nethertonwellfan Posted December 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 so what do you suggest then Support the team! Too much to ask ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarecrow Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 To the OP, how big is your picture frame? I've watched Motherwell for 35 years plus. All of our managers in that period appeared to have a short and then long term plan, whether good or bad, Gannon, short term done us a turn with no resources, but has seemed to be clueless over the last couple of months. Team selection.....suspect Tactics...............suspect Media interaction..suspect Deflection............brilliant If it ain't broke, don't fix it Jim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nethertonwellfan Posted December 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Team selection.....suspectTactics...............suspect Media interaction..suspect Deflection............brilliant If it ain't broke, don't fix it Jim. Can not disagree with any of that but is paitence too much to ask for ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dosser chris Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Are you serious ? yes what do you disagree with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarecrow Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Can not disagree with any of that but is paitence too much to ask for ? Patience is not a word associated with the SPL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfc Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Support the team! Too much to ask ? so we support the team at the final whistle after weve been turned over by st johnstone at home.if there was no booing then the players might think were prepared to pay and watch that shite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nethertonwellfan Posted December 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 yes what do you disagree with? Fuck all mate! I was just shocked that someone is on the same wavelength as me! I started this thread afterall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepper Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Patience is not a word associated with the SPL. Patience is not associated with football in general! What's the point of a 3 year plan if year 1 gets you the bullet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tree Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Taken from an article written by Norman Hunter (Writer for the New Statesman and Spurs fan). Written by him in response to Ramos being booed by a section of their support. `We know it doesn't help. The players are human, poor petals, so booing them only makes it worse. But what else can we do? Booing is part of a long and ignoble tradition - but usually fans have booed the other team. I've been looking through my copies of the Sporting Chronicle for 1888, the first season of the Football League, and there are lots of incidents of crowds shouting disgusting words, such as "dogs" and "pigs" - but these were aimed at the opposition. Booing your own team seems to have got worse in recent years. After that Hull defeat, my friend and neighbour Sue said: "You know what, it's the first time since I started following Spurs that I've begun to think I'm not getting my money's worth." That's probably part of the problem. In the old days, tickets didn't cost a great deal, unless you bought your ticket from a tout. Touts have practically disappeared today, but at one time they were outside all the big games. I have a comic postcard from the 1920s that shows a tout outside Wembley offering a fan a Cup Final ticket for £10. "Ten pounds!" exclaims the fan. "I could buy a woman for that." "Yes," says the tout, "but you won't get 90 minutes each way with a brass band playing in the middle." If your team were rubbish and you hadn't paid much to see them, you could take it - more or less. But in the Prem today, when every fan has paid a fortune, you naturally get upset. Almost everyone now has a season ticket and pays up to a year ahead for games that haven't happened yet, but are probably going to be rubbish anyway. No wonder we get livid. One of the first effects of the Spurs fans' booing has been on Juande Ramos, the Spurs manager. When he first arrived, he appeared so tough, aloof, macho and commanding, with those incredible cheekbones and that scary stare. Since the booing, he seems to have lost six inches and gone small, weedy and nervous. While booing doesn't help the player, it does help fans release some of their frustrations - and in the end it does have an effect. So we do have power, even if it is a negative one`. Apart from staying away from the ground (self defeating), booing like cheering, is one of the only ways fans can communicate to the players and manager how they feel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nethertonwellfan Posted December 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 so we support the team at the final whistle after weve been turned over by st johnstone at home.if there was no booing then the players might think were prepared to pay and watch that shite Yes because your remit tells you that. Ask a Charlto fan, ask a Partick Thistle fan and ask a Southhampton fan all teams who are worse off than us but the fans have got BEHIND their team and now they are reaping the reward. Why? because they showed patience, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfc Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Yes because your remit tells you that. Ask a Charlto fan, ask a Partick Thistle fan and ask a Southhampton fan all teams who are worse off than us but the fans have got BEHIND their team and now they are reaping the reward. Why? because they showed patience, charlton,thistle and southampton there fans have never booed there team at the final whistle before if only our fans were as good as theres Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East_Stand_Al Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Finishing 3rd doesn't generate bigger crowds so what's your point? Can it not be that we are a work in progress or is that thinking beyond you ? My point is that the fans have a right to express thier dissatisfaction with performances such as that today, which I'm sure we can agree was at the very least poor. As for the work in progress that concept is not beyond me no,however at the moment it appears to many to be one step forward and two