gordy
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Posts posted by gordy
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First of all I want to say that I think Stuart McCall has done an excellent job overall and the following post is not a criticism of his tenure in general but I do think there is a specific problem as regarding his results against the Old Firm. These results have just not been good enough and I think it is worthwhile raising the topic. McCall seems to be a manager that is keeps an eye on what the supporters are saying and I certainly hope that he pays attention to this problem.
Let's take a look at his record.
Stuart McCall
Rangers 0-6 Celtic 2-0
Rangers 0-5 Celtic 0-4
Rangers 1-2 Celtic 0-3
Rangers 0-3 Celtic 0-4
P8 W1 D0 L7 F3 A27 GD -23 PTS 3 (24) 12.5% of AVAILABLE POINTS GOALS 9 OF for 1 MOT
In eight matches against the old firm we have won one and lost seven. This for me is not really an acceptable overall record on it's own, you'd expect a draw or two in there, but what really stands out is the level of defeat. Of course I fully accept that once in a while the Old Firm will run riot against us and run up a score, that's football and it happens. But look at these results. 0-6, 0-5, 0-3, 0-4, 0-4 etc. In fact in McCall's charge the Old Firm have score NINE goals to every goal we have scored. That is really an alarming statistic when you consider that the Old Firm don't often win by huge margins any more and in fact both Ranger's and Celtic's biggest wins (in Celtic's case jointly with Dundee Utd) this season have come against us. As the currently third placed team in the league that seems to be an anomaly and not something that you'd expect.
Let's take a look at previous recent managers records.
Craig Brown
Rangers 1-4 Celtic 0-1
Rangers 3-3 Celtic 0-4
Rangers 1-1 Celtic 1-2
P6 W0 D2 L4 F6 A15 GD -9 PTS 2 (18) 11.1% of AVAILABLE POINTS GOALS 2.5 OF for MOT
Craig Brown didn't get a win, unlike McCall, but in 6 matches he got 2 positive results including a draw away at Ibrox. There were a couple of heavy defeats (as I've said this is something we have to expect) but also a couple of quite closely run games against Celtic. Compare the goal ratio with McCall's. Under Brown the Old Firm scored two and a half goals to every goal we scored, against nine goals to every goal we scored under McCall. A massive difference. All though McCall actually has a slightly percentage of points per game tally due to the win against Celtic, I'd suggest Brown actually had a better record against the Old Firm in term of performances.
Jim Gannon
Rangers 0-0 Celtic 0-0
Rangers 1-6 Celtic 2-3
P4 W0 D2 L2 F3 A9 GD -6 PTS 2 (12) 16.6% of AVAILABLE POINTS GOALS 3 OF for MOT
Only played four matches against the Old Firm and managed 2 draws in those matches, both 0-0 draws. If not for a missed penalty it would have been even better. Gannon had the best record against the Old Firm with 16.6% of the available points from those games and the goal ratio was slightly higher than average 3 goals to the Old Firm to every one we score. Gannon's record is likely skewed due to the limited number of matches he played against the Old Firm but overall he had the best record and we only had one drubbing out of four.
Mark McGhee
Rangers 1-2 Celtic 2-4
Rangers 0-0 Celtic 0-2
Rangers 1-3 Celtic 1-1
Rangers 1-1 Celtic 0-3
Rangers 1-3 Celtic 1-0
Rangers 1-1 Celtic 1-4
Rangers 0-1 Celtic 1-2
Rangers 1-2
P15 W1 D4 L10 F12 A29 GD -17 PTS 7 (45) 15.5% of AVAILABLE POINTS GOALS 2.416 OF for MOT
He was in charge of more Old Firm matches than any previous manager but in his time he managed to get five positive results, about one result in three, and had the second best percentage of points after Gannon, considering he had so many more matches than Gannon it's actually more impressive. Again the goal ratio was within the accepted range of between 2 - 3, at 2.416 and there were several close run matches 1-2, 0-1 etc.
So we can see that every manager of Motherwell in the same number of matches, or in some cases less, than Stuart McCall had at least two positive results against the Old Firm, against his one. Not great, but not a huge difference and only one potential match away from drawing level with. What really concerns me is the scale of the defeats.
NINE OF goals to every Motherwell goal! That is simple not precedented in recent history. The next worst, Gannon's record, is THREE goals to every Motherwell goal.
The scale of defeats we have been suffering under McCall simply do not stand up against our recent historical record and I don't think its good enough simply to shrug these results off and move on the next game. First of all these are potential points on the board and they should not be given up as easily as they have done under McCall. Secondly, Motherwell fans are paying to watch these matches and when fans are putting up the cash they deserve better than a virtual guarantee of a drubbing.
I really think McCall needs to start looking at these games a bit harder and he has to come up with a corrective philosophy so that this dismal run of results can be stemmed.
