David
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Posts posted by David
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1 minute ago, wellgirl said:
I personally don't think our transfer window was a total disaster. Apparently we missed out on a couple of options because of where we are in the table - relegation rivals and we apparently just missed out on a Sunderland player. I don't think for a minute that Kettlewell wasn't trying his best to bring another forward in.
I don't think it was as bad as some do, but I don't see much rhyme or reason to our signings. I'm sure the manager was keen on bringing players in, but beyond handing the recruitment team his requirements, I don't know if there's much more he can do.
It's not his job to sift through the available players on the market and ring their agent or parent club. It's his job to identify where we need players and then coach the team he's given.
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31 minutes ago, robsterwood said:
Moderators need to be looking at some of them.
If you see something that you feel oversteps the line, report it. We don't always catch everything.
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2 hours ago, steelboy said:
Was it not 20 grand?
I seriously doubt it. I've worked with marketing firms in London for public transport campaigns that didn't cost that much.
1 hour ago, gaz7 said:I get that a forum is for all opinions and we can't all be positive but by God the last 24 hours have been negativity central.
After the transfer window we've had, I can't really blame them. I doubt we're the only club whose fans will be pissed off, though. A certain team from the east end of Glasgow springs to mind.
23 minutes ago, maz said:I see the curry club over in Pie and Bovril have been slating this forum. Quite ironic as many of them were having meltdowns last night that would put this thread to shame.
To each their own I guess. I've posted a few times over there, but a forum with only one thread on Motherwell doesn't hold much appeal for me. I actually prefer it here.
And even our regular moaners tend to at least have a coherent reason for their thinking, even if I don't agree with them often.
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1 minute ago, steelboy said:
We are skint but we can pay a fortune for a stupid video from an Edinburgh advertising agency.
We didn't spend a "fortune" on that video.
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11 minutes ago, MJC said:
As a club we are in trouble imo, on and off the park. Financially we are flagging and without knowing all the ins and outs I struggle to see how we can sustain our position as a top flight, full time club when we are told that we can’t even match half of what the likes of Killie and St.Mirren can offer signing targets. What is our plan going forward? Do we simply live hand to mouth, day to day and hope that there are worst sides than us in the league to help us avoid the drop? Because that’s what it looks like.
Our management and recruitment are are falling way short of where they should be. We looked poorly coached every week and I cannot for the life of me understand why we’ve added two more full backs on the last day of the window when it was clear that up front was where we needed to strengthen.
A few points there worth addressing:
1. I don't think we're "financially flagging" at all. In fact, we seem to be in a relatively good space financially. Now, that doesn't mean we can sustain ourselves as a top-flight club. It could become the case that we can't do that with the financial restrictions we're working under. But that doesn't mean we're "financially flagging". It just means we're not as financially well-off as those around us.
2. As someone else has said, we don't know if we couldn't match what Killie and St Mirren were offering or if we just didn't see the value in it. The whole thing had a bit of a bidding war about it, and I definitely believe that Killie paid over the odds if the numbers being bandied about are true.
3. I don't know if we look "poorly coached" either. We're certainly not at our best this season, but we're 9th in the league. I could understand the crying and panic if we were in the position Livi are in, but we're not.
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5 hours ago, MJC said:
The usual mugs in our support will cheer him no matter what he does.
No they won't. He'll maybe get a wee round of applause when he warms up, but he'll certainly not get cheered if he scores against us, for example.
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7 minutes ago, wunderwell said:
Well this is my last post on this site.
Off to P and B to chat to people with similar thoughts.Far be it for me to defend or champion the cause of the people you're talking about, but the world would be boring if we all agreed.
Or, it would be like a Twitter feed—an echo chamber.
Most people here bring something to the discussion, and everyone adds value in their own way. But the call is yours to make. Hopefully, we'll see you back at some point.
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6 minutes ago, steelboy said:
Alexander, McGhee, Mcall, Gannon and Brown all had a track record.
