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Great Balls of Shire

Fans back into stadiums

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3 minutes ago, weeyin said:

The club has guaranteed a full season of games for everyone who bought a season ticket.

And free access to all home game streams while fans aren't allowed in.

So nobody is losing out as far as I can tell.

Personally, if I had a season ticket I'd rather be able to use it when 100% crowds are allowed in rather than a few hundred, but that might change if the ban last too long.

That's fine and all and your personal preference is entirely down to you but the main issue is still that people have paid for entry but wouldn't be getting in despite a lifting of a supporter ban.

OK, it's very much a hypothetical question as I don't see restrictions being lifted in Lanarkshire for a while but I just wonder what people would feel about that.

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As most of the season ticket holders are Well Society members, I'm sure they could press the issue if it ever happened. Then you would need a fair system to select who gets in, of course. How many from a family, any age restrictions to protect the elderly fans etc.

I'd prefer the club didn't intentionally go out of their way to lose money in these circumstances, but if the majority decide that is what they want to do, then so be it.

And I say all of this as someone who has been 100% in favour of opening grounds as soon as possible. I just don't think it makes sense for clubs like ours until the numbers involved can be larger.

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There is no chance of any fans during the winter in the top division. This is just football being used for PR again by the Scottish Government.

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6 minutes ago, steelboy said:

There is no chance of any fans during the winter in the top division. This is just football being used for PR again by the Scottish Government.

Are you sure  it's not just you attempting to mix some fairly transparent clickbait and the re-classification of the Covid-threat levels to fit your pre-determined view that everything the Scottish Government does is with a view to entice people to vote for them in an election six months away?

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26 minutes ago, Andy_P said:

Are you sure  it's not just you attempting to mix some fairly transparent clickbait and the re-classification of the Covid-threat levels to fit your pre-determined view that everything the Scottish Government does is with a view to entice people to vote for them in an election six months away?

If it’s not about votes, why is the government bothering to make special arrangements for football? 

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It's clearly just an attempt to make some positive headlines during a week when most people are waking up to exactly how shite this winter is going to be. 

Anyone who believes that the SG is seriously considering letting fans into games was probably expecting pubs and restaurants only to be shut for a 'two week circuit breaker'. 

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I feel I may have earned the right to a view on this.

As far as I can see the government can do no right here. For many its draconian and for others it is too little too late. Issue is with social media is everyone has a voice it just tends to be the biggest roasters who post the most and shout the loudest ...... I shall refrain from pointing any fingers. I'll hold my hands up and say if I wasn't affected I would have had a healthy feeling of invulnerability and arrogance. Since I have been affected much more than most I have a cautious respect for the virus and what can develop.

It comes back to the selfishness of many those lifestyles have been eroded and their intolerance to inconvenience. I can only imagine this is fuelled by:

  • a) I'm young so it won't hit me as bad as it would a granny
  • b) hubris and perceived personal fatigue of adhering to a few basic requests
  • c) some bullshit and misplaced rant how they are looking out for hospitality workers and the economy
  • d) citing personal freedom and a nefarious government plot or
  • e) itching for their hole.

Now the debate seems to be tailored local shutdowns over a blanket UK wide one. It's fuelled by whataboutery .... "why can I go to a bank and stand in a queue, go shopping in a supermarket but not have a drink in a pub with music on?", "Why can someone in London can go for a pint and go back to a friends house with 5 pals from 5 other houses?". I even seen it on here on Saturday where people assumed its Grimmy as Barnsley is tier three and he must of got days off in the past month. Lets ignore that Glasgow and Lanarkshire are as contagious as any of the worst pants anywhere else in the UK at present.

There are reasons for all of this not fuelled by conspiracy theories or megalomaniac devious political leaders. It is devised by public health experts, immunologists, virologists, NHS logisticians, other medial professionals, statisticians and of course politicians as they ultimately issue and direct enforcement of policy.

When this hit if we limited people visiting the UK and only allowed residents or nationals to return, tested them in the airport and ports upon arrival and sent them home under quarantine then this would be mitigated and we wouldn't have one of the worst statistics in the world from preventable deaths. Localised measures are the way forward but only if people adhere to the rules and there's a high degree of "fuck it" just now. There was support and Dunkirk/Blitz spirit back in March through to May but that has dwindled. Evidence is how many OF fans travelled to Fife or over into Cumbria/Lancashire. The amount who gave it serious thought or planned it shows where we are.

Our society went through a change in the 80's due to Thatcherism where the self and a notion of as long as I'm OK, to hell with everyone else seeped into wide British society. Community cohesion and compassion eroded, Christ even empathy did too. We are predominately a more socially minded country than down south but as a whole things changed here too just not to the same degree.

Flow said privately in July that they'd be nobody in FP before Ne'erday when there was soft talk about a mid September opening of grounds. Safe to say that has been an astute observation.

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4 hours ago, santheman said:

For fairness I think  it would have to be a case of all or nothing for letting fans back in.

It would be unfair, if for instance, Aberdeen got some fans back and the advantages that would bring and we didn’t simply because of our geographical location

Aberdeen shouldn't be punished because covid is high in NLC

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1 hour ago, Stuwell2 said:

If it’s not about votes, why is the government bothering to make special arrangements for football? 

Were it genuinely the case the Scottish Government were seeking to covet the votes of football supporters in Scotland they could have followed the line adopted in several other European countries weeks ago and opened stadia in an even restricted form. That they haven't and for the last three months have left themselves open to criticism by fans, pundits, club representatives and whoever else wants to have a pop, justified or otherwise, does not suggest to me these actions are taken with vote winning in mind.

