David

Yeah, I didn't really believe it had anything to do with my thread 😁

Within hours of me starting this thread. oops! 🤣

The problem, at least in some ways, for me is that we hired the current head of recruitment based on their relationship with the manager at the time. Daws worked with Alexander as his assistant at Scunthorpe United, and was obviously Alexander's choice to replace Foyle. The question I have is, did Foyle signal his intent to leave when Robinson got the boot? Or was he effectively removed to make way for Alexander's choice? For a club our size, the head of recruitment is a huge position, and isn't something that should be chosen by whoever the manager at the time is. If Foyle was ousted to make way for Daws then serious questions need to be asked, as he was doing a good job by all accounts.

Well, it's an internet forum and the football is giving me the fear, so it's worth a try 😂 Seriously though, I just thought it would be worth mentioning some of the other key players at the club to try and open to conversation from just slating the manager and players.

Although Daws hasn't been here that long I'd have to agree. I think Foyle did a really good job for us.

Can't really argue against any of those changes, although I would say that there's a chance Penney might still be here. Discussions are apparently ongoing. I'd maybe not drop Spittal, as he's most likely to score a goal at the moment alongside Van Veen, but would definitely look to replace Shields with McKinstry.

With Hammell under the spotlight and being scrutinised, I thought it only fair that some of the other key figures at the club see the same discussion. So, Nick Daws. Appointed head of recruitment on June 11th 2021, he was brought in the season after Alexander replaced Robinson, replacing Martin Foyle. It's obvious that Daws was Alexander's guy, having worked with him previously. Let's look at the transfer business we've done since he came in: Justin Amaluzor Kaiyne Woolery Kevin van Veen Liam Kelly Darragh O'Connor Mich'el Parker Callum Slattery Juhani Ojala Sean Goss Sondre Johansen Ross Tierney Jordan Roberts (Initial loan from Hearts, then permanent signing) Victor Nirennold Joseph Efford Robbie Mahon Liam Shaw (Loan from Celtic) Blair Spittal Paul McGinn Josh Morris Aston Oxborough Shane Blaney Stuart McKinstry (Loan from Leeds) Matt Penney (Loan from Ipswich) Rolando Aarons (Loan from Huddersfield) Louis Moult (Loan from Burton) One thing I would point out is that Amaluzor, Woolery, Van Veen and Kelly all arrived within a month of Daws taking the job, so how much we can consider them to be his signings I'm not sure, but it's worth considering that those players were most likely identified if not already being spoken to by the time Daws came in. Anyway, that's his transfer incomings thus far.

All of that is fair, even if I don't necessarily agree that parting ways with him at that stage was a good move. I hope to be proven wrong and Hammell turns things around and secures an 8th or 7th place finish.

Hibs fans are saying the same thing about their team.

Think he'll be heading down south if he does leave United. He won't be coming back here I wouldn't imagine.

Hold on, you can't have someone bring up the fact that the clubs being mentioned have fairly significant investment and have fallen down the leagues in recent years and reply with "that aside." You can't cast that aside, it's the very crux of the point being made. I may be in the minority here, but I didn't really care. It would have been nice to move to the next round in Europe before being papped out, but the fact is that every Scottish side is done and dusted in Europe before too long anyway. We went into the Sligo games the way most Scottish clubs do when they qualify for Europe. Not match fit, and with a squad that was still being changed with comings & goings. By my reckoning we'd played two friendly games before the first Sligo game, one against an Austrian mob while we were over there, and the other against Thistle. Alexander had voiced his frustration at planned away friendlies being cancelled for reasons outwith the clubs control, and obviously we couldn't play any at home due to the pitch being renovated. Excuses? No, they're simply part of the reason we were nowhere near match fit when we faced Sligo. A Sligo side it must be said, who were five months deep into their season. It was a recipe for disaster, as it is for many Scottish clubs who get caught on the hop by these teams who come into games match-fit and in a rhythm. It was a game we should have won, but losing it wasn't the end of the world. Not in my opinion anyway. We'll see more results like that, by the way, the longer we persist with winter football. That in itself is sheer madness, considering out winter weather, but that's a discussion for another thread. This I agree 100% with.

With Dundee United playing Rangers after our game on Sunday we'll need to hope the blue side of Glasgow can do us a turn there, and that Livingston can do something against Ross County away the day before. I think a point minimum against Hibs would suffice if Rangers beat United, and all three against Ross County the following game. Obviously a win in both would be preferable.

If we sign one or two players in this window it signals to me what I know about the January window, and that is that it's a very difficult window to do anything in unless you're a big club with sizeable resources. How many teams are going to be offloading players of the quality we'd need mid-season? At best you're getting a few loan signings in, with maybe a free agent being available. But the summer is when the real work is done, and Hammell didn't really get that.

