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2020/21 Transfer Discussion Thread

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On 7/3/2020 at 5:39 PM, supermarv said:

Dean Cornelius is a central midfielder and Cole Starts has been released you do realise that?

Has Cole Starrs been released too.8)

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1 hour ago, weeyin said:

I wonder where the flash car fits into the financial security plan.

(Not that I blame Hastie for his move. At that age, however, I'd be amazed if he considered anything other than his own lifestyle. I know I wouldn't be planning for my family's security at 19 or 20).

Most of these cars are just leased rather than purchased, they are not actually that expensive doing it that way. I’m pretty sure many of the big clubs have deals with the likes of Audi/BMW/Mercedes.

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1 hour ago, weeyin said:

I wonder where the flash car fits into the financial security plan.

 

If you are on 200 grand a year for four years you can probably afford to lease a nice motor as well as pay your parents' mortgage off. 

 

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7 minutes ago, steelboy said:

If you are on 200 grand a year for four years you can probably afford to lease a nice motor as well as pay your parents' mortgage off. 

 

If you have a higher than average income, the last thing you want to do is pay off a mortgage. It's one of the most efficient ways to leverage your money - although lots of people make that mistake when they come into some cash.

Far better to invest it for a return with an average higher percentage return than your mortgage APR.

Miles away from the point I was making, though. There may be 19 year olds out there who make job decisions based on some plan to support their family over the next 20 or 30 years, but I've never met any (and I include myself in that).

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This "wouldnt turn down a huge pay increase" stuff is a pretty poor argument when it comes to footballers like Hastie.

Fair enough if You are 29/30 and getting a big contract where You are offered 5 or 6 grand a week (or more)  more than Your current wage. That is likely to be the last big contract You get so you "set yourself up" in that scenario. A 19yo promising talent should be looking to develop his career, the money will then automatically follow.

Thats why I question if Hastie himself doesnt have the belief he has what it takes to play higher. Turnbull & Hastie both grew up together, 10 years in the same team from the age of 9. Turnbull knocks back what would have been a far more lucrative deal at Norwich for Celtic as he saw them as the perfect platform to move his career on, Hastie takes the first decent deal on the table knowing he will never in a million years actually play for Rangers and will spend 2-3 years on loan before getting released. 

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Footballers are no different no matter what stage of career development.

Differing agent approaches proved between Turnbull & Hastie circumstances.

 

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14 minutes ago, Shaka said:

This "wouldnt turn down a huge pay increase" stuff is a pretty poor argument when it comes to footballers like Hastie.

Fair enough if You are 29/30 and getting a big contract where You are offered 5 or 6 grand a week (or more)  more than Your current wage. That is likely to be the last big contract You get so you "set yourself up" in that scenario. A 19yo promising talent should be looking to develop his career, the money will then automatically follow.

Thats why I question if Hastie himself doesnt have the belief he has what it takes to play higher. Turnbull & Hastie both grew up together, 10 years in the same team from the age of 9. Turnbull knocks back what would have been a far more lucrative deal at Norwich for Celtic as he saw them as the perfect platform to move his career on, Hastie takes the first decent deal on the table knowing he will never in a million years actually play for Rangers and will spend 2-3 years on loan before getting released. 

I think Hastie probably realises he’s not, and never will be Turnbull standard, but then that applies to just about every Motherwell player over the last few years. Certainly in the four to five years I’ve been watching the club no one else is even close. So yes I think you are probably right so why not take the money, I would.

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58 minutes ago, Shaka said:

Hastie takes the first decent deal on the table knowing he will never in a million years actually play for Rangers and will spend 2-3 years on loan before getting released. 

Genuine question - how do you know that the deal that Rangers offered was the first decent deal on the table?

 

Another one - how do you know he didn't think he was good enough to break into the Rangers team in his first season? You could argue that he went there to do exactly that and should be commended for that level of ambition.

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Hastie has played a blinder, he gets the Rangers salary and gets to play for Motherwell, living the dream.

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1 hour ago, Shaka said:

A 19yo promising talent should be looking to develop his career, the money will then automatically follow.

