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Andy_P

The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

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20 minutes ago, Welldaft Mk1 said:

Although I assume we cannot buy players contracted in England and likewise they cannot buy contracted players up here after the 9th August ? 

If I'm right, we can still sign players from down south as we can register them up here until 31 Aug.

Clubs down south are still able to sell, they just cant register players of their own after 9 Aug.

 

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8 minutes ago, Mintymac said:

Anybody any ideas who Kipres replacement is likely to be . Imagine it will be like for like . Don’t think we’ve a ready made replacement at this moment in time coming through . 

No idea but as you say likely to be like for like.  We need someone different to what we have to achieve abalance. Maybe a young guy with height and physique and possibly pace?  Dunne apart we lack pace at the back and although Hartley and McHugh are decent defenders they aren't a dominant centre back in the way Cedric was. 

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Thought that was great piece of business by the club re Kipre . As we got him for £0 Leicester get nowt on sell on fees. He was great entertainment but the hype surrounding him was greatly over egged . Over the last 50 years I’ve seen much better players than him in that position . He was ok and a thoroughly decent person and helped promote the club  and giving us a higher profile but  that’s about it . Having said that good luck to the big man . Definitely got potential and could be right good player over time but for us at this point in his development and from a selfish point of view great piece of business . Well done to all from his recruitment to sale . 

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8 minutes ago, Kmac said:

I don’t see one point as negating the other.

im more focussed on this summer’s dealings. Im neither Rose or Grimshaws biggest fans though they can both be useful players. 

I’m more focused on this summer.

as said, was there a need to bring in Sammon and Johnson rather than 1 striker of quality?

was there a need to bring in Gorrin without offloading a midfielder? Surely again brining in 1 notable midfielder whilst offloading 1 should’ve been the route to go?

I’m sure the club are trying to punt Bigi …… problem is you need someone to take him and he’s got year left on his contract but SR obviously ain’t going to play him

As for “striker of quality” yea they grow on trees …… could you name one at the price and wages we could afford 

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16 minutes ago, Kmac said:

I don’t see one point as negating the other.

im more focussed on this summer’s dealings. Im neither Rose or Grimshaws biggest fans though they can both be useful players. 

I’m more focused on this summer.

as said, was there a need to bring in Sammon and Johnson rather than 1 striker of quality?

was there a need to bring in Gorrin without offloading a midfielder? Surely again brining in 1 notable midfielder whilst offloading 1 should’ve been the route to go?

I’m there could’ve been options in either Scotland or England or further afield with a number of senior games under their belts at a good level who could’ve been sold for profit further down the line, too?

i’ve no issue with us selling players, what Issue with is our planning and strategy.

On your point regarding strikers, who’s to say at this point that Johnson isn’t the ‘striker of quality’ you’re looking for. His record is comparable to Moult’s before he signed for us and you still seem to be sore about us selling him...

The Sammon signing seemed strange to me but I can only assume he was available at a relatively low cost and at worst he is definitely better cover than what we had last season.

 

The number of midfielders does seem strange at the moment but there’s still time for any / all or Bigi, Cadden and Campbell to be off... the meltdown on here would be incredible were that to happen, even with weeks left before our transfer deadline.

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11 minutes ago, wellwell91 said:

I’m sure the club are trying to punt Bigi …… problem is you need someone to take him and he’s got year left on his contract but SR obviously ain’t going to play him

As for “striker of quality” yea they grow on trees …… could you name one at the price and wages we could afford 

There are people at the club paid for that...

im not discussing which player, more the strategy of signings and the playing squad

 

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3 minutes ago, Kmac said:

There are people at the club paid for that...

Luckily, no-one on here ever second guesses those people, let alone questions their ability. :ph34r:

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I hope Cadden can get his move this month, think it would be mutually beneficial to both club and player. The early closure of English window could prove to be a real hinderence though.  Maybe Rangers or Celtic will come calling late August...

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It’s been evident for years that even just one player of genuine quality when they find form by playing regularly at a provincial club it can have a huge impact. Mulumbo at Killie last season for instance. 

Personally I’d swap Sammon, Johnson and Newell for a Tony Watt, O’Halloran, Greg Stewart or Stokes kind of signing. 

Sure I remember Lasley actually being quoted in the past recalling the McCall and McGhee teams that he thought it raised his own game and others around him when they knew playing with likes of Ross McCormack or Chris Porter that if you created a chance they’d be likely to stick it away. 

