Yorkyred Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 As I see it, the problem with our midfield is as follows.. Early in the season, we played three workers in the midfield (invariably McHugh, Rose and Campbell). This allowed us to compete but the lack of creativity was less of an issue because we had an in form Bowman dragging defenders all over the place leaving space for Moult. And Moult could get us a goal out of nothing. Think of the last goal against Aberdeen in the league cup, the second goal in the semi final, his goal against Hearts. Were those goals 'created' for Moult? In the absence of Moult or another striker who can pull a goal of nowhere, we are now generally only playing two workers and Tanner. I like Tanner (although he had a poor game today) but he's not going to do the dirty work that a Rose might do. Basically I feel that the problem is not Campbell or McHugh but the fact that they are generally playing against three central midfielders. When players are of a broadly similar ability (as most SPL players are), numbers generally win the day. So what's the solution? Could Bigirimana or MacLean be the third midfielder in place of Tanner offering creativity and a degree of defensive work that isn't Tanner's strength. Could Cadden play more centrally as he did a couple of seasons ago under McGhee in a asymmetrical 442? Then he played with Pearson and Lasley in the middle, occasionally breaking into wider areas when we attacked. Johnson played wide, allowing us to still play two up front. As others have said, the 352 doesn't suit the attacking players in our squad. Tanner, Cadden and Frear don't really benefit from this system and we're not getting the best out of them in this shape. Maybe as Ciftci gets fitter, he'll start to pull goals out of nowhere as Moult did earlier this season and Robinson will be able to go back to his three 'battlers' in the middle of the park. Again not great to watch but it might be relatively successful. Depressing that it might be better for us to ditch our more creative players in favour of workers. A sad indictment on Scottish football... At the moment I dont think there is an easy answer regarding midfield, as a whole they were dire yesterday and for me its the area that needs looking at most. No one really performed and as individuals they all appear to be going backwards. I think McHugh gets too much stick in general but he was poor yesterday as was Campbell, Caddens is a shadow of the player we know can tear teams a new one. With that formation easy answer is bring in another couple of midfielders but we already have the numbers so thats not going to happen. At least Frear made a difference as did Biggi but im not convinced he is the answer moving forward and will probably be shipped out in the summer. Think we need to change formation, but with the players we have I doubt Robinson will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 At the moment I dont think there is an easy answer regarding midfield, as a whole they were dire yesterday and for me its the area that needs looking at most. No one really performed and as individuals they all appear to be going backwards. I think McHugh gets too much stick in general but he was poor yesterday as was Campbell, Caddens is a shadow of the player we know can tear teams a new one. With that formation easy answer is bring in another couple of midfielders but we already have the numbers so thats not going to happen. At least Frear made a difference as did Biggi but im not convinced he is the answer moving forward and will probably be shipped out in the summer. Think we need to change formation, but with the players we have I doubt Robinson will.There is no easy answer as you say. I do think that Campbell and McHugh are being made to look worse than they are by the fact that they're being outnumbered in there. I like Tanner but when he's played as a central midfielder it becomes more like 3412 or 343 than 352. Which is a problem when pretty much every other team in the league plays three central midfielders. People have been slating McHugh's distribution but numbers are a factor there as well. With three opposition midfielders against our two, it makes it far easier for teams to close both McHugh and his passing channels down. I'm not absolving the players of any blame but I don't think the shape always helps. Cadden is another player suffering because of this. Playing at wing back, his starting position means that he has to do a lot more work before he gets into an area where he can cause the opposition problems. I guess what I'm trying to say is tgat people are focusing on personnel in midfield when it's not the only problem... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gullane Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 I like this discussion on our midfield and agree with most comments. I think a top 6 place will be one by the team that wins most 50/50 tackles against similar standard opposition. For Motherwell, this will mean ditching a creative player for three battlers in the middle of the park - perm any three from McHugh, Campbell, Rose, Grimshaw, Bigirimana. If we play only two, we are liable to be out fought, and spend most games moaning at McHugh et al for wasting and losing possession. By limiting the number of creative players, this is going to mean the forward line will have to work hard. Main for one looks up for it. Ciftci took his goal well and could potentially create goals out of nothing a la Moult. One tactic that often puts the frighteners up SPL defences is pace - especially runners with the ball at their feet. We have Cadden, Frear, and the under used MacLean who if released from defensive duties, could pose more of a threat and feed Ciftci and Main. I don't think we have the personnel for silky, Cruyff/Neeskins, total football. But if SR can use the St J, Dundee and Kilmarnock games to get re-galvanize that battling spirit of our early season form, the results, if not the performances, should be more pleasing. "Get intae them" the battle cry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
