January Transfer Window

[nethertonwellfan]

The abuse McCart is receiving here is out of order.

 

He is doing his job, which sees him doing the best he can for Celtic - not Motherwell!

 

Most people on this thread appear to agree that they will be disappointed IF Slane moves on. Clearly Slane is one of our prized assets, and McCart would not be doing his job if he simply did not try to get the lad simply because it is Motherwell he is dealing with.

 

I would expect Motherwell to be screaming blue murder (or whatever that old saying is) if McCart or Celtic were doing anything remotely dodgy - and I take the apparent silence from Motherwell on this to speak for itself.

+1

[milo]

I'd say the apparent silence is more to do with the fact that Motherwell appear to be quite happy to let Celtic piss all over us time and time again.

[gullane]

Let's hope young, undecided Paul isn't reading this thread to help him make up his mind. Freedom of speech is one thing - personal abuse is another.

 

Hope you stay Paul. Fir Park offers a great platform to launch your career.

[Motherwell Seagull]

I'd say the apparent silence is more to do with the fact that Motherwell appear to be quite happy to let Celtic piss all over us time and time again.

 

It has sounded to me as if Motherwell have actually done a fair bit to let the lad know that he is very much wanted by the club (certainly since McGhee's departure anyway).

 

Am curious - what more do you think the club should, and could have done?

[MelvinBragg]

Let's hope young, undecided Paul isn't reading this thread to help him make up his mind. Freedom of speech is one thing - personal abuse is another.

 

Hope you stay Paul. Fir Park offers a great platform to launch your career.

My thoughts exactly. At no point has it been made clear that Slane wants to leave. Yet some people on here have hom tried, convicted and labelled. Couldn't blame him if he hread all the stuff on here and wanted to leave...

[postiejim]

I'd say the apparent silence is more to do with the fact that Motherwell appear to be quite happy to let Celtic piss all over us time and time again.

 

 

Your not wrong there Milo Celtic have been taking our players for years now, mostly for peanuts .

[Frazzie]

And Frazzle can say "TOLD YOU SO!!"

 

Not for the first time, and undoubtedly not the last!

 

I think you'll find I was the first to post about Gannon leaving aswell, so just consider this post a double TOLD YOU SO!!

 

Having said this, I fully expect to be shot down in flames the next time I post something folk don't like...

[Wellfan1984]

My thoughts exactly. At no point has it been made clear that Slane wants to leave. Yet some people on here have hom tried, convicted and labelled. Couldn't blame him if he hread all the stuff on here and wanted to leave...

 

If he doesn't expect talk like that - then he's been hiding for the last however long he's been in our Youth Teams. He's not the first nor the last player that will get the "IF" treatment. If the judgement of people on the football forum can sway his decision then he won't go far in this game, and will be downhearted before he hits 19 IF he signs for Celtic - before rotting on the bench....

[Frazzie]

I'd say the apparent silence is more to do with the fact that Motherwell appear to be quite happy to let Celtic piss all over us time and time again.

 

To be fair, there's nowt the club can do because he is still on a YTS contract and, I believe, has rejected a first-team deal because if he signs a pre-contract agreement, a tribunal sets the fee because of his age, and the tribunal will set the fee based on his current salary.

 

So, aye, Celtic are getting to steal a prospect for peanuts again but this time it is the fault of the system and the player/his dad.

[Lobey_Dosser]

To be fair, there's nowt the club can do because he is still on a YTS contract and, I believe, has rejected a first-team deal because if he signs a pre-contract agreement, a tribunal sets the fee because of his age, and the tribunal will set the fee based on his current salary.

 

So, aye, Celtic are getting to steal a prospect for peanuts again but this time it is the fault of the system and the player/his dad.

 

Will we be entitled to some sort of development fee when Celtic sell him onto a diddy English team?

[Wellfan1984]

Will we be entitled to some sort of development fee when Celtic sell him onto a diddy English team?

 

Yes. More if he leaves before he's 23, less if it is after.

[Steve Diggle]

Like I said earlier - I think the bulk of the strong staements have been qualified with an if.

 

And it's hopefully still a big if.

 

However lets look at the innocent party in all of this if it comes to pass and that's Celtic Football Club.

 

If this comes to pass they will be showing all of Scottish Football that all that money they've spent on Lennoxtown has come to fruition.

 

Their head of youth development will be showing he is doing a grand job of bringing youth players through the ranks there.

 

No wonder thay want to piss off to England having burnt all those resources developing all that talent and not having any real competition from the diddy teams in the SPL hanging on to their coat tails.

