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Andy_P

Season 2020’21: Game 30: St Mirren (A)

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What would have been the outcome of this whole sorry affair if the two clubs involved weren't Motherwell and Hamilton but Celtic and Rangers!

Oh, that's right there wouldn't have been an appeal in the first place!

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11 hours ago, Stu92 said:

The SPFL (via independent panel) gave the decision in our favour. It was the SFA that overturned it.

I’m not sure how much ‘blame’ can be aimed at the SPFL here.

I'm with you up to a point. The SPFL could have handled the situation better in that it should not have awarded the 6 points originally, until the issue was cut and dried and could have dealt with matters more quickly. However, it is clearly surprised by the SFA's panel completely overturning the decision. The reasoning set out by the original panel was very comprehensive and wide ranging and it will be interesting how the appeal panel dismissed and rebutted these arguments. 

This episode casts Scottish football, and in particular the SFA in a poor light and no doubt the Scottish Government will have been monitoring developments. Football has just shot itself in the  foot. 

Although this whole episode leaves a bitter taste in our mouth, and will not be forgotten for many years,  we now have to move on and focus ruthlessly on winning points.    

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49 minutes ago, El Grew said:

What would have been the outcome of this whole sorry affair if the two clubs involved weren't Motherwell and Hamilton but Celtic and Rangers!

Oh, that's right there wouldn't have been an appeal in the first place!

Absolutely. And they would’ve been happy to get away with just a 3-0 defeat with no suspensions or injuries into the bargain.

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13 hours ago, Squirrelhumper said:

Find some of the comments on this thread laughable.

We were told by NHS Ayrshire and Arran that our full squad had to isolate, we had no choice whether to play the game or not. We literally had no players. 

The decision to make the full squad isolate was a health board decision, and we've seen this vary across the country. 

The decision was always going to be overturned as it was a laughable decision in the first place.

How many 3-0 defeats have been handed out in England for same reason this season? None.

I understand why you would be annoyed at losing out on an easy 6 pts but fuck me, the original penalty was farcical.

Every club will have had minor covid breaches. Was only a few months ago Motherwell directors weren't paying any attention whatsoever to COVID rules in Coleraine. 

If anyone thinks Motherwell should be awarded 6 pts and 6 goals for this then they need to have a word with themselves. 

 

Unfortunately our fans, as well as most others, tend to be partisan towards their own clubs interests and see things through a rather warped prism.

If the roles were reversed most of the folk in here would be doing full 180s.

Ultimately the correct decision has been made and the SFA has proven it's self far more competent than the catastrophically inept ghouls running the SPFL.

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28 minutes ago, Ya Bezzer! said:

Unfortunately our fans, as well as most others, tend to be partisan towards their own clubs interests and see things through a rather warped prism.

If the roles were reversed most of the folk in here would be doing full 180s.

Ultimately the correct decision has been made and the SFA has proven it's self far more competent than the catastrophically inept ghouls running the SPFL.

While I agree all fans will look out for their own clubs self interests (Mr Squirrelhumper has already been on here before defending the keech plastic pitch to the hilt), most 'Well fans did seem to agree the punishment was quite harsh initially that was of course until all the reasoning came to light. It's not as if they were unfortunate and suffered a general covid-19 outbreak, they broke the rules that were set out while other clubs are putting in place stringent measures and they ended up paying for it. Hopefully we pump them in both the games, it's just laughable that they are convinced that they have been wronged. 

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1 hour ago, Ya Bezzer! said:

Ultimately the correct decision has been made and the SFA has proven it's self far more competent than the catastrophically inept ghouls running the SPFL.

Forget about motherwell and 6 points. Do you really think the punishment fits the crime?

The season was given the go ahead to kick off under conditions that covid protocols were followed by all clubs and killie and st mirren failed to do so, caused an outbreak and affected the fixture schedule. And this is ok - just a slap on the wrist? Really?

For me, 3 months ago, they should have been given a heavy fine and rearranged the matches. Now though, with a lot less of a window to reschedule games, the weather affecting "all weather" pitches, the lower leagues postponed, the entire country on lockdown, celtic doing their best to null and void the season and most importantly covid still looming (which could bite anyone in the ass at any moment), I just cannot fathom the logic of this outcome.

This bizarre notion that killie and st mirren should be "happy" with the punishment is laughable. Its not a punishment otherwise, and cant believe they've not only got away with it but had their fines reduced. You literally couldn't fucking write it!

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6 minutes ago, mfc88 said:

Do you really think the punishment fits the crime?

Perhaps you ought to look around the whole of Europe and across all sports and ask yourself the same question.

 

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In my opinion to stop any team gaining an advantage, the ruling should have been that the games be played but all teams can only select players that were available at that time ie anyone injured, suspended or positive should not be eligible to play and if the fixtures are not played due to the season being cut short then the points are awarded to Motherwell. 

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2 minutes ago, Stuwell2 said:

In my opinion to stop any team gaining an advantage, the ruling should have been that the games be played but all teams can only select players that were available at that time ie anyone injured, suspended or positive should not be eligible to play and if the fixtures are not played due to the season being cut short then the points are awarded to Motherwell. 

That's a non starter

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1 minute ago, Ya Bezzer! said:

Perhaps you ought to look around the whole of Europe and across all sports and ask yourself the same question.

 

Why? What has other sports or other countries got to do with it? 

Personally, I don't want to see the SFA copy what other sports or countries are doing, I want to see them demonstrate proper leadership and show that they take the covid situation in this country seriously. They haven't done that IMO.