Jim Gannon, Stuart McCall, Mark McGhee (1st spell) and Craig Brown were all pre-fan ownership when the club was different.
We've really only had Robinson, Alexander, Hammell and Kettlewell in the current era.
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Just now, steelboy said:
Kettlewell is clearly not up to the job and as much as people want to lower the bar and drop standards it's not possible to explain away the fiasco of the past two windows.
so you believe the entire recruitment process sits squarely with the club manager? Interesting.
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14 minutes ago, Kmcalpin said:
Presumably the manager tells the recruitment department what positions to look for and also what kind of player he wants to fill those positions.
In most cases, yes, that's how it works. The question most would have is did Kettlewell specifically ask Nick Daws for players in the positions we signed this window? If so, it may raise some questions as to why the manager has seen those particular positions as a requirement.
However, and I believe this to be the most likely scenario, the manager has asked for players in a number of positions, and the recruitment team wasn't able to identify suitable targets in those areas, or they managed to and the club couldn't get the deals over the line.
The question then has to be, is whoever is negotiating the deals on behalf of the club up to the task? Or has the recruitment department not been aligned on what we can afford as a club regarding playing targets?
A lot of variables, and without being inside the club, there's little way of knowing which it actually is.
All I can tell from the outside looking in is that there's no distinct pattern or trend in the signings we make, which is why I question how analytics are being used. They are more than likely being utilised in some way, but how that is, I don't know.
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5 minutes ago, wellfan said:
I don't think he’ll be sacked because we can't afford it, but he certainly won't survive in terms of earning himself a new contract with us or another top-flight club. We’re going to limp to the end of the season because that's what the Board and he have set us up to achieve and no more.
The thing is, he's shown that he's got something about him as a coach. He's certainly done more with the likes of Bair than I ever thought possible, and when an individual (or coaching team) can coach a player to the point where he's defying the analytics and numbers, he's definitely got something about him.
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Just now, Onthefringes said:
You do realise the use of data analytics has been around the club for a few years? It’s nothing new. How they are applied is what’s up for debate.
As I said, I'm fairly sure they're using analytics to some degree. I certainly don't believe they're still operating like they were in the 90's. But I just can't see a way in which they're being used correctly. Or to its potential.
When it comes to analytics, you can usually tell if they're being used due to patterns and trends that are visible in the actions of the companies using them after a period of time. I've looked long and hard, and for the life of me, I can't see anything from our transfer business that would suggest they're implementing them.
This is why I've long believed that any issues we have at the moment most likely sit with the recruitment department more than anything else.
As you say, the people running the club aren't idiots. They're certainly not amateurs. And the club is in a reasonably healthy position financially. Kettlewell has proven that he's got something about him as a coach as well.
Which leaves one particular area. In my opinion anyway.
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Just now, joewarkfanclub said:
Once we get rid of the millstone round our neck we might be able to swim more freely......
The only fear I have is that we get rid of said millstone only to continue with our haphazard approach to transfers, except with more money to burn.
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1 minute ago, robsterwood said:
Brighton meticulous about analysis and success speaks for its self. Much more focussed and less of a lottery. Can have world wide data on most players but specific data too.
Don't mention Brighton 😂
I did that and was quickly told that they have a billion dollars to spend on analytics so it doesn't compare.
You're right, though. There's a lot we can take from their approach that can be adjusted to fit with what we're capable of doing.
Our approach at the moment seems so far off the mark that it's not even funny.
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Harking back to my post about data analytics in November, I honestly still believe that a club our size has to box clever, otherwise we will come undone at some point. And that point could very well be now.
We cannot continue the process of throwing shite against the wall every summer and winter and hoping some of it sticks. That's not sustainable.
I said in November that I didn't know if the club were already using data analytics to its advantage, but quite honestly, I've seen very little evidence of this being the case. We could be way better in this area. And we don't need to spend a fortune to get there.
As I said back then, if we put the initial framework in place ahead of a summer window, we'd save a lot on the money we seem to spend during the January window.
