dennyc

That's the case every season regards Season Tickets and the cash generated from that source is used in all sorts of ways not directly related to matchdays. Its the additional income from cash paying fans on a match by match basis that will be used to cover/partly cover the actual cost of opening the stadium week to week. Last season our average home gate was just under 6000 , including visiting fans. Allowing for ST Holders that leaves around 2000 punters paying cash. At £15 a head (and I think I am underestimating) that works out at a minimum of £30000 per game cash income to cover costs. £570, 000 a season. At £20 a head that is over £750000 a season. Motherwell have likely lost that cash anyway this season, but to add to that loss by opening the ground long term for no financial return is madness. And I am pretty sure you would not be happy if attending games was limited to cash paying customers only in an effort to restrict losses. And as for losing income from Season Ticket holders by giving fans the option of carrying unattended games forward to next season, it is exactly that...an option. Having watched the games online I am positive many if not most fans will not take up that option. In my opinion Motherwell have handled the situation extremely well and that includes looking after Season Ticket holders.

In that case, if Killie cannot field a team against Falkirk through their own or their players negligence then they do not take part at all and it becomes a four team mini league. That way nobody but Killie are penalised and nobody is given an unfair advantage over the rest of the Group. If it happens later on in the Group their Earlier games are deleted from the standings. If it happens in knock out, then the opponent goes through. But none of that will happen as it would set a precedent that might hurt a big team. Hard to deny us the Cup if we get to a final and our opponents default through CoVid.

Kid comes home from school, infects his Dad who just happens to be a footballer. Dad infects team. Team forfeit game. Team get relegated by one point. And that's acceptable/ Really?

Not sure about nowadays, but there used to be a guideline that if any Club was stuck down with a bug affecting xxx number of players, or if they had above a specific number of players on International duty, a game could be called off if requested. CoVid should be treated just the same. That way you might just get some consistency and the St Mirrens of this world would not get shafted by random. illogical decisions. To pass the buck to local Health Boards is just abdication by our ruling body. Everybody knew teams were likely to be affected so why were no hard and fast rules put in place before the season kicked off? Example, Three first team squad members struck down or isolating and you play. Above those numbers, game off. Subject to independent medical confirmation. Might be a few more games cancelled than in normal times but we would cope with a little bit of effort. And no way should Kilmarnock be forfeiting any games, no matter how those players caught the infection. That action would affect more than the teams directly involved. If the Club or the players got it wrong, impose fines as with Aberdeen and Celtic. I can just see it now. Last game of the season and we need to beat Accies to avoid relegation or play off. Bug strikes and we have to forfeit a game for the first time all season and therefore are relegated. Cue meltdown.

I think this is spot on. And if there was no forfeiting of games as a result of Aberdeen and Celtic players blatant disregard of agreed practice, how can you punish Kilmarnock......no matter how the infection was caught? And I for one am delighted that Accies in Aberdeen's case and St Mirren (I think) in respect of Celtic are not sitting with an extra, unearned on the pitch, 3 points. Our League survival might be tough enough without the lottery of who gets CoVid and who does not. In truth Aberdeen and Celtic were punished, financially, which I think is reasonable as it punishes only them and not others who could be adversely affected by rivals being awarded league points. Then again forfeiture might be our only hope of defeating Rangers. St Mirren are the team which I think has a valid complaint and who should be demanding answers.. And we still don't know what the criteria is for cancelling games. Even now. Is it one player down, three, six? Or does your former manager need to be in charge of Scotland? Is the decision made by the local Health Board? That criteria should have been established and made known prior to a ball being kicked. But then again the people in charge of our game are not famous for being open and forward thinking. The contrast to cup games is a good point.

We really have to stop hiding behind lower Budgets, lesser quality players, expected results and referee bias. That has always been the case against the Old Firm..... and others. But today was way beyond that. It was embarrassing, So many poor performances , players out of position or hiding, and in a formation that must have had Gerrard licking his lips when he saw it. A formation that, not for the first time, totally exposed our defensive weaknesses and played into the hands (no pun intended) of a team whose strength is attacking at pace down the outside. We might occasionally get away with it against lesser teams but we need to be realistic. Many of our players are either not up to it or look uninterested. We are badly missing Donnelly and Carroll but our Manager and Coaches have had all season to work on that. Today was a day to shore up our structure, frustrate Rangers, build up some confidence and hopefully get something from the game. We might still have lost, but at least our opponents might have had to break sweat and put some thought onto how to break us down. it was all too easy for them.

At what cost to the Club? Staff. Police. Stewarding plus the expense of setting up and managing specialised seating and access arrangements would all have to be funded. I don't see Government helping with that cost. With no additional income as any fan quota would likely be insufficient to cover Season Ticket holders, never mind cash paying punters. And games would still require to be streamed for those ST Holders unable/not chosen to attend. At least that generates some offsetting income from away fans and non ST Holders. Pubs, restaurants, supermarkets, Gyms, Cinemas and the like receive cash from everybody who visits. In truth that is why they are open. Not out of public duty or for mental health reasons. Motherwell would receive no new income and it would drain vital cash resources. I do think there are mental health and social reasons why it would help to have fans back right now, but in a Commercial world it would not surprise me if Motherwell were accepting of the current arrangements for practical reasons. It might not be all about Government rulings, targeted or otherwise. So, although I honestly believe everybody would like to open up football grounds I really I don't think it is about blaming Football Authorities, Individual Clubs, Central Government, Local Politicians or the remote possibility of fans ignoring guidelines. It may be more about being financially prudent, even if given leeway. A brief, one or two game trial, before a fuller opening could be affordable for some clubs. But only on a short term basis and not for fifteen or twenty games in a row. Just guessing like everybody else, but I suspect both Aberdeen and Ross County conducted their trials in the hope of greater numbers of cash paying fans being allowed access in the very near future. Perhaps even away fans. But the increase in infections has put paid to that. With lower league Clubs the Season Ticket numbers might not be so great so possibly they might get some financial benefit from a few cash paying spectators. . But it might be minimal and might not be sustainable longer term for them either. I am sure the Highland League were quoted recently as being on the verge of cancelling their abbreviated season which is due to start in October? if greater fan access cannot take place.