This just doesn't make sense. He had developed his career to that point and the big money did automatically follow. I'm sure he was confident enough that he could break into the first team and further develop with better players around him/training facilities etc. 

A confident 19yr old would not move solely for the cash and there's no reason to suggest he wasn't confident going by what he had done in the previous months. He was probably overly confident if anything rather than showing a lack of belief. 

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3 hours ago, Shaka said:

This "wouldnt turn down a huge pay increase" stuff is a pretty poor argument when it comes to footballers like Hastie.

Fair enough if You are 29/30 and getting a big contract where You are offered 5 or 6 grand a week (or more)  more than Your current wage. That is likely to be the last big contract You get so you "set yourself up" in that scenario. A 19yo promising talent should be looking to develop his career, the money will then automatically follow.

Thats why I question if Hastie himself doesnt have the belief he has what it takes to play higher. Turnbull & Hastie both grew up together, 10 years in the same team from the age of 9. Turnbull knocks back what would have been a far more lucrative deal at Norwich for Celtic as he saw them as the perfect platform to move his career on, Hastie takes the first decent deal on the table knowing he will never in a million years actually play for Rangers and will spend 2-3 years on loan before getting released. 

Quite a few years ago I had the great pleasure of playing golf with Willie Pettigrew, it was the summer that Mark Reynolds was being touted for a £1m move to Rangers. I offered my opinion that Reynolds would be better staying at Fir Park for longer and gaining more experience and that a big money move would obviously follow, the great man's answer was that he could break his leg tomorrow and his career would be over and hat he should grab the money when it was available. At the time I was surprised, but the older I get the more I realise how sensible the argument was.

 

Oh, and I was so in awe of my hero, I could barely swing the club properly, 

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I'm not so sure it's Jake Hastie getting to the end of his contract and accepting a life changing offer from a bigger Club that continues to upset a minority. Or his outing as a fan of that Club or even celebrating joining them.  I suspect it's the fact  that the Club in question is Rangers that is the real issue. Otherwise why were these same folk not having a go at Darren Randolph, Michael Higdon, John Sutton, Mark Gillespie, (Chris Long?) and, going further back, Paul Lambert and Rab McKinnon? When they walked out we received £350/400k less than we got for Hastie. In other words, nothing. There are others. 

And , if youth is a factor,  how come McKinstry is hailed as a shining example of how good our youth development is when he elects to move to a bigger Club for £225k rather than staying with us to develop his footballing career? Also,  how come we celebrate our goalkeeper joining "his club"?  I suspect the answer is that not one of the players I listed left us to join either Rangers or Celtic.  Paul Slane anyone? Footballers of all ages have decisions to make throughout their career. Some will get it right, some less so.

Credit to Hastie for having the ambition and belief to give Rangers a go at such a young age. Even more credit for having the desire to come back to us on Loan when he had other, less demanding options north and south of the border. And credit to our Management team for bringing him back despite the objections of a few fans and the supposed upset caused by the manner of his original departure. Robinson clearly thinks Hastie can help us and I for one look forward to seeing him prove the doubters wrong. 

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55 minutes ago, dennyc said:

I'm not so sure it's Jake Hastie getting to the end of his contract and accepting a life changing offer from a bigger Club that continues to upset a minority. Or his outing as a fan of that Club or even celebrating joining them.  I suspect it's the fact  that the Club in question is Rangers that is the real issue. Otherwise why were these same folk not having a go at Darren Randolph, Michael Higdon, John Sutton, Mark Gillespie, (Chris Long?) and, going further back, Paul Lambert and Rab McKinnon? When they walked out we received £350/400k less than we got for Hastie. In other words, nothing. There are others. 

And , if youth is a factor,  how come McKinstry is hailed as a shining example of how good our youth development is when he elects to move to a bigger Club for £225k rather than staying with us to develop his footballing career? Also,  how come we celebrate our goalkeeper joining "his club"?  I suspect the answer is that not one of the players I listed left us to join either Rangers or Celtic.  Paul Slane anyone? Footballers of all ages have decisions to make throughout their career. Some will get it right, some less so.

