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David

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Everything posted by David

  1. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Or, the club got it right two out of three times in this situation? Or are we operating on the basis that when they manage to get a player to sign a new deal we're "lucky," but when they don't manage to convince them we're "amateur?" The bottom line is, regardless of fans liking or not, that we'll never be in a position to cover all bases, especially when it comes to the unpredictability of youth football. The very fact that we've managed to retain two of our three highest-rated prospects (including the top prospect of the three in my opinion in Turnbull) is an accomplishment. Would it be great if Hastie stayed? Absolutely, but that's how the cookie crumbles. I'd be more concerned if we had lost all three, or if we were regularly shipping out players for nothing who then went on to have great careers elsewhere. The club, for the most part, has gotten it right over the years.
  2. David

    2018/19 Game 30: Hibs (A) March 16th 3pm kick off

    If we manage to slide in and finish in the top six then it's job done for us, we've accomplished more than we thought possible a few months back. We can then look to play some games against the top sides, giving our lads a runout in games that matter. We'd basically be playing with house money, as even a sixth place finish would be great.
  3. Following the end of one of our more memorable seasons I thought a thread for folk to post their photos in might be a good idea. Be it pub-related shenanigans abroad during our European adventures, or Scottish cup final related pictures, we can all post our memories (both good & cringeworthy!) in this thread.
  4. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    I think it's more of a case of some of us having lived through various players leave the club. Hastie leaving for Rangers is disappointing, but its hardly the end of world, even in a footballing sense.
  5. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    I'm sure I heard that the length of the deals being offered is what was part of the problem for some players. The club wanted them to sign longer deals, while the players wanted one year deals. It's worth bearing in mind that it's not all down to the club, the players themselves have a part to play in negotiations, and if they either don't want to sign at all, or only sign for a year then there isn't much we can do about it.
  6. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Tell you what, if half the shite I've read on here is accurate then we've dodged a bullet by not offering him a contract. Seems he's destined to go to Rangers and fade into obscurity, before heading to the lower reaches of the English game and being let go, only to return to Scotland with Thistle or Accies. Sounds like he's pish, better spending our money elsewhere.
  7. Shite game, but a point away isn't too bad at all. I'll be glad to see the end of the Killie chat as well, with all the ticket nonsense.
  8. Aye, it was an absolute debacle of a game really. Looked like two amateur sides.
  9. The co-commentator actually yawning during the broadcast. Tells you all you need to know really.
  10. Weird. It was the Celtic game, then refreshed the page and it's now the killie game.
  11. Anyone's official stream working? I'm just getting a replay of the Celtic game.
  12. Robinson showing some more class in addressing Scott Bain's reaction to the James Scott goal; Like how he managed to get a wee mention of Brendan leaving
  13. It is, if you're outside the UK.
  14. I'm not holding out much hope for this game, but I'm more confident we can nab something than I have been in quite a while.
  15. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Christ, you're going back a bit there, are you not? Was the gulf in finances on offer back then as wide as they are now? And didn't McClair begin his career at Villa? It's not as though he was with a club like Motherwell and knocked back a contract to go down there, is it? Or am I remembering wrong? Then surely, if he wasn't that good to begin with, the best option for him was to make as much money early on as he possibly could? Or do you think that despite not being that good he'd have flourished with us and eventually landed a big transfer to a club who could pay him more money? If anything he's a prime example of why you should strike when the iron is hot. He somehow got a chance to sign for Leeds on a two year contract despite not being good enough to play a game for us. The one wildcard factor in all of this is that the majority of young players coming through at virtually any club simply won't make it at a high level. Martin is probably an example of that, and I don't think that turning down the two year Leeds deal with better money would have meant he'd be playing for us or another club of our level rather than fucking about in the lower leagues today. Like you say, there is no right or wrong answer, especially when you're at such a young age. I'm probably talking as an adult, who would be thinking ahead to making sure that I had enough dough in the bank to provide my future kids and wife with a life that I didn't have, where they have far more opportunities than I did. I'd rank those priorities higher than any trophies or medals I'd win in the game. But that's just me.
  16. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Lee Erwin left Leeds after two years of a three year deal, earning great money and being given a payout to end his contract early I believe. He then ended up at Kilmarnock, where he played around 40 times and could have remained if he'd chosen to. Despite him choosing to chase more money in Iran of all places, the fact is that he did go away down south, earn a decent wedge, then came back to SPFL level. Slane's problems started with his cruciate injury, which could easily have happened at Motherwell as it did at Celtic. The only real difference was that he had a four year contract at Celtic, which included three years of a good wage and a payout to leave early. He's since been suggested as having pissed away a lot of his money, which doesn't mean he was wrong to make the move, it means he's a walloper most likely, and you can't account for that. He'd likely have been a walloper had he stayed with us as well. A smart footballer will go where the money is within reason, keep his head down, train and act like a professional, and if they're good enough they'll do well in the game and more importantly be able to continue living well after their time playing is up. In all of this discussion my main point is that you strike when the iron is hot. There's no guarantee that a Norwich, Leeds, Celtic or whoever are going to revisit and make the same offer in a year or two. The whole "don't move on quite yet, stay and better your game and learn your craft" chat usually comes from the club and the fans of the club who stand to lose said player on the cheap. If the same player was under contract and the interested club offered a sizeable fee the tone of the discussion would be different. We look at the likes of Hastie's situation as fans of Motherwell. We want him to stay and improve mostly because it will help the team, and because we'd get a tidy fee if he continues to improve and we can punt him at a later date. And if he gets crocked or falls away? Ah well, that's how it goes, right? What he does after his time in the game finishes is of fuck all concern to us unless he's a decent coach and can work with the kids.