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2 minutes ago, Kmac said:

There are people at the club paid for that...

im not discussing which player, more the strategy of signings and the playing squad

 

Your right and they came up with Salmon .... same guys who came up with Moult Johnston Kipri Dunne Hartly and Aldred 

He has played in Premiership with Killie Hearts and Partick also in English Championship and has Irish international caps

Some may not rate him but we are obviously only paying a fraction of the wages we would have to pay for someone with that CV 

Can’t have it all ways 

 

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I'd have expected a bit more for kipre given he'd recently signed an extension. I was thinking we'd be flirting with a record fee, maybe in the region of £1.5M plus sell on clause.

But looking at the bigger picture, we took a punt a year ago, and sold him for reportedly £1M with sell on. I'll take that every season thank you.

Big jersey to fill but i'd love to see Maguire stake a claim for Cedric's spot.

I suspect we may lose another player before the end of the month too.

And best of luck to Kipre! Love the big man.

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My concern is we don't seem willing to give youth a chance. Hopefully that will change but not while Robbo is in charge. And no that is not me wanting rid of him as I really like him but the style of play is brutal to watch

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1 hour ago, gee said:

It’s been evident for years that even just one player of genuine quality when they find form by playing regularly at a provincial club it can have a huge impact. Mulumbo at Killie last season for instance. 

Personally I’d swap Sammon, Johnson and Newell for a Tony Watt, O’Halloran, Greg Stewart or Stokes kind of signing. 

Sure I remember Lasley actually being quoted in the past recalling the McCall and McGhee teams that he thought it raised his own game and others around him when they knew playing with likes of Ross McCormack or Chris Porter that if you created a chance they’d be likely to stick it away. 

It is a good debate. But we suffered with lack of squad depth last December and with limited budget I can understand Robinson looking for quantity rather than one key signing. You also have the issue of wages. I would have liked O’Halloran to have joined but he was reportedly on £5000+ a week at Rangers. And who is to say that Sammon won’t be as successful as Tony Watt at St Johnstone. It has only been a few weeks but so far I think Sammon has looked a shrewd signing and probably for very little outlay. 

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Why is Tony Watt a better prospect than Sammon? He’s done nothing for years. Having watched him frequently let games pass him by and be frustrated by his laissez faire attitude, I’d take an inexpensive grafting Sammon every time.

Also, what’s the evidence to suggest, SR doesn’t want to develop the youth?

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4 hours ago, Kmac said:

Many ways do so.

One option would have been to place emphasis on strengthening the squad this summer through the promotion of youth ie. turbull, Maguire, Scott etc. Rather than adding to what has become. A bloated midfield for example, whilst utilising other assets we have in the squad, ie. Bigirmana. None of those mentioned have had a look in on the cup games and I’m doubtful they will for the ucpcoming league matches. 

‘Subsequently, you can argue that this would have allowed a differening of budget prioritisation ie. bringing in 1 striker of note rather than a journeyman SPL striker and a non league - I’m sure combining two salaries to one could’ve allowed us to bring in very decent quality with Main, Bowman and Scott and the ever injured Newell and a returning Tanner all in the mix and I’d argue, same strategy for midfield.

 

 

If anyone reads my posts from last season, it's obvious I'm in the "want to play more football camp".

I'm also a realist, however, and understand it takes a few seasons to build a team.

When Robinson took over, he had a mandate that included:

- do not get relegated

- get rid of the high earners

- fix a defence that was leaking like Donald Trump's Whitehouse

There's no doubt that he achieved all 3 of those. He also said he wanted to add pace and bulk to the defence. Again, something he achieved. 

The 2 Cup Finals were a bonus, and it was a smart piece of business to bring in transfer fee for Moult when he was available on a pre-contract for zilch.

On top of all that, Alan Campbell became a first team regular, as did Kipré (who went on to make us a small wad of cash), and Cadden picked up a couple of international caps. 

The pitch contines to be the best in the league, and we have even replaced the old scoreboard.

All of this being achieved while the club transitioned to full ownership by the Well Society. 

We definitely lacked depth last season. (I was at the Accies and Dundee games in December, so had first hand experience of how dire we were). For a club our size, that lack of depth could just as easily have put us in relegation trouble as miss out on a top 6 spot. Fortunately, it was the latter. So I completely understand the desire to add numbers.