something else Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Just watched the highlights back. The thistle goal was as bad as it seemed at the game if not worse. Also the tackle on Campbell was a disgrace and should have been a straight red. Our midfield really need a bit of creativity. Campbell is a great wee player but my one complaint is that he always looks to pass to Cadden. A wee look up elsewhere and he could find a better pass to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swami Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 I like this discussion on our midfield and agree with most comments. I think a top 6 place will be one by the team that wins most 50/50 tackles against similar standard opposition. For Motherwell, this will mean ditching a creative player for three battlers in the middle of the park - perm any three from McHugh, Campbell, Rose, Grimshaw, Bigirimana. If we play only two, we are liable to be out fought, and spend most games moaning at McHugh et al for wasting and losing possession. By limiting the number of creative players, this is going to mean the forward line will have to work hard. Main for one looks up for it. Ciftci took his goal well and could potentially create goals out of nothing a la Moult. One tactic that often puts the frighteners up SPL defences is pace - especially runners with the ball at their feet. We have Cadden, Frear, and the under used MacLean who if released from defensive duties, could pose more of a threat and feed Ciftci and Main. I don't think we have the personnel for silky, Cruyff/Neeskins, total football. But if SR can use the St J, Dundee and Kilmarnock games to get re-galvanize that battling spirit of our early season form, the results, if not the performances, should be more pleasing. "Get intae them" the battle cry. See, and I really hope that this doesnt come across as arsey, but Im not really having this at all. The midfield is crying out for someone who can put his foot on the ball and find a bit of space like Bigirimana. Against Ross County he was stripped and ready to come on, which was exactly the right sub at that point to see the game out, and suddenly he was told to sit down and Petravicious came on instead. Yesterday I felt like it was the exact right thing to do again as there was starting to be a bit more space in the midfield during the second half and he didnt even get a sniff. I wasnt at Easter Road, but apparently he contributed a great deal when he came on and he definitely did at Firhill earlier in the season. I know this sounds like Im some fan-boy here, but I would at least like to see someone try and play a bit of football in the team. If we try and go the rest of the season with a midfield of McHugh, Campbell and Rose my eyes will end up bleeding watching it, it should be Campbell and one of the other two max. Edit: I might have either mis-read this or quoted the wrong post. Might as well just leave it here now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 I think a top 6 place will be one by the team that wins most 50/50 tackles against similar standard opposition. For Motherwell, this will mean ditching a creative player for three battlers in the middle of the park - perm any three from McHugh, Campbell, Rose, Grimshaw, Bigirimana. If we play only two, we are liable to be out fought....By limiting the number of creative players, this is going to mean the forward line will have to work hard. Main for one looks up for it. Ciftci took his goal well and could potentially create goals out of nothing a la Moult....one thing that often puts the frighteners up SPL defences is pace - especially runners with the ball at their feet. We have Cadden, Frear, and the under used MacLean who if released from defensive duties, could pose more of a threat and feed Ciftci and Main. I don't think we have the personnel for silky, Cruyff/Neeskins, total football. But if SR can use the St J, Dundee and Kilmarnock games to get re-galvanize that battling spirit of our early season form, the results, if not the performances, should be more pleasing. "Get intae them" the battle cry. I agree with most of that. Yesterday apart from being outnumbered at times in central midfield Campbell and McHugh lost too many 50/50 challenges and personal battles. I don't blame them for that as they were up against bigger, heavier and more athletic opponents. We also lacked pace and width yesterday. The likes of Frear is more effective when in an open game rather than trying to break down packed defences and thats why I would have started him, even if he couldn't last 90 minutes. We have no pace whatsoever in central midfield. Whilst watching us being outfought in the middle I kept thinking of Al B's suggestion of moving Kipre forward to add some bite, drive and athleticism there. Yes, the team, which finishes 6th, probably Kilmarnock, will do so on the basis of being very competitve and making fewest errors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 See, and I really hope that this doesnt come across as arsey, but Im not really having this at all. The midfield is crying out for someone who can put his foot on the ball and find a bit of space like Bigirimana. I agree up to a point in terms of what we lack. However we have to win the ball first as Robbo keeps reminding us and yesterday we simply couldn't do that for long spells. You have to do the dirty, nasty, battling work first before the silky cultured players do their bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
postiejim Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Points Last 6 games. Aberdeen 13 Celtic 13 Hibs 11 Kilmarnock 11 Partick Thistle 10 Rangers 10 Hearts 9 Dundee 7 Hamilton 6 Motherwell 5 St.Johnstone 5 Ross County 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haggischomper Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Petravicius fair shat out of that header near the end. Aside from pace, what exactly does this guy provide the squad? He's like the Lithuanian Andy Roddie thus far. I'd bump him from the squad and place McLean there instead 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllyMax Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Petravicius fair shat out of that header near the end. Aside from pace, what exactly does this guy provide the squad? He's like the Lithuanian Andy Roddie thus far. I'd bump him from the squad and place McLean there instead Lithuanian Andy Roddie :-) I proper LOL'd at that !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