So you confirm your approach is mainly Political. Good to have that confirmed once and for all. Social gatherings of any description can lead to rising infection rates. That's a fact you cannot deny. There are numerous examples in sport and elsewhere, in the UK and overseas. Some have been listed but you choose to ignore that evidence to suit your own purposes. As another example, a charity football match in England resulting in a requirement for 300 folk to isolate. Restricting Social Gatherings across all settings is a sensible response as is trying to find an economic and mental health balance. Until an effective vaccine is available to all, I hope our Club and our Government continue to take a cautious and realistic approach.

Football is irrelevant in the scheme of things. Socially and psychologically it would be great to get to matches but there is a bigger picture. And from a financial point of view, it would be a drain on the Club for little purpose. No income whatsoever as attendance limited to existing Season Ticket holders and no retail outlets open. Furloughed staff brought back to facilitate opening the ground plus Police and Steward costs. There is a reason our club is not pushing this. The Club has a structure that is coping fairly well, so why change that. And as for outdoor events, there is no guarantee of safety with regard to CoVid. There is no bigger an outdoor sporting event than Cheltenham Races and that did not work out well. And an outdoor Rugby event in Italy was the source of many of the original infections in this country. Travelling and socialising are part of sport and that will happen if fans are allowed back, regardless of any guidelines. But as you wish to push your Political agenda, how many track and trace findings identifying football attendance as the source do you think it would take to enable shutting down sport at all levels indefinitely?

All set up. Thanks guys.

Thanks. Looks like I will need to try that way in. Cheers

Can any Season Ticket holder advise how to view the PPV games? As a ST holder who watches the "freebie" games using the ST link to the live games, do I also need to Register as a paying customer to access the PPV games. Could not link into the Aberdeen game via my usual page and eventually gave up trying. Thanks

If the Israeli Government say no way the game can be played in Israel, then it’s up to Hapoel to find a neutral venue. No doubt with UEFA guidance. If they fail to do that, then the tie is awarded to us. On the other hand, if the Israeli Government give it the go ahead, and our Government says we cannot travel to Israel, then we forfeit. That’s per a clarifying statement made by UEFA a few weeks ago regarding potential CoVid cancellations. Quite clear cut about who is regarded as defaulting if a game is not played. I suggest Airdrie as a neutral option. More likely Cyprus.

Agree with you regards the pitch. It was shocking and I actually think our players coped with it as best they could. But Coleraine had several excellent chances to score other than the penalties. Two in particular showed up our central defence ..... the free header just before we scored and the volley over the bar from a free kick second half. Most teams would have scored those but thankfully we got off the hook. I don't think the pitch or the referee should be used to gloss over just how poor we were and that there are serious issues that need addressed. Let's pay heed to the warnings we have had rather than dismiss them because of factors outwith our control. Just thankful we got through.

same

The main thing holding us back is that some folk cannot be trusted to act reasonably. That and the fact that some footballers think guidance does not apply to them, bubble or no bubble

Exactly this. And many of the projected round three seeds are away from home in round two so there might well be a few shocks. But we have to get through our tie first before it would mean anything to us. And by no means are we guaranteed to win in N Ireland. But hope is a great pick me up.

The draw for the third round assumes all the second round seeds progress and on that basis we will be unseeded tomorrow as too many higher ranked teams will be in the draw. To continue our run in the Anglo Irish cup all that is required is for us to draw Shamrock Rovers on the basis they beat AC Milan first up. Seriously though, I assume the groupings for the draw will be revealed later today. And there is a good chance some of the projected seeds will fall in the second round providing some lucky teams a better chance of further success. But I doubt Shamrock Rovers will be one of them.

And what did you hear regards Sell on Fee. I was told “Celtic don’t do sell ons unless we are the sellers”. Hopefully not true but concerning.

From the Celtic end. Hopefully not accurate. £2.75m plus £250 k in add ons. ....eventually. Two players coming our way on loan. Ewan Henderson and Scott Robertson. Both midfielders apparently . I’ve never heard of them. And no mention of a sell on fee.

I actually think it was correct to disallow the goal because of where Seedorf was positioned. Otherwise football is a farce. But nobody (other than Hanlon funnily enough) has homed in on the fact that a defender DELIBERATELY played the ball. Have a look at the Law for offside which was amended a few years ago. A defender DELIBERATELY playing at the ball can result in a player in an offside position being deemed onside. So if Seedorf had touched the ball there is a strong case that it should have stood. Most referees ignore that ruling but it does exist. Just ask Man City who went out of the Champions League because of it three years ago. Not saying it is sensible but it is a factor and it clouds the issue. They have mucked about with the offside rule so much that it is now almost unworkable. I think that is why Hanlon went to great lengths to emphasise that he only played at the ball because Seedorf was behind him. But really, if we lost a goal in those circumstances every Motherwell fan would be going nuts.

To play right back.

Streaming but no sound. Watching players warming up.

Can someone post when the stream starts so folk know if they should be seeing something other than the countdown timer.

Maybe a permanent deal to be done if Kipre sold soon or in January and we can fund it from our cut of that. Would not surprise me if that was the case.