None of this prevents us from blooding youngsters this season - although, it's easy to forget just how young our squad is already. 

For me, it's far too soon to be making a final judegement on the quality of the players we have brought in. As I endlessly point out to the moaners, Dunne was a target of the experts this time last season and now they are all miserable because he is out for a few weeks. Johnson might be the natural finisher we need, and Rodriguez-Gorrin might be the first step towards having someone who can put their foot on the ball. I'm certainly prepared to wait and see.

I still want us to be moving towards playing a more attractive style of football. That isn't an overnight process, though. When Wee Tommy was in charge we spent a few seasons parking the bus to make sure we avoioded relegation, before he was able to start bringing in better footballers and create a style that was winning us a Cup (and bulidng a team that wasn't too far away from a league title).  

Thistle and Dundee were the poster boys for bottom 6 "footballing" sides last season. One was relegated and one was nearly relegated. It's a difficult balance. And Dundee Utd were the poster boys for a recruitment model that many said we should follow. 

So I'm quite prepared to see how the first half of the season unfolds and re-assess the team and their progress after that. It's easy to forget that if Les hadn't stepped in and, not only provided a loan, but implemented a complete restructuring of the club, we might be talking about how we manage to avoid League One this season, and where we should play games after Fir Park was sold off.

Are we where I'd like us to be? No. Are we better off than when Robinson took over? Undoubtedly. 

Are we heading in the right direction this season? Bring it on, and let's find out.

 

 

 

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Are we due a development fee to Leicester or did they release him?

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FWIW, Wikipedia says he was released by Leicester.

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By all accounts, Aldred looks like hes in an unhappy situation at Bury. Apparently he's been in the U23's pre-season, fan forums suggest he's playing like a guy looking to get through games without getting injured. Fans clearly want rid.

With a year left in his contract, highly doubtful that we would see him back here but wow, how different things would feel if we pulled that off. 

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28 minutes ago, Gadgey said:

laissez faire

Great phrase

28 minutes ago, Gadgey said:

 

Also, what’s the evidence to suggest, SR doesn’t want to develop the youth?

 

This irks me a wee bit too, Cos he's not throwing a young guy in he's tagged like this

 

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With Dunne out short term, and Cedric gone, I'd like to see someone with a bit of pace brought in. As excellent as Aldred was, I see him as a more natural replacement for Hartley.

I'd also be happy to see Maguire get some more game time after his suspension.

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1 hour ago, CoF said:

By all accounts, Aldred looks like hes in an unhappy situation at Bury. Apparently he's been in the U23's pre-season, fan forums suggest he's playing like a guy looking to get through games without getting injured. Fans clearly want rid.

With a year left in his contract, highly doubtful that we would see him back here but wow, how different things would feel if we pulled that off. 

As it stands now I don’t see why he would not return to a club where he would be a starter and where he’s appreciated. He’s maybe not lightening fast be we know what we are getting and that’s a very solid and dependable centre half.

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14 hours ago, The African said:

I believe Hutchison matches it by reducing the debt rather than a cash payment. Not really in the spirit of his generous offer to make a payment which was not genuine, just to generate the debt reduction.

I wasn't exactly being serious. But it wasn't exactly any worse of some of the suggestions when everyone should know that some of the money goes to Hutchison, some goes to Boyle, some goes to 'running of the club' and some goes on a replacement.

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Robinson is in the papers saying we've no money for new players.

He also said Carson got a new contract which was news to me?

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54 minutes ago, steelboy said:

Robinson is in the papers saying we've no money for new players.

He also said Carson got a new contract which was news to me?

I know it’s came from the manager but how can we possibly have no money for new players. Why have we spent money on players like Liam Donnelly or even brought in Gorrin who I do think is a decent player. We desperately need a CB with pace especially with Dunne out, also I would hate for any of our other assests to leave now as I think we’d struggle because I don’t think we are going to be the same team as last year.

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1 minute ago, supermarv said:

I know it’s came from the manager but how can we possibly have no money for new players. Why have we spent money on players like Liam Donnelly or even brought in Gorrin who I do think is a decent player. We desperately need a CB with pace especially with Dunne out, also I would hate for any of our other assests to leave now as I think we’d struggle because I don’t think we are going to be the same team as last year.

We clearly have a good amount of money after the cup finals and transfer fees received, the club has simply decided it’s going to be used in other areas.

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