Jump to content

Infamous Wee Grafter

Next Gaffer?

Recommended Posts

We don't know who would be in control of the club as everything was bound to secrecy. Would John Boyle have sold the club to a South American consortium? Would a local businessman have came to our rescue hours before administration?

 

Under the new regime, it looks like we are racking up debt to LH that the club, society and fans will be paying back for years to come. Now that is fair enough if we reap the rewards from LH investment in a new infrastructure. From the outside however, it looks like funds will be required to pay back investment in an over-inflated staff that is seemingly prone to a high turnover in the 1st year.

 

The project is a 5 year one but the 1st year has not been good with threats from the owner pulling the plug and the WS making minimal progress. A lot has to change if we are going to become a self-sustainable club.

Has Les actually said he's thinking of pulling the plug ? And the WS was always doomed tae failure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The WS is already a success because it has loaned the club funds (interest free) on a number of occasions that it would have been unable to secure elsewhere.

 

If all it ever does is that, then it has still been a worthwhile exercise.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

No, I want the finances and crowd levels to reach a point where the owners have to actually listen and take on board what the fans believe. I listed my reasons for my thinking, and if you disagree on the players, the new manager and how Les has approached promoting the Well Society then that's fair enough. I simply don't like how business is being conducted at the moment.

Whether or not you agree with David's rather extreme approach to effecting change, there is a great deal of truth in what he says regarding the way the Club and the Society are being run....directly or indirectly by Mr Hutchinson and in the performance of some players. Do I want attendances to dwindle even further? No. Do I want us to wither and die? No Do I want David's grievances addressed? Yes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Has Les actually said he's thinking of pulling the plug ? And the WS was always doomed tae failure.

According to his Daily Mail interview in August, he has no interest in owning the club and if 3 payments are missed at any point in time, the agreement is over.

 

Nothing new there but it was a bold reminder.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My problem with that is we as a support and on top of that WS members should have been informed of any caveats and not via a filthy, jingoistic, tabloid rag.

 

From reading comments, I see I'm not the only one seriously concerned with the governance of our club and where it's going at WS and full board level.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

David, serious question, will, say 6 wins from the next ten games help?

 

It'll help our position in the league without doubt, but I fear that such a run of results will only paper over the cracks in my opinion, deflecting from the larger issues.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One of my work's Directors, who is a lifelong supporter who travels home and away and a member of the Well Society is utterly scathing of how the club was run behind the scenes for the last few years. Dunno how he feels about things now but he has always said The Well Society actually turned Motherwell into a rudderless ship where too many people had input into the running of the club who didn't have any buisness acumen ,resulting in it going nowhere. Like 99.9% of Well fans on here if i won the lottery tonight and bought the club , i wouldn't have a bloody clue where to start.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Six years ago we took a bigger than usual following up to Aberdeen where a sizeable section of the crowd travelled purely to give him 90 minutes of dogs abuse including the paedo stuff. Probably testament to how aggrieved we felt back then with his continous whoring and horrible big heided attitude. We had also been left with a diddy goalkeeper and pretty much no one else in the summer of 09. You can call that giving the next man a clean slate to start again or sheer incompetence.. I'll go with the latter.

 

Since then he has ruined his legacy at Aberdeen and taken promotion favourites Bristol Rovers to second bottom of league two.. A startling 26% win percentage in a league they were expected to romp.

 

Now 78% of folk on this forum are happy to take him back with open arms.

 

And people think the boy David is mental!

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We had also been left with a diddy goalkeeper and pretty much no one else in the summer of 09. You can call that giving the next man a clean slate to start again or sheer incompetence.. I'll go with the latter.

 

He left us with Steven Hammell, Mark Reynolds, Stephen Craigan, John Sutton, Keith Lasley, Jamie Murphy, Jim O'Brien among others and gave debuts the previous season to youth team players like Shaun Hutchinson, Paul Slane, Bob McHugh and Steven Saunders.

 

Talk about re-writing history.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

He left us with Steven Hammell, Mark Reynolds, Stephen Craigan, John Sutton, Keith Lasley, Jamie Murphy, Jim O'Brien among others and gave debuts the previous season to youth team players like Shaun Hutchinson, Paul Slane, Bob McHugh and Steven Saunders.

 

Talk about re-writing history.

Shame the game against Llanelli wasn't seven a side

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If we're true Well fans then we stick by the club through thick and through thin. Managers, players, owners, pitches, strategies all come and go but the fans should remain end of.

