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Calm down ffs, the transfer window is not even open yet, it will be the same as every other year weeks of rumours every one of which will be labelled as pish etc. Then we will bring in a few in the last few days and hours, who incidentally will also be labelled pish before they've kicked a ball, it's the Motherwell way.

Im sure there will be a deadline as to when they've to accept or not. Mugabi and SOD aren't the only people still to accept contracts offered to them. Surely players have the right to negotiate and look at any other offers before signing on. That's only fair.

And we're potentially missing out on other targets while we wait on odonnell and mugabi making up there minds,if we do our usual we will still be waiting after the season has started.

Butcher is away and the only person who has signed on so far is McGinn.

We needed a clear out to give us the best chance of improving,the more defenders we keep the more likely it will be the same old story next season.

If the rumours about Joe Lewis are true, then it may well be that Oxborough is no.1 with Lewis in a back up role?

I don't think Mugabi has been rotten from the off. I just don't think he's progressed. Also - keeping players doesn't mean we won't sign new ones. I'm not surprised at all that SOD and McGinn were offered new terms.

It was just a thought about why Mugabi has been offered terms. If you have an underperforming defence and you offer three of them terms and not the fourth I think that's a pretty strong message you are sending out. Plus as other people have said. We don't know what the terms are or whether Kettlewell sees Mugabi and others as back up options. Or if Mugabi will accept the terms offered.

Must admit I thought you'd already started 😄

Wiping the slate clean would have allowed us to bring in new players and not just stick with guys that have failed the past season,put defending was pathetic on a weekly basis.it seems like we might be banking on a new keeper being the solution but I dont buy it,kelly was poor last season but is definitely better than what ye showed,where guys like mugqbi have been rotten from the minute they came through the door.hopefully kettlewell has learned and will set us up where were actually interested in defending the wide areas,if it's same again and expecting having a more commanding goalie will make the difference then he's kidding himself on.

My apologies. Must be time for a drink.

I think so re Butcher. Good luck to him.

But I wasn't talking about Butcher being offered terms. I was commenting on "wellgirls" attempts to justify why Kettlewell had offered them to Mugabi.

Maybe Butcher just wanted to go back down south. He'll get a gig down there no bother at all. We'll never get to hear how contract negotiations go with players and quite rightly so. The rumour mill has certainly dried up quite a bit since Caldwell came in and again quite rightly so as the leaks coming out of the club in the past have been ridiculous and possibly cost us potential signings.

If you wipe the slate clean you risk leaving yourself with very limited options apart from youth. I don't think McGinn is shite and I don't think SOD is either. I think we are all going to have different opinions on that. I think Bevis is very good when he's on his game but when he's off it he's very poor. There's been rumours that Dundee utd are looking at Bevis but that's all they are. Plus Kelly has gone too. A new keeper might help the defence situation

The defence was a problem the whole season not just part of it,cheap goals and individual mistakes cost us a shot at the top 6 and put us out the cups.this was the perfect time to wipe the slate clean and try and improve the main problem in our team but yet here we are facing the possibility of the same old shite next season.i hope odonnell and mugabi don't accept our offers but I hardly think clubs will be queuing up to sign them.

I personally think offering Butcher terms was the decent thing to do - not expecting many people to agree with me. Think it's clear from the twitter video clip that Butcher wanted away - maybe wants to go back to England, he was wishing the club all the best for the future. Same with Slattery. Im happy that he's been offered new terms.

I'm not trying to justify anything. But if a guy like Tommy McLean chose to stick a player who could hardly move on the bench for a cup final, then actually bring him on when the game was still in the balance, anything's possible. Kettlewell obviously has a lot of time for Butcher. Maybe saying he chose not to accept our offer seemed a nicer parting of the ways. If anyone knows what that offer was, fair enough, I'd be interested to hear the details.

I understand how poor our defence was for part of last season. I don't think McGinn is a poor player though and I don't think SOD is either. I think SOD is far better than he gets credit for. Also. Just because they've been offered new terms doesn't mean we won't be signing anyone else. Or that the players are going to accept the terms offered.

Other than gent not one defender from last season would be missed but yet we have retained mcginn and offered terms to odonnell and mugabi and with casey and blaney still under contract,it's almost certain that our defensive options for next season will be vastly made up of guys that kept 3 clean sheets all season, considering kettlewell has been moaning about our defending, especially of late,keeping most of them around for next season is madness.

I also think Spittal developed an awful lot under Kettlewell. Plus we had some very decent loan signings in Biereth, Vale and Gent. Id say Nicolson too.

What "logic" are you trying to justify 🤷‍♂️

But not for everyone, which still defies logic.

He's signed plenty of players since he came in - even if he's made mistakes with his signings that hasnt stopped him making signings. Brian Caldwell said in his interview last week that the club had made a number of offers to players who don't play for us. Being immense in three games doesn't mean Bevis should be first choice. When he is off his game he's really poor.

For me ........ yes