Tony Watt left because he was offered more money by a club that has more resources than we do, simple as that. O'Hara? Yeah, I'm not sure he fit into Alexander's way of playing. That's not to say he isn't a good player, but if he's not suited to the system or style of play then there's no point in him being here. It's football. It happens. If you're talking about comments I made, all I've done is state facts when it comes to Alexander's time as manager. I do that because there's this mental obsession with reframing his time here to suit the agenda of reassuring ourselves that despite league positions, win percentages, and points totals he actually wasn't that good. His style of football wasn't easy on the eye, and he certainly didn't lack confidence in himself or suffer fools gladly, which rubs certain people the wrong way. That's fair enough, but we knew all of that before hiring him. My main issue with how he left was the timing of it. I've said numerous times that we should either have got rid of him as soon as the season finished, as irrational as that would have been considering we'd finished 5th in the table, but it would certainly have been preferable to giving him the summer and then parting ways two days before the league kicked off, or kept him until around November or December and seen if he could get the team back on track. The board made a mistake in how they allowed that to play out. And the truth is, we're potentially going to pay for that with relegation. It was the type of move you see clubs who end up getting relegated making, and although we're not usually the type of club to do that, it's happened. The bigger question now is does the board allow the same disgruntled voices who played a part in Alexander moving on to influence how we deal with Hammell? Parting ways with a manager days before the league season starts is worrying and as I mentioned, the kind of behaviour you see from clubs who tend to end up in relegation trouble. But binning said managers replacement five months later is even worse. We had a choice when we appointed Hammell. We could have gone down the route of another Alexander type who likely would have kept us up (as I'm sure Alexander himself would have), but we wanted someone young, fresh, likeable, and who played exciting football. Well, now we have that. But we're finding out that being likeable and playing football that perhaps isn't as difficult to watch doesn't mean success. But Hammell is the man in the seat now, and we need to back him. Changing manager again, for the second time in a season would be a disaster. There's not many clubs who do that kind of thing and go on to succeed.

It's the January window. We'll be lucky to get one or two quality signings, never mind thinking we can retool the squad in the window that is universally known as terrible to work in unless you have insane amounts of money to spend.

Those "duds" finished 5th last season. And I know, "lucky, nothing to do with Alexander, every other team was crap etc" but the facts are the facts. His record over his time with us is an 8th place and 5th place finish. And while the results weren't great in the 2022 half of the season, we secured 46 points last season for a 5th place finish. By comparison we finished 8th on 45 points the season before when Alexander took over from Robinson, and the year previous when we finished 3rd under Robinson, which was looked upon as a successful season, we finished 3rd on 46 points. So it's not as if we were terrible but secured 5th on a lower points threshold than ever before. Alexander attained success by any barometer a club like Motherwell can be measured by. But the fans weren't happy with that, they wanted more exciting football and a manager who was more likeable. Now we've got that. There's every chance that we excitingly play our way into the Championship.

Kelly for me. Any time a keeper can save two penalties in one game he has to considered for the MOTM award.

The problem is, he was brought in literally two days before the league season started, and was given the job on a permanent basis on August 11th, two games in. It was the worst possible scenario, as I've said a few times before. At that stage we should have kept Alexander until December or so and seen if he could get the players back on track. It was sheer madness to give him the summer, allowing him to bring in three first-team players on permanent contracts then part ways days before the league season started. We should either have parted company at the end of last season, or stuck with him until November/December depending on results. This mess is as a result of the board royally fucking up. And it's out of character, as we normally don't do that when it comes to how we work with managers. If we appoint Hammell in August then bin him before he's really had a transfer window to work with it'll just add to the chaos, as the next manager will be coming in with the January window already open and in progress and will have to rush some signings in and try to get the team on track. That kind of behaviour is what leads to relegation. We've thrown ourselves into this position with some horrific decision making. Now the board must decide if they follow that up with some more mental decision making or stick with a young manager that seemingly impressed enough to get the job on a permanent basis only five months ago, giving him a window to get some players in who can play how he wants the team to play, and then reassess in the summer.

Four points from the next two is required I think, otherwise it could spell trouble for Hammell.

So, a draw. I'll take that.

As I've said before, we've been in this kind of position before, where fans are writing us off and claiming we're done for, only for us to go out and win 3-0. Outside the Cold Firm and whichever team is sitting third most seasons, every other Scottish side couldn't be separated with a fag paper. We could just as easily win this 3-0 as we could lose it 3-0. I fancy us for the draw, but wouldn't be surprised if we absolute run over them, or if they run over us.

Depends what he wants to do I guess. He's nearly 35 now, and as you mention, his levels were waning shortly before he left us almost three years ago, so how much more does he have to offer at a decent level? I wouldn't be against him coming back as part of the backroom team in some capacity. He seems like he was a good guy to have around the club.

On the evidence that outside the old firm and maybe Hearts the rest of the league is very unpredictable and fairly even. Again, we've seen this kind of thing before, multiple times per season with us. We could very easily go on to beat Livingston 3-0. And just as easily go on to lose to them 3-0. Most teams in our league are much of a muchness I think.

Onto the next one. History shows we rarely get anything from the old firm (except last season, when Alexander managed to grab two draws at Ibrox. Probably a total fluke and nothing to do with him at all, mind) so we move onto the next games which are all winnable. How many times have we been in a position where the fans are all saying "nah, we're done for. No points from the next three" only for us to go on and put three past our next opponents and manage to kick on a little?

You're kidding, right? I said that I think he's mostly wrong in his predictions. That's far from personal, especially when you see some of the ways in which members call out each others opinions on this forum. You can respond as you wish, and I'll do the same. I think we can both agree that I said absolutely nothing personal in my post. I addressed his comments, which I find to be negative, not him personally. He's free to make them, of course, and he's also free to disagree with me. On the topic at hand, Moult just completed 90 minutes, which is a positive. Let's hope that's a sign he's on his way back to full fitness and being able to contribute more to the team.