I agree with you that the 3 pts shouldn't have been awarded in the first place, rather a heavy, non-suspended fine would have been more appropriateat the time. But what has resulted, a 10k fine is pathetic and an insult to everyone working their asses off in hospitals, pharmacies, care homes etc to get the country through this.

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Self preservation is always a fans first thought. The SPFL handled this appallingly, by first awarding us the points then removing them on appeal. However, both Killie and St Mirren admitted to breaking Covid rules and I would be interested to read what the official rules are with regard to teams not fulfilling games. I know we are in the middle of a global pandemic, but unless the existing rules are changed before the competition starts then surely the pre existing rules should stand. If those state that 3 points and a 3-0 score line is the sanction then clubs should accept their punishment. Even though given the current circumstances it may seem harsh.  

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Probably a non starter but you do wonder if the SPFL would still have the power to say play the 2 games but as has been mentioned on here and by myself previously - to not allow players who were unable to play 1st time around. 

Otherwise they have played a blinder here. I have little sympathy (ever) for Celtic but they are playing 2 games with 13 players missing and no recognised striker for similar. 

Simply playing the games is almost rewarding the two teams who messed up. 

 

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Another perfectly feasible and just solution would be to suspend the players who breached the protocol.

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59 minutes ago, Kmcalpin said:

Another perfectly feasible and just solution would be to suspend the players who breached the protocol.

Its not feasible in the slightest 

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1 hour ago, Kmcalpin said:

Another perfectly feasible and just solution would be to suspend the players who breached the protocol.

Problem is, they don't want to be seen to punish a player who has/had a potentially life threatening illness. My work, I get hit by an elephant falling out the sky, it's an absence. Get covid, it's not.

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1 hour ago, Welldaft Mk1 said:

Probably a non starter but you do wonder if the SPFL would still have the power to say play the 2 games but as has been mentioned on here and by myself previously - to not allow players who were unable to play 1st time around. 

Otherwise they have played a blinder here. I have little sympathy (ever) for Celtic but they are playing 2 games with 13 players missing and no recognised striker for similar. 

Simply playing the games is almost rewarding the two teams who messed up. 

 

Spot on re Celtic. Bizarre situation when it would have been better for Celtic if Jullien had been a close contact of MORE players! That way they could have said they can’t fulfil the fixtures (both of which they have failed to win), take the 10k fine and play the games later in the season with a full team. 

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Just now, couttsy said:

Spot on re Celtic. Bizarre situation when it would have been better for Celtic if Jullien had been a close contact of MORE players! That way they could have said they can’t fulfil the fixtures (both of which they have failed to win), take the 10k fine and play the games later in the season with a full team. 

Also, we should deffo be noisily demanding one of these games (Killie or Saints) is played at the end of the month in the free Scottish Cup slot. Not a chance we should have a free weekend whilst  Killie and Saints are allowed to pull games forward before these outstanding games are played.

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We will just have to get the finger out and win these games.

SFA have now set a precedence that teams can just call off games and receive a minimal fine.

This is playing into Celtic’s hands as they have had to play two games with a weakened side but St•Midden and Killie got to postpone games with next to no punishment.

SFA are a joke

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9 hours ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

As has been said further up, you can't ban a player because he previously had a serious illness 

100% agree. That would be irrelevant though. You can however ban players who breached protocols, as has already been done. 

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We could have Lennon as our gaffer, choice quotes in bold, he's gone full tinfoil helmet/bottles of piss ......

Quote

Neil Lennon has railed against a "barrage of absolute hypocrisy" following Celtic's trip to Dubai.

Manager Lennon and 13 players missed two games after a positive Covid-19 test and now a further player has returned a positive test.

Celtic drew both of their matches while depleted and are 21 points behind Scottish Premiership leaders Rangers.

"We've been held to a far higher standard than any other club," Lennon said.

"Protocols at different clubs are inconsistent. As soon as Celtic are deemed to do something wrong, bang, you're all wanting blood, it's absolutely scandalous. The fallout from this has been way too much.

"Aston Villa have shut down, Raith Rovers. They haven't travelled anywhere. We could easily have stayed here and had an outbreak, but because our protocols are so good, we've been able to quell that."

Chief executive Peter Lawwell last week apologised to supporters and said the trip was a "mistake", but Lennon says the apology should have come from him.

"My apology is to the fans because 13 players and three staff had to isolate for 10 days, which is ludicrous," said Lennon, who will return to the dugout when Celtic face hosts Livingston on Wednesday.

"I'm not apologising for anything else. I'm not apologising for going out there and training for a week. Hindsight's a wonderful thing. We did everything we possibly could to avoid the damage.

"The whole squad is negative bar two players. I think that is remarkable and I think it totally blows out of the water the way the training camp has been portrayed by certain quarters of the media, by certain pundits and by certain government officials as well.

"We did not abuse any privilege, we did the right things. We were absolutely totally professional. We had a little drink in the afternoon on a day off, completely allowed, no law breaking - yet we come back to this barrage of absolute hypocrisy.

"We've come back, we've been absolutely decimated by these rules. It seems political."

After Wednesday's match, defending champions Celtic will still have two league games in hand.

 

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On 1/17/2021 at 12:54 AM, 0Neils40yarder said:

As has been said further up, you can't ban a player because he previously had a serious illness 

The vast majority of them didn't have any illness. 

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10th and 24th of Feb for the rearranged Killie and St Mirren games.

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