 

Throughout my 55 years of supporting the Well a lot has happened that I didn't like and perhaps you voice your disquiet but in the end you accept that and move on to the next game.

.

 

To be fair Dave, you don't like much

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The fickle nature of fans-

Six wins in a row and the nay-sayers will be making McGhee banners and composing catchy wee songs...

Just get on board and enjoy the ride, whether your glass is half full, half empty, smashed to pieces, or been finished off entirely by a passing optimist...

Save your abuse for the opposition

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My problem with that is we as a support and on top of that WS members should have been informed of any caveats and not via a filthy, jingoistic, tabloid rag.

 

From reading comments, I see I'm not the only one seriously concerned with the governance of our club and where it's going at WS and full board level.

 

Just had a look at the society web page for the first time.

 

It looks like they have changed the primary objective on the fly, i don't recall anything about financial protection or repaying loans being in there originally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We will not be relegated with Mark McGhee as manager. The problem I always had with him was his attitude when it came to playing Celtic and rangers. Same as McCall, there was never really any belief that we could do them. Also 2007 seen us play the most attractive football I'd ever seen us play but there was no plan B and when the wheels fell off he was trying to find a way out. Honestly don't know what to make of this appointment but what is more concerning is the complete lack of direction at board level. Leanne Dempster was always good at keeping the fans informed about where the club was at but feel like we're left in limbo these days.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Shame the game against Llanelli wasn't seven a side

 

You said he left us with nothing. Actually he left us with the core of a team that had season upon season of relative success. Good try though.

 

Actually he left is with a squad of about 15 first team players plus cash for the new manager to spend.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One things for sure, it's been controversial. It's brought out some extreme emotions.

 

This place would be in absolute melt down if it was Craig Brown that was appointed.

 

Most folk have a degree of sense and truth in their reactions, even the very-extreme ones.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

You said he left us with nothing. Actually he left us with the core of a team that had season upon season of relative success. Good try though.

 

Actually he left is with a squad of about 15 first team players plus cash for the new manager to spend.

It was actually your messiah himself that said we were left with nothing..

 

McGhee said: "Gannon deserves a lot of credit. I felt he had the hardest job out of all of the managers because this summer and last season Motherwell lost Paul Quinn, David Clarkson, Stephen Hughes, Maros Klimpl, Graeme Smith, Ross McCormack and Chris Porter.

 

"That's the best of my team that finished third. So he had to pick it up with all that talent gone and with young lads who had never been proven."

 

Better have another look at your history book, mind appears to be a bit foggy.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Just had a look at the society web page for the first time.

 

It looks like they have changed the primary objective on the fly, i don't recall anything about financial protection or repaying loans being in there originally.

 

Something decidedly Orwellian about this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I feel a degree of responsibility for some of this whole "davidgate" shenanigans. It was my post that may have goaded him into his rant and perhaps what he said are not to everyone's liking....but I can understand his sentiment.

 

I don't agree with the whole abstinence of attendance thing because quite simply, it would achieve nothing. Even if done on mass, without a representative voice, a boycott would only do more harm than good.

 

Is there something deeply wrong at the heart of the club and how it functions? I don't honestly know and I would wager nobody else who contributes to this forum does either and if they did, they haven't articulated it.

 

In the absence of hard fact, we are left to breed opinion based upon the opinions of others whose opinions are based on the opinions of others and so the perpetual irrationality prevails.

 

LH has never hidden the fact his offer to the club was a loan and that he expected to be paid back. From the outset, he was clear that this 'vision' of his was solely reliant upon the success of the well society. These are facts.

 

How LH has conducted himself in the media of course has left a great deal to be desired but his behaviour has been consistent with the character assessments given to me about him by people I know professionally who once had to deal with him during his time at the Craig.

 

Is the club in a better state than it was before he came? Arguably yes and arguably no, but we can't properly tell until the 'five year plan' begins to bear fruit or LH walks away because we didn't meet our contractual obligations to him.

 

Would we have been better off without LH? Don't know and why waste any grey matter worrying about it....whatever the alternative, it didn't happen.

 

So in a nutshell, if people want answers and aren't happy about the manner in which their beloved football club is being run, don't just be a keyboard warrior or deny yourself your lifelong pleasure (pain) of being a lifelong well fan....do something about it!!!!

 

Get organised and make your voice heard!!!

 

The well society is a perfect vehicle....so use it....ask the difficult questions.....influence the future of your club!!!!!