I like to think of myself as being a realistic supporter and I certainly don't expect Motherwell to start roasting the OF regularly but these games, most of the time should have been harder fought. Something has to change, whether its tactics, mentality going into the game, organisation, whatever it is, but results need to get better.
Over to you McCall.
This, to me. is rhe problem.
McCall, who I think is a really good manager, shites his pants against the ugly sisters, WHY??????
Go for it against them, don't change your system, when you do, we still get pumped. so why show any respect for fucks sake.
You got manager of the month for winning games, why change tactics against the scum?
When you all talk about how good the bigots are, they are only as good as the team that plays against them.
I was not there today and will not attend another game against the evil twosome unless the attitude from our leader improves, 3 points from them is the same as 3 points from Inverness.
I want a season ticket reduction for old firm games if that is his thinking, I will not be there against them with his defeatist attitude.
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On my way home from the game yesterday I went into a wee shop for refreshments for the train.
A drunk guy gave me a bar scarf that he found at the game.
If anybody is missing a bar scarf, pm me and I will arrange to get it to you.
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Hig 3 Sutts 2
What is the point of this thread?
I told you, Higdon is better than Sutton????????
Sutton is better than Higdon??????????????????????
Higdon is ours, Sutton went to Hearts, he is dead to me.
Higgers took his two goals brilliantly today, well done big man, you are playing for the league leaders, we need your goals.
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Great game today, apart from forgetting where the goal was for a spell, letting them back into it. Should've been dead and buried after the 3rd goal. SHOES OFF FOR THE MOTHERWELL!
Well done to the young boys for the atmosphere, absolutely fanatastic.
I, for one, will be going to more away games if the atmosphere is as good as todays.
I think the team responded to it, I really do.
We were brilliant today and is it not great we are not talking about the ref.
Well done Motherwell.
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Solid today, as far as I'm concerned.
Even if not, give him a touch of time to bed in. As mentioned earlier, the Juke was pish till mid-October.
He was flicking the ball on to nobody (nobody playing alongside him), he is not quick, is not mobile and the most worrying thing is:
1. The ball was put in the box today, (I was shocked as well), he didn't make a serious effort to get it.
2. A simple cross into the box to him today and he didn't even jump for it.
3. 5 games no goals says it all.
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Don't worry about it too much, according to McCall we won't be judged on performances against the Old Firm.
Great, I'll just ask for my money back for the Old Firm games from my season ticket then.
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Once again we lose to this shite, with no fight.
We played the same way in THAT CUP FINAL against the other ugly sister.
When is the manager going to learn that we need some fight and belief in our team when we play the gruesome twosome?
We had width today with no penetration, they picked us off at will on the break.
Surely the boss could have seen that Humphrey was innefectual, Murphy was not doing it and there was no confidence at all in the team.
I don't know whether the players were told not to take a man on or not to shoot but that's what it looked like.
I am totally pissed off at our performances against the bigot brothers and am seriously considering whether to boycott these games unless we start to get fucked into this shite.
We need to play these bastards 4 times a year and the sisters another 4 times, that is 24 points a season that we sinply roll over and allow the scum to take from us.
For fucks sake McCall grow a set of balls and get fucked into the Old Firm, the referees are not, ever, going to give us anything so we might as well go down fighting.
Not lying down and getting humped like the pussies we were today.
I was embarrassed to be a Motherwell fan today.
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I jumped up when we scored and into the steps, (I sit next to the steps), when this steward guy asked me to go back to my seat, no kidding).
The guy was sooooo out of his depth and obviously just doing what he was told.
But seriously, no jumping about when your team scores, come on.
Also, if you are going to talk about Health and Safety, get the facts right, it is either safe or it isn't, no in between.
The patter about the making them quieter, what a load of shite, we want them louder.
Then it gets our fans louder, then making the atmosphere better.
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So it's a Health and Safety issue when it's raining, correct?
What happens when we play the ugly sisters and it's raining, do we shut the bottom of the South Stand????
NO!!!!!!
Pish talk about Health and Safety yet again.
If it was not safe it would never be used and never get a certificate.
P.S. I know of at least 2 contractors who can supply anti-slip to the stairs.
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I love the singing and I like to start it or keep it going in the Cooper,
loved the singing last week at Rugby Park, well done boys, that was brilliant.
One question to our esteemed stewards,
(one of whom asked me to sit down after we scored our goal as standing in the steps in the Cooper is a Health and Safety Issue.)??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck is the point in putting the away fans in the top of the South Stand????????
Are you trying to stop any atmosphere at the game???????
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What is wrong with wanting your teams new strip for going on holiday ????
FFSake all we see is auld squirm green and blue, all we want is our new strip when we go on holiday.
That's not too much to ask, is it?
We all know when the old season ends and new season begins
Let me think, when shall we make new strips ??????????
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£4.40 return from central, £5 to get in, I'll be there.