steps back. This may well be down to the fact that we started the season brightly and in doing so perhaps the expectation level is a little bit high. And finishing in 3rd would indeed generate bigger crowds as was proven by the signifcant upturn in season ticket sales after finishing 4th and embarking on our " european tour ", it could also be argued that the recent poor run of results is reponsible for the lower than average gate today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nethertonwellfan Posted December 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 My point is that the fans have a right to express thier dissatisfaction with performances such as that today, which I'm sure we can agree was at the very least poor.As for the work in progress that concept is not beyond me no,however at the moment it appears to many to be one step forward and two steps back. This may well be down to the fact that we started the season brightly and in doing so perhaps the expectation level is a little bit high. And finishing in 3rd would indeed generate bigger crowds as was proven by the signifcant upturn in season ticket sales after finishing 4th and embarking on our " european tour ", it could also be argued that the recent poor run of results is reponsible for the lower than average gate today. I disagree Motherwell Vs Dundee United (Porter, Wilkie) struglled to get 5000 and that was the season we finished 3rd. When we were doing well at the start of the season our gate was struggling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Bezzer! Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 How long have you been supporting Motherwell ? How many four game losing straks have we been on. We have had them under McLean, McLeish, Kampmann, Davies, Black, Butcher, Malpas and now Gannon. Now I maybe wrong but i think McGhee is the only manager I have known that hasn't lost 4 in a row. BOO HOO all they managers should have been sacked before there time. It's not the losing streak, its throwing points away that we should have won. We've not been being beaten, we've thrown the matches away. It's seven matches since we won, we've been leading in FIVE of them, when changes have been made that did not need to be made after which we consequently dropped points or lost the match. That's why people are angry. If we were losing these matches no one would be happy but they wouldn't be angry, a significant amount of what has happened in the last two months has been entirely avoidable, we needn't be in this position but we are. Incidentally, at this stage Maurice Malpas had 23 points, Gannon has 20. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoF Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 Got to agree with nethertonwellfan. I understand boo-ing does nothing but help disgruntled fans feel a wee bit better. I can't imagine any footballer is so delusional that they need booing from the fans to confirm that the peformance is unnaceptable. I shout nothing when we've been pish because I know that not every player needs to "get the fuckin finger out". As Gannon said today, every player is different and needs a different approach to get the best out of them. Some take a bollocking and respond to it while others need an arm round their shoulder. Booing is something that can only knock the already fragile confidence of some players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 Football is a game built on emotions,we cheer when things are going well, we boo at pish like yesterday.If it wasn't for the match being on yesterday i would not have been out the door in that weather so i showed my frustration and dissapointment by booing if that makes me less off a supporter than some of the 'superfans' then so be it maybe i should have sat in and watched chitty chitty bang bang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_P Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 This just seems like an extension of the round in circles "I don't like booing" v "I'm entitled to boo" debate which took up about 4 pages of the St Johnstone match thread. I don't particularly like the booing of the team, but I feel folk are more than entitled to if they feel its warranted but I'll tell you what - Nethertonwell fan you are calling for perspective - put in perspective I bet yesterday's booing pales into complete insignificance in comparison with being completely hung out to dry in public by your manager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Diggle Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 It's a really bad string of results and performances. Formations aren't working and changes aren't working positively for us. It's not good and it might last for another few games- not one single person is denying that. But at the end of the day - so fuckin what! When the goin' get's tough - the tough get goin' right enough. Folk should have a long hard look at themselves. I'm supposed to be the chief pant wetter on here - but fuck sake guys you're putting me to shame over the past couple of weeks. A few pointed out at the start of the season - even Gannon alluded to it himself. Things are gonna be different from now - a young team will be thrown together - to grow and develop for the future. We'll have dips in form particularly since we had a busy close season, take some humpings but we're gonna try and develop a team. So this becomes reality and all of a sudden half of Fir Park are shitting their pants! We're above teams who have settled squads, and had their poor spells at the start of the season some will over take us some like Dundee Utd might implode and fall away. We constantly have a laugh about how quickly old firm fans turn when things are not going their way - then we go and behave exactly the same way. I firmly believe the future is in the young guys - If you thought post Ibrox that the answer to our woes is Craigan and Lasley then I believe you got your answer yesterday. Aye bring on Ian McCall or Jimmy Calderwood - that's the answer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatcalf Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 But at the end of the day - so fuckin what! You know what, that's how I feel about it. A couple of years ago changed my outlook completely. It's a game of fitba' nothing more nothing less. I love to see my team win but I don't lose sleep over a defeat, even a humping. I care more about the fabric of the club, the history, the culture than the 90 minutes on a Saturday