  17. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Not sure that there's really much of a track record of players leaving a club that's capable of paying 3 times what we could and moving directly to QoS or Falkirk, is there? Even those young players who are considered failures at clubs in the English Championship are offered another roll of the dice at SPFL level. Usually, at worst, they find their way back to a mid-table club in our top league. They may drift after that point, but that'll be down to them not being worth a deal at that level.
  18. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Yeah, but you have to assume the club who are paying the money have seen something in you to believe you have what it takes, no? What I'm saying is that even if you go to a club like Leeds from Motherwell and fail, doing the rounds on loan of some English League One clubs or whatever, you're still going to be paid what your contract stipulates. And more often than not, a prospect who's left the SPFL to go to the English Championship can find a club in the SPFL who are willing to take a punt when their contract runs out down south, so they end up back where they started at worst, except with more cash in their pocket and more life experience.
  19. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Lee Erwin went to Leeds before coming back up the road to play for Killie, didn't he? So it was accurate in his case. He then decided to opt for another money move to Iran, where it looks as though he's not able to handle it, citing homesickness as the reason or something similar. If you're going to chase the money, especially to somewhere like that, you need to be prepared to take the rough with the smooth. It's not going to be like the UK, and you have to work through that. Apparently he claimed depression but was able to attend a training camp a few days after the club wrote him a letter. I think that's more to do with him being a bit of a walloper than anything else. You're being paid more money to play football, which is what you're being offered at Motherwell. Realisation of potential or not, if you sign a three year deal at an English Championship club on a set wage and with a nice signing-on fee you're going to get paid that regardless of what potential you realise. Considering the mentality it takes for a young player to even make it as far as lacing up his boots for our first team, I'd be very surprised if there's any who would get an offer from a side like Leeds or Norwich and who wouldn't think "I can go down there and tear it up, no problem." If a player decides to stay in a particular place due to family reasons, such as his other half not keen on moving, kids in school, any of that, then fair enough, as family comes first. But if they get an offer from a bigger club and seriously think "nah, I'll never get a game there" they maybe need to question their own ambition and belief in their ability. Maybe Ben Hall stays with us and does fuck all though? Eventually getting farmed out a few times before being let go? Maybe the reason why he's not set the heather alight down south is because he's not that good? What then? Again, you strike when the iron is hot. Most of these guys aren't being paid an absolute fortune, so they need to make as much as they can before their career is over by their mid 30's. Maybe their late 30's if they're lucky. It comes down to the player in question either thinking like a fan, or thinking like a professional. I know that isn't what we like to hear, but it's the truth. If I was faced with the option of staying at Motherwell (even with me being a Motherwell fan) and getting more game time but significantly less money, or moving to a Championship side down south and earning the kind of money that would go a long way to securing a better life for my wife and kids then it's a no fucking brainer. Keep your football time and achieving something in the game. If given the choice of lifting the Scottish cup for Motherwell but having to live in Lanarkshire and work as a sports coach while my wife works as a receptionist when I retire, or moving down south and playing for seven or eight years in the Championship then coming up the road at the tail end with a healthy bank account and being able to retire and provide a better life for my family, then I'll make do with watching that Scottish cup win from the stands or on TV. That may be sacrilege to a lot of fans, but the welfare and lifestyle afforded my family would always come first, which is why I never grudge anyone who looks to earn as much as they can. I hope Hastie stays at Fir Park, as I'm thinking like a fan. If he decides to make the jump when the offer is there though, then fair play to him and best of luck. Hopefully he'll be banking his money and managing it efficiently.
  20. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    The thing is, what if Hastie for example, does really well the rest of this season. He get's some pretty big money offers from a few English Championship clubs. We're talking about three year contracts offered. He says no, listens to the people saying he should stay at Motherwell and learn his trade. Next season his form dips badly, he gets dropped, fades away and ends up quietly being let go and plying his trade part-time by the time he's 23 or 24. The harsh truth is, you never know what's around the corner. If a company offered me twice or three times my wages to do the same job for them in a higher profile environment I'd be all over it. And so would most of you. Especially if you knew it was a career that would only last for 15 years or so. And lets be honest, a player who leaves our league and goes down south to a side like Leeds or Norwich, even if they fail, they're pretty much guaranteed a move back up here to a club of similar standing to the one they left, on the same kind of money they would have been getting anyway.
  21. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    I don't need to make that decision for them, they made it themselves when they left their first clubs and the promise of "developing into better players" for the chance to make it on a bigger stage for a higher financial reward. The thing is, for the most part both winning things and earning more money are connected. The teams who generally win things are the ones paying the higher wages, so it makes sense to chase the money, as the accolades will usually follow if you're good enough. like Andy Robertson, for example. One good season at Dundee United before he left for Hull City. If he'd failed there, went out on loan a few times and returned to Scotland he'd no doubt he used as another example of a player who "left too soon" and could have developed more before moving on. But he's done well and is a terrific example that if you're good enough, have the right work ethic and your head screwed on you can succeed at the highest level. And if you're not good enough? You can usually find a way back to the safety net of where you were before, can't you? Be it leaving Killie and returning to St Johnstone a few years later, or leaving Motherwell and coming back to Killie as Erwin did. The main difference is that you'll have boosted your bank account a bit, which will come in handy when you're 45 and the fans and clubs no longer really give a shit about you. At that point it's just you and your family, and being able to support them financially is what really matters, even over & above a few meaningless trophies that won't pay the mortgage I'd reckon. If Hastie moves on and decides to make a fist of cracking into a side in the English championship for more coin than we could ever hope to pay him then good on him. It's a short career and you strike when the iron is hot. Those clubs may not be around if you suffer a dip in form or an injury, or the manager changes and the new guy doesn't rate you.
  22. David