something else Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Petravicius fair shat out of that header near the end. Aside from pace, what exactly does this guy provide the squad? He's like the Lithuanian Andy Roddie I honestly don't know what the guy brings to the team but seems to be a favourite of Robinson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milo Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Lithuanian Andy Roddie?!?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clackscat Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Lithuanian Andy Roddie?!?! Its inexplicable he didnt throw himself at that chance at the end! It required no bravery or ability either. Couldnt agree more....that was a great ball in, any player worth his salt would have thrown himself at it. Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coop91 Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 What a bunch of moaning faced cunts on here. It's no wonder so many supporters of the club just don't bother coming on now. You lot have this site to yourselves now. Happy moaning. FFS. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fizoxy Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 To be fair to Roddie, he would have thrown himself at that cross and found a way to put it over. He also had a great game on Jamie Dolan day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stv Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 What a bunch of moaning faced cunts on here. It's no wonder so many supporters of the club just don't bother coming on now. You lot have this site to yourselves now. Happy moaning. FFS. Its the fifa 2018 on the xbox..... Makes u think your Pep Guareiola we should be playing like Man City. But here we are ,Motherwell and its no so easy to be great every week on our budget. Our manager has done well so far in the real world. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clackscat Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 What a bunch of moaning faced cunts on here. It's no wonder so many supporters of the club just don't bother coming on now. You lot have this site to yourselves now. Happy moaning. FFS.I'm pleading not guilty to that charge m'lud quite ironic when I'm the one normally having a go at others for being over critical and continually negative...I sometimes feel like you there are some destructively negative comments on here that are seldom balanced with praise when due but I stay on here to try and counter that. However that doesn't mean I will never criticise if I think a player or manager merits it and I think that was the case here Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkyred Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 As in life, all about balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fizoxy Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Some people will always focus on the negatives. Thats not s football thing, some folk are just like that. Thats their business. Some folk also treat supporting their club as some sort of punishment for transgressions in a former life. Its a shame, as most of us just enjoy having a team to watch and everything that comes with it, but were all different and thats a good thing. Im sick of the rep this place gets. there are always differing points of views on whos shite and when we should sack the manager, and it wasnt that long ago that we used to get slated for being happy clappy. You can simply ignore the stuff you dont like, or block folk you cant stand, or offer your counter argument and leave it at that, or just dont bother logging on. But whining about the forum because we dont all agree with each other is weak. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pettywulliegrew-2 Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Bizarre highlights on Sportscene.........no Main chip/Cerny great save or Frears cross to Roddie Sacrificed for us to hear Thomson/ Stewart talk pish 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coop91 Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 There is very little balanced opinion on here now. If it were it would still be worthwhile reading. It has now got to the point that when the team win the silence on here is deafening and very little praise. However, should the team drop points then the usual posters are up in arms followed by abuse for abuse sake. Like most fans I very rarely pop in for a read now, but when I do it just feels like the site is now full of attempts at trolling, sprinkled witb decent posters who still understand that we are not a club full of players who are not world beaters but are doing there fucking best to entertain the support. Though if they were to read most of the shite on here I don't thing they would bother. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 "Forget it, Jake; it's Chinatown" The motto of all social media these days. Nuance is largely dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEWELL Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 Just watched the highlights there and there is feck all wrong with Mains goal. We've been robbed again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 But whining about the forum because we dont all agree with each other is weak. To be fair, I think that's kind of missing the point. About a page back in this very thread, there are a number of posts from people who don't agree how our midfield should be made up of, both in terms of numbers and personnel. It's really interesting to read the different viewpoints and everyone makes a good case for what they believe. I'd much rather read that than everyone having the same opinion. I don't think anyone wants everyone to agree with them - except for those who desperately feel the need for others to agree with them that a certain player/manager/board member is shite just to prove that they were right and can say "I told you so." There are certain people on here who only ever complain. There's no point in naming them because we all know who they are. It's not the negativity that's the issue. It's the fact that it's all they ever do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milo Posted February 4, 2018 Report Share Posted February 4, 2018 All things being equal, nobody was offside for Mains goal, really bad decision, and Aldreds header that ricocheted of Ciftci was so unlucky. The offside decision in particular has cost us the win! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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