but I also think the true measure of a fanbase is how they react to difficult times. Sadly ours show themselves to be completely lacking, we're not supportive to a fault the way it should be, we're certainly not all in this together and that's a real shame. It's not a recent thing either, ever since 1991 I've noticed a shift in our support of the team on the park, no longer was it enough just to make do, we HAD to be doing well or else someone was getting it. Too long a list of targets for here but the prime example was Tommy McLean, even when we were never out of the top 4 in 1993-94 wee TomTom was getting pelters (and I was guilty of that before the Cup win admittedly then I wised up) so I shouldn't be surprised anymore at the reaction to anything less than a 3-0 victory. Unrealistic expectations is probably the best description I can find. If we're shite then so what, it's our shite and I'll still be with them 100%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Diggle Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 Tremendous post MJ - That's it on the head mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decorator Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 i will take 11th and the fair play place Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
true_steelman Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 I've calmed down a lot in the past few seasons, take what we get. Lot more things to worry about. If I was only happy when motherwell played the perfect match then i'd never be happy! For what its worth, the players are obviously low in confidence and booing them is only going to make matters worse! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 It's not the losing streak, its throwing points away that we should have won. We've not been being beaten, we've thrown the matches away. It's seven matches since we won, we've been leading in FIVE of them, when changes have been made that did not need to be made after which we consequently dropped points or lost the match. That's why people are angry. If we were losing these matches no one would be happy but they wouldn't be angry, a significant amount of what has happened in the last two months has been entirely avoidable, we needn't be in this position but we are. Incidentally, at this stage Maurice Malpas had 23 points, Gannon has 20. If that's the case then it is a bit concerning............... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Bezzer! Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 You know what, that's how I feel about it. A couple of years ago changed my outlook completely. It's a game of fitba' nothing more nothing less. I love to see my team win but I don't lose sleep over a defeat, even a humping. I care more about the fabric of the club, the history, the culture than the 90 minutes on a Saturday but I also think the true measure of a fanbase is how they react to difficult times. Sadly ours show themselves to be completely lacking, we're not supportive to a fault the way it should be, we're certainly not all in this together and that's a real shame. It's not a recent thing either, ever since 1991 I've noticed a shift in our support of the team on the park, no longer was it enough just to make do, we HAD to be doing well or else someone was getting it. Too long a list of targets for here but the prime example was Tommy McLean, even when we were never out of the top 4 in 1993-94 wee TomTom was getting pelters (and I was guilty of that before the Cup win admittedly then I wised up) so I shouldn't be surprised anymore at the reaction to anything less than a 3-0 victory. Unrealistic expectations is probably the best description I can find. If we're shite then so what, it's our shite and I'll still be with them 100%. If you don't care about the results, only the club then you should be worried about relegation. We are struggling to get 4,000 crowds right now, basically we are depending on away fans to get us over the 4,000 mark. If we get relegated a lot of fans will knock it on the head and stop going and away supports will also fall. Income will be slashed. There is no guarantee we would get promotion the next season or even soon (just look at Dundee, St.Johnstone, St.Mirren, Dunfermline etc). I don't think many Motherwell fans lose sleep over any single defeat or even humpings, I've literally seen us beaten hundreds of times, if I did I wouldn't get much sleep but the problem here is that a lot of decent work has been undone by avoidable incompetence. I have no great hopes for Motherwell making Europe in any season frankly, I've always said that if we make the Top Six we've had an excellent season but what I don't expect is for us to throw matches away, time and time again, virtually on a weekly basis, especially when the whole future of the club could be at stake. I don't think anyone would lambast Gannon for not making Europe, for not making the Top Six but he has to show that he can do the basics right and throwing away lead after lead is not the way to do that. As for the problem undeserved expectations and criticism, well there is also a problem with undeserved praise, hero worship. Frankly too many supporters have been in some kind of thrawl to Jim Gannon, when he hasn't really done much. Gannon, unless we go into complete freefall, deserves at least a season to show us what he can do but at the same time fans must be allowed to show that we won't stand by and have our club used as a sort of experiment. Gannon increasingly worries me. He is very arrogant, stuck in his ways and stubborn. Has anyone heard him take the blame for anything? It's the press, it's the referees, it's the players - he is unaccountable to the media or the fans. When we lose it's not the tactics or the formation, there is always an excuse. That's what really worries me, not the defeats, its the fact cannot or will not accept that he might have to adapt his cosy little football coaching theories to fall into line with the real world. At the end of the day Gannon will walk away and it will be your 'club culture' that will have to pick up the pieces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big tache Posted December 27, 2009 Report Share Posted December 27, 2009 So what positive effect does booing have ? Went to ibrox... fucked off at 2-o Went yesterday... fucked off at 1-0 9. BUT A DIDNAE BOO ! Am a the No 1 fan ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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