Motherwell to Argyle Street then walk up to Queen Street High Level for train to Dumbarton East.
Low level trains from Motherwell via Central don't go to Dumbarton East.
£4.40 Return from Queen Street, £6.70 Return from Motherwell.
You can stay on to Partick or Hyndland and change there, but I think a pint or 2 in the Counting House at George Square could be calling.
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ill be there i canny wait
anybody else getting the train to dumbartonI'll be getting the train about 12 ish.
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That reminds me - on the twitter description of our second goal last night, Saunders assist was described as a "Lovely ball across the corridor of uncertainty" - does anyone have any idea where that is?
Not sure where it is but I am sure I passed through it at least twice on my way hame from Odense.
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Gordy, fair play for trying to start a conversation. It's certainly better than some of the drivel that's been on here lately.
Thanks mate.
I obviously did not do enough research before posting, although I did google "Davie Hay" and saw that he was at Livi, but that was 2008.
I should have posted, for the benefit of the bawsack:
I spoke to Davie Hay today, he was coming from the direction of Fir Park and I spoke to him at the Civic.
(Just said to him that I enjoyed watching his team when we won the 1st division, early eighties)
Does anybody know why he was at Fir Park, I thought he was at Livingston,
Are we linked with anybody at Livingston or has anybody heard if they are trying to get one of our guys on loan or otherwise?
I apologise if there are any spelling mistakes or my grammar is incorrect in any way, please feel free to ridicule my post in any way you like.
Ya Dick
:whistling: 
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D'oh, I never thought of that????
I thought I would start a new post, you know, tell some fellow Well fans some information,
start a conversation, as you do on a supporters forum??????
I'll not bother now.
Smart Arse
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1. Celtic
2. Rangers
3. Hearts/ Dundee United
4. Dundee United/ Hearts
5. Hibs
6. Motherwell
7. Kilmarnock
8. Inverness
9. Dunfermline
10. Aberdeen
11. St Johnstone
12. St Mirren
I predict that there will be a conspiracy against Celtic and they will continue to bleat about the death threats to the yellow teethed ned and conveniently forget the death threats to Steve Conroy / Dougie MacDonald / the linesman resigning, Hugh Dallas getting sacked and everybody cowtowing to the moaning bastards.
The weegie meedja will love super sally and will cream themselves over every fekin thing he says even though his team will be shite and we will beat THEM this season.
Jim Jeffries will moan about everything and everybody even though his team will be dirty bastards again.
The season positions will be, I predict:
1 and 2, will be one of the evil two. The reason being the SPL, SFA, Scottish Government (new laws on sectarianism, my arse), and the scottish media couldn't let any one else win it.
In the opinion of all of them, they ARE Scottish Football. :wank: :wank:
3. Motherwell, I think Stuart McCal knows what he wants to do and when he brings his own players in it could be a very good season.
Another Cup Final, this time a victorious one?
4. Hearts, I hope Sutton does hee haw.
5. Kilmarnock
6. Dunfermline
7. Dundee Utd
8.St Johnstone
9 Inverness C.T.
10 Hibs
11 St Mirren
12 Aberdeen, with Broon and Knox claiming a bonus for keeping them in the top twelve by April
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If the ball had hit his arm at his side you could sympathise with the ref.
How can a hand ball from above the defenders head not be deemed deliberate and not deemed to deny an advantage to the opposition???
Get a grip, yellow card, second yellow, makes it a red, he is off, the whole dynamic of the game changes. subsequent events do not happen.
The referee shat his pants, changed the game and helped to deny us glory.
He is a shitebag and will go down in history as denying us a fair crack of the whip in a Cup Final.
Celtics constant whining about referees has paid off and we are the victims of that.
Well done you stinking evil bastards and well done referee, I hope you sleep well because you are not going to heaven, you lied, you did not do your job and I am embarrassed to support a team in this shitey, corrupt, Old Firm arse licking country.
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A wee poem for all our pessimmists out there
If you think you are beaten, you are
If you think you dare not, you don't,
If you like to win, but you think you can't
It is almost certain you won't.
If you think you'll lose, you're lost
For out of the world we find,
Success begins with a person's will
It's all in the state of mind.
If you think you are outclassed, you are
You've got to think high to rise,
You've got to be sure of yourself
Before you can ever win a prize.
Life's battles don't always go
To the stronger or faster man,
But sooner or later the man who wins
Is the man WHO THINKS HE CAN!
LIVE THE DREAM AND BELIEVE WE CAN DO THIS, COME ON THE WELL !!!
:yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: -
Current home top without the sponsor, cracking top, with my lucky cotton Well T shirt underneath.
My Lucky Well bar scarf, blue jeans to freak out the paranoid ones, (as has been mentioned) and I am wearing my lucky 1991
pants just in case I get lost and end up in the Celtic end.............at least I'll smell like them.