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1 hour ago, wellfan said:
The Killie, County, and Morton games over the next week will make or break our season and him. The general feeling from fans is that they're pissed off, according to all the forums. So, if we don't beat the latter two, I think he’ll find it very difficult to come back from that.
I don't know if sacking another backroom staff and manager is the answer. What we've seen during this window is partly due to the fact we've been handing payouts to entire backroom teams like nobody's business.
Also, if the club is being run according to what people say on internet forums, we're in more considerable trouble than anyone could imagine.
Truth is, if we can maintain 9th spot, or even 10th, it's job done. Come the summer, it could be time for a discussion about the manager, but I can't see it being before then unless we hit a significant tailspin.
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11 minutes ago, robsterwood said:
Any the older guys remember we got Francis Jeffers after the window in 2011? At one point £8 million striker. Got 1 in 10 for well but played well. Linked up well
He's 43 now, and last played for Accrington Stanley over ten years ago. Might be within our budget, actually.
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2 minutes ago, MJC said:
Perhaps yes. But at the same time in St.Mirren’s case, with Paisley, would they not have at least as much if not twice more the amount of football fans who follow the Old Firm in their town? Given their proximity to Glasgow then it’s hard to think otherwise surely?
Kilmarnock are a bit more out of the way, but the town and general area will almost certainly have more Celtic/Rangers fans than those who support Killie I would have thought?
That's all just conjecture though really. Factors that can't be proven with data.
All we know for sure is that when you rank all three towns on population, Motherwell comes in at the bottom.
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1 minute ago, MJC said:
But St.Mirren and Kilmarnock don’t seem to have quite the same amount of ‘stay-away’ fans as we do?
Well, we don't know that, do we? You'd need to look at the different sizes of the towns. Paisley has a population twice the size of Motherwell, and while Kilmarnock isn't quite as big, it still has a more significant population than Motherwell.
So, as a percentage of "stay away" fans it could be that they have more than we do?
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6 minutes ago, MJC said:
As I said though we have ‘supporters’ who for whatever reason choose to spend their money elsewhere on match days most weeks. That’s up to them of course.
If we're brutally honest, is Scottish football really worth the entry cost? £20-£20 to sit in the pissing rain and cold to watch football? The facilities are shocking, the food and drink on offer is a joke.
I don't blame anyone for spending their hard earned elsewhere.
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1 minute ago, thewelllfan said:
Well that's why the folk in charge have to start making the right appointments so we don't have to sack them. Whatever idiot gave Alexander that new deal basically crippled the club.
Agreed. It should be very rare when we give a manager anything longer than a 12 month rolling contract, in my opinion.
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Imagine how much more f*cked we'd be financially if we'd binned off Kettlewell and his backroom team earlier this season as well?
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1 hour ago, MJC said:
Noted. But it’s still pretty galling for us to be ‘gazumped’ by them by double and brings us back to the issue we face that fan ownership isn’t feasible for us as a club. This is just my opinion but I don’t see how we can sustain ourselves as a top flight and full time club on our current structure and as I’ve said before if and when we are relegated then part time football is inevitable for us.
Every chance we will eventually be relegated. Virtually every other club around us has been in recent times, so it could just be our turn.
8 minutes ago, wellgirl said:Is he match fit?
Hasn't kicked a ball since November. Take from that what you will.
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1 minute ago, grizzlyg said:
Not much club can do if Blackburn boot us in the baws and KVV goes to a club that are willing to fork out wages on a par with their early 90's when they had victor, Archibald and Tomas Stickroth.
But how are they able to do that? Aren't St Mirren fan owned? Just like us?
Former Motherwell Fc Players Thread
in Club Chat
Posted
The same mob who are taking back Montgomery and have seemingly agreed to waive our obligation to pay a percentage of his wages until he's fully fit again? I mean, I know they're the nasty enemy, but I don't think they're at the level where they'd try to do us out of what we're legally owed.