Credit to Hastie for having the ambition and belief to give Rangers a go at such a young age. Even more credit for having the desire to come back to us on Loan when he had other, less demanding options north and south of the border. And credit to our Management team for bringing him back despite the objections of a few fans and the supposed upset caused by the manner of his original departure. Robinson clearly thinks Hastie can help us and I for one look forward to seeing him prove the doubters wrong. 

Brilliant post,  well put

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I think it’s a stretch to be mentioning ‘his outing as a fan of that club’

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9 hours ago, dennyc said:

I'm not so sure it's Jake Hastie getting to the end of his contract and accepting a life changing offer from a bigger Club that continues to upset a minority. Or his outing as a fan of that Club or even celebrating joining them.  I suspect it's the fact  that the Club in question is Rangers that is the real issue. Otherwise why were these same folk not having a go at Darren Randolph, Michael Higdon, John Sutton, Mark Gillespie, (Chris Long?) and, going further back, Paul Lambert and Rab McKinnon? When they walked out we received £350/400k less than we got for Hastie. In other words, nothing. There are others. 

And , if youth is a factor,  how come McKinstry is hailed as a shining example of how good our youth development is when he elects to move to a bigger Club for £225k rather than staying with us to develop his footballing career? Also,  how come we celebrate our goalkeeper joining "his club"?  I suspect the answer is that not one of the players I listed left us to join either Rangers or Celtic.  Paul Slane anyone? Footballers of all ages have decisions to make throughout their career. Some will get it right, some less so.

Credit to Hastie for having the ambition and belief to give Rangers a go at such a young age. Even more credit for having the desire to come back to us on Loan when he had other, less demanding options north and south of the border. And credit to our Management team for bringing him back despite the objections of a few fans and the supposed upset caused by the manner of his original departure. Robinson clearly thinks Hastie can help us and I for one look forward to seeing him prove the doubters wrong. 

The players you mention all went onto better leagues and teams. With the exception of John Sutton who went to Hearts a lot later in his career most likely getting a hefty bump in pay. He wasn’t a world beater and nobody could deny that he should take that move. McKinstry has went to a team that’s looked like promotion contenders each year to reach the English Premiership. So again, these are examples of players showing actual ambition. 
 

Thinking that joining Rangers in this day and age is “ambition”? I think that’s where you lose a lot of people. They aren’t what they once were. You’re playing (or not in Hastie’s case) in the same league as Motherwell. The anger would still be there if he went to Hibs or Hearts or Aberdeen. It’s about Rangers and Celtic buying emerging first team talent from the same league and benching them, stinting development. Yes responsibility of these decisions lay with the players as well as those clubs. But people are perfectly entitled to call out these practices. Yes, people are angry because it’s Rangers, that doesn’t make them a bigot like has been mentioned in the past by another poster. Or some angry, irrational fan. They are just sick of the way that the old firm will hoover up young talent from our league and bench or farm them out on loan. Fans are right to call out in my opinion. 
 

That being said I’m sure Jake will get more support as the league start nears. People are just desperate to see the team play. A signing like this was always going to split the fans initially, after 4-5 months of no football this situation has probably been amplified a bit more.  
 

He’ll still get the support of the majority of the fans that aren’t happy with the saga when he’s on the pitch. Hopefully he comes with the mindset of proving these people wrong. If he screws the head, we’ll have a player on our hands. 

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If Jake Hastie plays well and scores goals this season all will be forgotten. If he doesnt then the boo's will amplify and build. He really needs to hit the ground running. I wish him well.....

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10 hours ago, dennyc said:

I'm not so sure it's Jake Hastie getting to the end of his contract and accepting a life changing offer from a bigger Club that continues to upset a minority. Or his outing as a fan of that Club or even celebrating joining them.  I suspect it's the fact  that the Club in question is Rangers that is the real issue. Otherwise why were these same folk not having a go at Darren Randolph, Michael Higdon, John Sutton, Mark Gillespie, (Chris Long?) and, going further back, Paul Lambert and Rab McKinnon? When they walked out we received £350/400k less than we got for Hastie. In other words, nothing. There are others. 