    Robinson... How Do We Think He's Doing ?

    I don't get this line of thinking. You won't judge the manager or the team when playing against other sides of similar standing, only when they play against better sides? And the last time I checked, those academy products are part of the team that Robinson picked? You're talking as though those youngsters being a big part of our success is somehow a bad thing?
  23. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Well, Brighton saw enough to take up that extra year option on Hall's deal, and Kennedy got a move to Cardiff, which likely brought a decent wage and a nice signing bonus as well. And if we're honest, for most players being richer when they call time on their career is all that really matters.
  24. David

    The Small-Medium Rebuild 2018'19

    Ben Hall? Isn't he out on loan while having renewed his deal with Brighton for another year in 2018? He's most likely doing very well financially in comparison to what we could offer him, and he's still on the books of a Premiership club. Matt Kennedy left St Johnstone because Everton came calling. Very few footballers worth their salt would turn down a move like that, unless they thought they weren't actually good enough of course. He signed on a three year deal, guaranteeing him three years of decent cash most likely, while allowing him to learn the game at a higher level. He then went to Cardiff on a 3 and a half year deal, where I doubt the wages were pocket change. Now he's back in Scotland with St Johnstone, still only 24 years old, has a shitload more experience than he would have had if he hadn't left, and his bank account is probably healthier as well. Than make money? Probably not. Last I checked I couldn't pay my mortgage or help put my kids through school on my reputation. For some reason many football fans don't seem to realise that this is these guys jobs. It's what they do for a living. If a company came along to us in our job and offered us far more money to do the same job for them we'd be offski in a heartbeat. No nonsense about staying at the smaller company to "learn the trade" or to "build a reputation." You're in the game to make money and win things, in that order most of the time. We see plenty of legends hawking their medals and trinkets to raise money for themselves, but very rarely do we see a retired multi-millionaire footballer crying into his versace pillowcase about not winning a few more Scottish cups or a league title. You get in, make as much money as you can at the highest level possible before you're old and broken down and have to retire.
  25. David

    Robinson... How Do We Think He's Doing ?

    Some people are glass half full, and some are glass half empty. When it comes to Yodo he doesn't even have a fucking glass to begin with.

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