And you'll be aware that rugby is in  exactly the same situation with both Glasgow and Edinburgh playing behind closed doors as indeed did Scotland when they hosted Georgia on Friday evening.

For me forthcoming discussions in the immediate future with the footballing and rugby authorities are sensible to have. There has been a re-classification of the Covid arrangements announced,  UEFA I believed changed their guidelines  in terms of fans attending shortly before the last set of internationals and there further games to come next month as well as the ongoing European ties.  There are Scotland rugby internationals in November and December too.  Clubs are feeling the lack of fans.  It makes perfect sense to reconvene to discuss how the land is lying and what the situation is for everyone around the table.

 I have not seen anyone with the authority to make it happen however quoted or even infer that the opening of stadiums is imminent. It's clickbait pure and simple, which given and given as steelboy suggests, is almost certainly not going to happen, is only likely to have the effect of whipping up more of a frenzy by whose who believe they are being hard done by. A cynic might suggest that is ultimately the point of such pieces.

But football fans who I continually read already perceive themselves to be second class citizens, who have been denied access to stadiums, who having been given a chink of light by "a source" in the Daily Record, that they might return have their hopes dashed by the Scottish Government - and that's supposed to be them trying to win votes?  I don't buy it.

 

 

 

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17 hours ago, Goggles & Flippers said:

When this hit if we limited people visiting the UK and only allowed residents or nationals to return, tested them in the airport and ports upon arrival and sent them home under quarantine then this would be mitigated and we wouldn't have one of the worst statistics in the world from preventable deaths. Localised measures are the way forward but only if people adhere to the rules and there's a high degree of "fuck it" just now. There was support and Dunkirk/Blitz spirit back in March through to May but that has dwindled. Evidence is how many OF fans travelled to Fife or over into Cumbria/Lancashire. The amount who gave it serious thought or planned it shows where we are.

Our society went through a change in the 80's due to Thatcherism where the self and a notion of as long as I'm OK, to hell with everyone else seeped into wide British society. Community cohesion and compassion eroded, Christ even empathy did too. We are predominately a more socially minded country than down south but as a whole things changed here too just not to the same degree.

Good post Goggles.  I think many, possibly even most, folk have breached the Covid 19 guidelines in some way. Mostly in a very minor way though.  However as you say a "significant minority" are simply not prepared to do so ie large scale house parties, refusal to wear face coverings, refusal to self isolate or quarantine. Surprisingly, its sometimes those you'd least expect  to breach guidelines or be irresponsible. Its costing all of us especially the elderly and vulnerable. I don't doubt that a significant proportion of infections are down to selfishness, although financial considerations do come into it to some extent.  Not being Political but you're right about Thatcherism and you've been able to see evidence on these very fora for some years now - "I'm all right Jack" & "Whats in it for me?" That said these fora have also shown the best in our society from time to time.  I can't see fans back in grounds for months to come maybe even until next season. We all need hope though to pull us through.    

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On 10/27/2020 at 5:26 PM, Andy_P said:

Were it genuinely the case the Scottish Government were seeking to covet the votes of football supporters in Scotland they could have followed the line adopted in several other European countries weeks ago and opened stadia in an even restricted form. That they haven't and for the last three months have left themselves open to criticism by fans, pundits, club representatives and whoever else wants to have a pop, justified or otherwise, does not suggest to me these actions are taken with vote winning in mind.

And you'll be aware that rugby is in  exactly the same situation with both Glasgow and Edinburgh playing behind closed doors as indeed did Scotland when they hosted Georgia on Friday evening.

For me forthcoming discussions in the immediate future with the footballing and rugby authorities are sensible to have. There has been a re-classification of the Covid arrangements announced,  UEFA I believed changed their guidelines  in terms of fans attending shortly before the last set of internationals and there further games to come next month as well as the ongoing European ties.  There are Scotland rugby internationals in November and December too.  Clubs are feeling the lack of fans.  It makes perfect sense to reconvene to discuss how the land is lying and what the situation is for everyone around the table.

 I have not seen anyone with the authority to make it happen however quoted or even infer that the opening of stadiums is imminent. It's clickbait pure and simple, which given and given as steelboy suggests, is almost certainly not going to happen, is only likely to have the effect of whipping up more of a frenzy by whose who believe they are being hard done by. A cynic might suggest that is ultimately the point of such pieces.

But football fans who I continually read already perceive themselves to be second class citizens, who have been denied access to stadiums, who having been given a chink of light by "a source" in the Daily Record, that they might return have their hopes dashed by the Scottish Government - and that's supposed to be them trying to win votes?  I don't buy it.

 

 

 

I don’t think any politician does anything without some focus group examining the effect on votes so I stick by my point. 

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Politicians have looked down on football fans for as long as I can remember. In the last 50 years I can't think of more than a handful of them that were real fans of the game. As as a result, football has often been the whipping boy for their agendas and an easy scapegoat for societal issues.

That's one reason they reacted the way they did to Marcus Rashford's campaign.

 

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For me there is a huge difference between Celtic Park and Mosset park here in moray. Fir park and most grounds we play at prob fall into the grey area. With infection where they are in the highlands no reason not to have fans in highland and lower league grounds could limit them like down in England to stop large numbers going. You could also have some fans at lowland league grounds in certain areas (would need to know more about local situation in all localities than I do).

we have treated everywhere with the same broad brush and the talk of fans especially in the old firm or no where seems very strange. All the highland league games I have been to was social distancing before I knew it was a thing add in face masks and some protection for the elderly like early entry and late exit would be completely doable IMO.

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