth. Play Moore in place of Anier. Will they step up? No, but we won't find out until we give them a run of games. Guys like Leitch, Murray, Kerr and Angol need to be developed. They are our future and McCall MUST work intensively with them in order to know their strengths, where they can fit into a team structure and what he needs to improve in them. Guys like Lasley, Sutton, Ramsden and McManus should be helping these boys through games. Angol and Carswell, in particular, could be crucial as Lasley and Hammell can't go on forever.

 

McCall's other challenge is to sit down with Vigurs and Lawson and figure out how to use them. We have them for another 18 months. If he can't figure out a way to fit them into a side, he needs to try and move them on. Lawson would find a club willing to take him, no problem. I'd imagine Vigurs would get an SPL club as well.

 

And while McCall is working with the young players, Black should be working with the older guys on their fitness. If we're not going to be able to retain possession as well as last season, then we need to be able to hound the opposition for the full 90 minutes.

 

Big challenges for the next six months. But how the club and McCall approach them might determine whether we can maintain our status as a top six SPL club or whether we suffer the fate of Kilmatnock or Dunfermline...

[Steve Diggle]

If everybody stays in the house because of a wee bad run, then 'where we're going from here' is down the divisions.

[punk_in_drublic]

I think last Saturday was like a one in ten year hangover. In such an event you can't face drink the next weekend. Those people (which in includes me) will be back. Whether that halts the quality of performance from deteriorating further is another matter.

[joewarkfanclub]

What seems clear to me is that it's pointless keeping Anier and Ainsworth beyond January. Neither have offered enough to suggest they're worth keeping.

 

We need to bring the young players in now. McCafferty is a winger I've heard good things about. Play him rather than Ainsworth. Play Moore in place of Anier. Will they step up? No, but we won't find out until we give them a run of games. Guys like Leitch, Murray, Kerr and Angol need to be developed. They are our future and McCall MUST work intensively with them in order to know their strengths, where they can fit into a team structure and what he needs to improve in them. Guys like Lasley, Sutton, Ramsden and McManus should be helping these boys through games. Angol and Carswell, in particular, could be crucial as Lasley and Hammell can't go on forever.

 

McCall's other challenge is to sit down with Vigurs and Lawson and figure out how to use them. We have them for another 18 months. If he can't figure out a way to fit them into a side, he needs to try and move them on. Lawson would find a club willing to take him, no problem. I'd imagine Vigurs would get an SPL club as well.

 

And while McCall is working with the young players, Black should be working with the older guys on their fitness. If we're not going to be able to retain possession as well as last season, then we need to be able to hound the opposition for the full 90 minutes.

 

Big challenges for the next six months. But how the club and McCall approach them might determine whether we can maintain our status as a top six SPL club or whether we suffer the fate of Kilmatnock or Dunfermline...

 

Excellent post.

 

We cant afford to sack the manager. We cant afford any new players. But we can and should be doing all of the above.

 

I just hope the management team are thinking along the same lines and get on with it as its getting increasingly difficult to watch.

 

SIWY.

[stv]

The season is a right off we need to take what we can get from it and that's no much .Realisticly we lost all our good players in the team and replaced them with all we could afford ,they turned out to be crap apart from McManus.The managers done his best but it looks to me the team hasn't bonded and have no personality about it .But ill take the last few seasons and put up with this pishy one . Our midfield is utter usless and Lasley cant do it by himself that's were the problem is think .We were totally out classed and last night ,don't think we even had a shot at goal