 

Now geez a brek wi the woe is me !!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The "vision" or whatever you want to call it of the owner is not a new one. It's been said for along time that we are a selling club. It's clear that bringing success does not translate into larger crowds or at least not large enough to make any difference. So i believe that the club cannot exist relying on money coming in from the fan base, be that Well society or gate money/TV money etc.

 

The Well society can help out form time to time ( I think this was it's intention, right? ) but as for the fans becoming the owners it is still imperitive to be a selling club in order to bring in funds to sustain the life of the club. Perhaps what Les is doing is merely just a re focus on getting back to being a selling club. It maybe that in the last few years we have been focused on "success" forgetting somewhat that we need to actually produce/nurture talent good enough to sell. These are not mutually exclusive and I hope that we can achieve success and at the same time produce enough talent to sell on a regular basis to keep the bank balance healthy.

 

Regarding the whole "davidgate" discussion, again, this has been going on for at least the past 50 years. On a regular basis individuals finally just give up the ghost and decide enough is enough and they just stop going to the games, whether thats Ian StJohn

getting sold ( see! told you at least 50 years ) or Mark McGhee returning as manager. So everyone is entitled to make that choice without getting flak. However, I do think that wishing to see the demise of your football club is deserving of flak. .......Anyways, if the game is on the telly this week I'll be getting up at 5.45am to watch it live. COYW!!!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Get organised and make your voice heard!!!

 

The well society is a perfect vehicle....so use it....ask the difficult questions.....influence the future of your club!!!!!

 

 

Good words. However -

 

18 September - EMailed Society as a concerned Society Member asking for clarification on a few concerns (following discussions on SOL).

21 September - Prompt response from Craig Hughes. Chairman and Accountant on trips overseas but questions will be dealt with upon return. Also advised of plans to hold meeting within 2 weeks or so to discuss fans escalating concerns.

07 October - No further response so chased up.

12 October - Response from Craig Hughes apologising for delay and promising to push for answers to my concerns ASAP.

 

So almost a month and no meaningful response. Ok, I understand the Football Club has had a busy time of late, but surely just one Society Board member could find the time to respond. The points I raised were fairly basic relating to membership, finance, objectives and ownership of Mr Hutchison's repayment. My request was also before it became apparent that John Boyle had perhaps not been repaid as many had believed and that the aims of the Society appeared to have been altered as Steelboy brought to our attention.

 

Hope my concerns are misplaced and I do eventually receive some clarification. But meantime the doubts continue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting sentiments expressed there Gadgey. However I did try to follow your suggestion and got my fingers burned similar to Denny.

 

Rather than detract from the sidelines I opted to volunteer my time and ideas to scrutiny with an aim to ultimately benefit the WS and club. I never had formal feedback after my 30 minute presentation, an opportunity to field questions or any meaningful discussion on a presentation that took a considerable time to research and put together. I had to seek out some of those who attended a Q&A in the centenary suite for a hasty 30 seconds as they were heading out the door, is that right or correct?

 

My experience with communications is endemic of the WS from it’s formation and I don’t count myself alone if criticism on here is anything to go by. I conveyed this during the meeting and two months after the initial invitation I find myself frozen out rather than have my points addressed. It is almost as if the lack of reply has endorsed my criticism.

 

I was advised the chairman would get in contact to address my concerns by Craig Hughes ..... a further 2 months later, still nothing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It does seem something of a one-man band, but is the communication any worse than that of the club itself?

 

For non disclosure agreement, read... Les has his hand up my arse like he's Keith (RIP) and I'm Orville

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Regarding the whole "davidgate" discussion, again, this has been going on for at least the past 50 years. On a regular basis individuals finally just give up the ghost and decide enough is enough and they just stop going to the games, whether thats Ian StJohn getting sold ( see! told you at least 50 years ) or Mark McGhee returning as manager. So everyone is entitled to make that choice without getting flak. However, I do think that wishing to see the demise of your football club is deserving of flak. .......Anyways, if the game is on the telly this week I'll be getting up at 5.45am to watch it live. COYW!!!

Good points. Presumably we'll lose fans as a result of Mark McGhee's appointment but don't forget we'll have fans returning as some indicated they would no longer attend until such time as Ian Baraclough left - he's now departed. We also had fans returning once john Boyle departed. No doubt some will not return until Les Hutchison leaves the scene. Our fan base is constantly shifting and changing although a consistent core tends to remain.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

Twitter @MotherwellFC

×