[MelvinBragg]

I think you'll find I was the first to post about Gannon leaving aswell, so just consider this post a double TOLD YOU SO!!

Did I not tell you about Gannon leaving?? Does that make me a source??

[milo]

However lets look at the innocent party in all of this if it comes to pass and that's Celtic Football Club.

 

If this comes to pass they will be showing all of Scottish Football that all that money they've spent on Lennoxtown has come to fruition.

 

Their head of youth development will be showing he is doing a grand job of bringing youth players through the ranks there.

 

No wonder thay want to piss off to England having burnt all those resources developing all that talent and not having any real competition from the diddy teams in the SPL hanging on to their coat tails.

 

Exactly.

 

Offended by everything, embarrassed by nothing. And that's a side of the story that won't get an airing anywhere else.

[GazzyB]

I vaguely remember reading that McCart was given permission to move to Celtic on the basis he didn't sign any of our young players. Would that be right?

[MelvinBragg]

Like I said earlier - I think the bulk of the strong staements have been qualified with an if.

 

And it's hopefully still a big if.

 

However lets look at the innocent party in all of this if it comes to pass and that's Celtic Football Club.

 

If this comes to pass they will be showing all of Scottish Football that all that money they've spent on Lennoxtown has come to fruition.

 

Their head of youth development will be showing he is doing a grand job of bringing youth players through the ranks there.

 

No wonder thay want to piss off to England having burnt all those resources developing all that talent and not having any real competition from the diddy teams in the SPL hanging on to their coat tails.

To be fair, if they don't have the players there at 18-19, it is McCart's job to source them from elsewhere. He's not been there that long. If he goes in and thinks that there's not much talent at all levels up to U19, then he has to try and find them. And from a very young age, players of the talent he is looking for will already be signed at other clubs. So where is he going to get them? You've guessed it, other clubs. Let's all dry our eyes here, shall we. Is it any different to us picking up Steven Saunders or Gary Smith from Queens Park to come and sit in our under 19s.

 

Let's all climb of the moral high ground, shall we...?

[Steve Diggle]

To be fair, if they don't have the players there at 18-19, it is McCart's job to source them from elsewhere. He's not been there that long. If he goes in and thinks that there's not much talent at all levels up to U19, then he has to try and find them. And from a very young age, players of the talent he is looking for will already be signed at other clubs. So where is he going to get them? You've guessed it, other clubs. Let's all dry our eyes here, shall we. Is it any different to us picking up Steven Saunders or Gary Smith from Queens Park to come and sit in our under 19s.

 

Let's all climb of the moral high ground, shall we...?

 

That's probably a realistic statement of where McCart and Celtic are Melvin.

 

However as a club Motherwell FC don't go to the press every International Break Weekend and bleat about lack of competition within their own league an their need to get to England.

 

Your moral high ground comment is a bit harsh btw. We (posters) all understand how it works - but at least as a club we have a bit of humility about us. We don't go bleating to the press about how pish Queen's Park are!

[Al B]

I vaguely remember reading that McCart was given permission to move to Celtic on the basis he didn't sign any of our young players. Would that be right?

As far as i'm aware. Although that seems to be being overlooked in the midst of the rumour-mongering...

 

Edited to add a quote from the supporters panel night before christmas...

McCart admitted that the club let him go to Celtic on the proviso he didn't sign any of our youths

[Steve Diggle]

Melv's moral high ground comment has really pissed me off

 

If McCart and Celtic have their woes that's fine.

 

But I'm perfectly within my rights to be pissed off that Celtic want to treat us like a charity shop to buy their fur coat when they're currently running about without knickers.

 

Theiy're run by a shower of megalomaniacs with superiority complexes who don't think we're good enough to mix it with 'em on a weekly basis. Yet we're good enough to do their youth development for them when they (having spent millions on it) have failed miserably.

[Well Up For It!]

IF Slane does move to Celtic - which is his perogitive - then I beleive it is without doubt the wrong move for him, which will have repercussions on Motherwell and Scotland in my eyes.

 

McCart is only doing his job, I agree. But as someone who could potentially be sounded out about our manager's position in time, he is doing himself no favours with the club. And it now appears he has went back on his word of not approaching any of 'Well's youngsters. This is probably a gentlemans agreement and not in writing, but still it is extremley shady of McCart to go against this "promise" and my estimations of him have gone down.

 

The fact that we will make peanuts from the deal is the real slap in the face. I wouldn't mind him going to Celtic if we received decent compensation (300k +) but if Slane is indeed on a YTS we will be lucky to make £50k at a push!