And , if youth is a factor,  how come McKinstry is hailed as a shining example of how good our youth development is when he elects to move to a bigger Club for £225k rather than staying with us to develop his footballing career? Also,  how come we celebrate our goalkeeper joining "his club"?  I suspect the answer is that not one of the players I listed left us to join either Rangers or Celtic.  Paul Slane anyone? Footballers of all ages have decisions to make throughout their career. Some will get it right, some less so.

Credit to Hastie for having the ambition and belief to give Rangers a go at such a young age. Even more credit for having the desire to come back to us on Loan when he had other, less demanding options north and south of the border. And credit to our Management team for bringing him back despite the objections of a few fans and the supposed upset caused by the manner of his original departure. Robinson clearly thinks Hastie can help us and I for one look forward to seeing him prove the doubters wrong. 

Brilliant post!

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16 hours ago, Shaka said:

This "wouldnt turn down a huge pay increase" stuff is a pretty poor argument when it comes to footballers like Hastie.

Fair enough if You are 29/30 and getting a big contract where You are offered 5 or 6 grand a week (or more)  more than Your current wage. That is likely to be the last big contract You get so you "set yourself up" in that scenario. A 19yo promising talent should be looking to develop his career, the money will then automatically follow.

Thats why I question if Hastie himself doesnt have the belief he has what it takes to play higher. Turnbull & Hastie both grew up together, 10 years in the same team from the age of 9. Turnbull knocks back what would have been a far more lucrative deal at Norwich for Celtic as he saw them as the perfect platform to move his career on, Hastie takes the first decent deal on the table knowing he will never in a million years actually play for Rangers and will spend 2-3 years on loan before getting released. 

Turnbull is actually a good example.

His "big move" to Celtic was derailed due to a knee issue. Now, what would have happened if that knee issue was more serious? 

In fact, and I really hope this isn't the case, imagine Turnbull returns this season only to break down for whatever reason, and he never hits the heights expected of him? Do you think Celtic will still want him? 

Not a chance. That life-changing money is gone in a flash.

Let's take it even further. His knee continues giving him grief and he never gets back into a groove for us, and eventually drops out of our team. When the time comes and he's quietly released, do you think the fans who bemoan a player leaving too early will give a toss? Of course not. We're more concerned with the next Turnbull, or the new striker we've signed.

Turnbull will just be another ex-player who is a "what if?" discussed in pre-match pub chit chat.

Players "owe" the club and the fans nothing. It's only ever the good players that are called on for loyalty and "giving back," isn't it? If he was shit we wouldn't be bothered.

Hastie was right to take the stupid deal Rangers offered him. He's most likely never going to be better than he was during that purple patch he had for us, so he's right to cash in on it.

He could easily go out against Ross County for us and go down with a career-altering injury. 

You take the money when it's available. Strike while the iron is hot, so to speak.

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1 hour ago, uberbernie said:

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-transfer-news/callum-lang-eye-motherwell-permanent-22307438

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hd1LelpFPjc&t=71s

 

I know its just youtube highlights (anyone can be made to look amazing), but he looks awesome

 

this would be exciting if we could get him permanent  

Suggestion on P & B that we could come to some arrangement with Wigan over Kipre's sell onfee  if thats possible. Seems a sensible suggestion. 

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1 hour ago, Kmcalpin said:

Suggestion on P & B that we could come to some arrangement with Wigan over Kipre's sell onfee  if thats possible. Seems a sensible suggestion. 

Surely we risk losing a lot of money then if we sacrifice the sell on fee?.  

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Surely we risk losing a lot of money then if we sacrifice the sell on fee?.  

Wigan are wanting 300k for Lang and could be selling kipre for just a million to West Ham.So we would be owed 200k by Wigan


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13 minutes ago, Ross said:


Wigan are wanting 300k for Lang and could be selling kipre for just a million to West Ham.So we would be owed 200k by Wigan


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If that deal went through I just feel we could do more with the £200k but again if Lang proves to be a good signing then I wont complain 

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