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As well as the players from 91 who passed away far too young, Davie Cooper, Phil O'Donnell, Jamie Dolan and Paul McGrillen,
My old man, Jim, pimmy, Irving who took me to my first game against Dumbarton, in 1966, I think.
Passed away in 2000. I am glad to say he was at the 1991 final with me as he had missed the 1952 final due to National Service with the R.A.F.
He took me to loads of games and I can remember going down to Stoke for the Texaco cup game, it was brilliant, also the game against Tottenham Hotspur we were in the Main Stand.
Fantastic memories, and as the title says, I will raise a glass for my da, my maw and my Nana as well as all former Well players and fans, (I knew Pat from Jack Daniels as well).
You don't miss someone until they are gone and I miss my parents and Nana so much as I am sure everybody else who has lost a parent or lived one does.
I just hope they have some power up there in Heaven and help us to lift this cup.
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It's got to be the 1991 semi final replay against them.
Inthe first game we hit the underside of the bar and a stonewall penalty not given (surprise, surprise).
Plus I got lifted by the polis for telling my mate that was 2 chances we had that could have won the game.....2.
Arrested by strathclydes finest for giving them the vickies as they passed???.
The replay was a wet, wet wednesday night. You don't get a second chance against cellic we were told.
Early goal for them, Dougie equalises, then they score again.
2 -1 down at half time. They were all over us.
Second half, Big Softy is playing brilliantly and almost scores with a header from a corner.
We need an equaliser, who can we turn to??? Up steps the hammer of the old firm, wee dooogie....2 - 2.
Throw in at the main stand side to Stevie Kirk, who flicks it inside to Psycho, he takes a stride forward, somebody shouts, "don't
hit it from there.......................................................GGGGOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLL.
I CAN STILL HEAR THE SOUND AS IT HIT THE BACK OF THE NET!!!!!
We all went mental, I think I fell 3 times but what a feeling we couldn't lose it now, could we?.
They are pushing forward, get a couple of corners the defence is under pressure but with a couple of minutes to go we get the ball in their penalty box they have the ball, wait a minute, young O'Donnell gets it plays it back to Kirk who chips it...................
........GGGGGGGOOOOOOOAAAAAALLLLLLLLL
:woop: .No way back for them now, We are in the final
WHAT A GAME. -
In my opinion we have got to have a five man midfield with big Sutts as target man.
My team would be: Randolph, great keeper.
Would go for Ross at right back, because of experience, but I think he is injured. I think it will be Saunders, hopefully, no mistakes and a threat at corners.
Hammell at left back. Solid and dependable. Left us then came back, he deserves a winners medal.
Big Hutchinson at centre half, we haven't missed Mark Reynolds with the big man in there, another threat at set peices.
Craigan our Captain, another guy who left and returned, talks big Hutch through the game and this will be the game of his life, he deserves it.
Hateley as the holding midfielder, sitting in front of the back four allowing Las and Jenno to push further forward.
Humphrey on the right, he has speed to burn and hopefully will run at the left back all day.
Keith Lasley in the centre mid, another guy who has left and came back, player of the year and will run himself into the ground to win this.
He told me that last night.
Steve Jennings beside Las. Another cracking player, will run all day.
Murphy on the left. his pace and dribbling skill will cause them all sorts of problems. Has really came on to a game recently and his confidence is sky high.
Sutton up front. A great target man and will be a handful for them.
Subs: Hollis, had a great game today. Forbes, looked alright today and played against them in the 2 - 0 game. Gunning, a good loan signing but not better than anybody in the team. Jeffers, good experience and link up play.
I can't make my mind up about the last place, McHugh, Meechan, Casagolda, Page or Jones?
I spoke to Stuart McCall last night and he wouldn't give me any clues about the team except to say that the guys rested today would be starters along with Hammell and Hutchy.
I think the other option could be, Hateley at right back, Saunders on the bench with Jeffers playing behind Sutton.
I think he will go for the more cautious approach which is a 4 - 5 -1 in defence to a 4 - 3 -3 in attack.
In McCall we trust.
Atmosphere At Fir Park
in Club Chat
Posted
Looking forward to it Dundee Utd game, I'm heading up on the train.
Can you switch season ticket seats?
I sit in the Davie Cooper, have done for years and I love where I sit.
However, my point is,I think the singing section is great.
I would like to go back to my young days, (middle of the shed and singing like feck all through the game) and join in with the singing section.
In my opinion, that is what football is all about, not the constant moaning and getting on some players' back
I am 50 though and would be slightly drunk and wanting to sing all the old 70's classics as well as the new ones, (I'm sure there are more of us out there).
Why don't the guys of my generation move to the section beside the singing section and take our kids with us, 3 generations of Well fans belting out Well songs for 90
minutes, we would have the best atmosphere in Scotland.