 

Whoever is pulling the strings, I've heard that since Slane's impressive start in our Euro campaign he has developed an arrogance that is perhaps only natural in a young player with his undoubted ability - but this is usually controlled by the parents. But if the stories regarding his father are true, then I really worry for the boy. I also wonder what influence Gannon had on him, was it positive? Or is his mindset diffrent now Gannon is away?

 

Sadly I believe this will all come to pass, and as has already been mentioned, it just echoes the absolute polution the Old Firm create in the Scottish game. Snapping up these hot prospect to rot in the reserves is detremental to Scottish football as a whole, and if Slane does move it will be another in a long line of Scottish talent wasted by joining the Old Firm.

 

And on top of all this, I'm dissappointed in the club. I also see a failing on their part to secure our investment better.

[MelvinBragg]

Melv's moral high ground comment has really pissed me off

 

If McCart and Celtic have their woes that's fine.

 

But I'm perfectly within my rights to be pissed off that Celtic want to treat us like a charity shop to buy their fur coat when they're currently running about without knickers.

 

Theiy're run by a shower of megalomaniacs with superiority complexes who don't think we're good enough to mix it with 'em on a weekly basis. Yet we're good enough to do their youth development for them when they (having spent millions on it) has failed miserably.

They've spent millions on the facilities, not players. Now they need to find players to get the benefit out of the facilities. As you say, within their rights.

 

To use this in conjunction with the argument about weakening other teams though is a nonsense. Slane is not a first team player. I refuse to call anyone who has not started at least 5 league games in his career a first team player. Slane has not started one.

 

If you think Slane has that much potential, the people you should be pissed off at are Motherwell, not Celtic. He wasn't tied to a contract early enough in order that this couldn't happen...

[fizoxy]

I agree with MB that these players should be tied up on contracts before they gain first team exposure, rather than showcasing their talents to everyone while they are still on YTS deals. The OF can afford to wait and see if these young guys turn out to be any good before buying them for pennies (to them anyway) but we have to take the risk at this stage when the cost of a contract for a failed u19 prospect is an easier loss to absorb than losing a potential star (and future transfer fee) for nothing. Bringing through youngsters is the only way to go for clubs like us, so we have to be a bit more clever about it

[Steve Diggle]

They've spent millions on the facilities, not players. Now they need to find players to get the benefit out of the facilities. As you say, within their rights.

 

To use this in conjunction with the argument about weakening other teams though is a nonsense. Slane is not a first team player. I refuse to call anyone who has not started at least 5 league games in his career a first team player. Slane has not started one.

 

If you think Slane has that much potential, the people you should be pissed off at are Motherwell, not Celtic. He wasn't tied to a contract early enough in order that this couldn't happen...

 

To be fair he's been injured since the first day of the season and only made his comeback from injury against St Johnstone from the bench. I think you're using a technicality to say he's not a current first team player. If fit he'd have played more than Murphy IMHO. But I get your point. Anyone who's seen him though knows that he's one that will be in our first team regularly very shortly.

 

I never said I'm not pissed off at Motherwell - it's something I mention time and time again. i think we're very poor at sorting this side of things out. I actually think we should be playing hardball more often. For instance I think there is a real risk with Reynolds at the moment - if he doesn't move for money in this window then I think we'll be screwed in the next one. We should constantly have our better young players on the best ' longest contracts we can provide within our budget with the proviso that they move if an offer of certain level comes in for them. I'd like to think we'd be using financial enticements from those fees (of a pre-agreed level) as an incentive. We need to be more creative / inventive here to make it win / win.

 

Once again, Celtic would be 'within their rights' - however they should re-think their stance on the perception of lack of competition within the game here if they persist in snapping up young talent from their competitors for as little as they can get away with.

[Colc]

McCart is only doing his job, I agree. But as someone who could potentially be sounded out about our manager's position in time, he is doing himself no favours with the club. And it now appears he has went back on his word of not approaching any of 'Well's youngsters. This is probably a gentlemans agreement and not in writing, but still it is extremley shady of McCart to go against this "promise" and my estimations of him have gone down.

 

McCart did indeed state at the MST forum that the club let him go to Celtic under the condition that he didn't come back and try and steal some of our youth players. When McGhee left, McCart said he saw an opportunity to make a move for both Paul Slane and Bob McHugh but his approaches were then thwarted when Gannon was appointed as our new manager.

 

With Gannon gone you'd expect a similar situation to happen. However, Craig Brown was also on the panel that night and I'm sure he will be fully aware of any approaches by McCart and Celtic for any of our youth players should any further enquires be made.

[Lobey_Dosser]

So under the conditions of McCart's move to Celtic, he has to wait for Paul Slane running down his YTS contract before making an official approach?