WishyWell Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I'm just disappointed that it was a 'Well fan who chose to paint us in such a bad light. He may very well not have had that choice to make. The nationals scour the locals every week, and if it was on the front page of the Wishaw Press, as someone said, then it wouldn't have been hard to spot. If Scott was told to do the story, it would have seriously harmed his career chances if he were to refuse on the grounds that he supported the club, especially if he is trying to make his way in the trade. Reporters are supposed to write dispassionately about a subject (which makes it extremely noticeable when they, wrongly, inject their opinion into an article). I'm sure we can all think of examples of stories that have infuriated us because opinion or bias has come into it, rather than objective reporting. He is there to give the facts as they are, not to moralise on whether he should or shouldn't be carrying out the task assigned to him, or whether the story should be covered. That moralising is fine for readers, as that is their prerogative. I'm sure Scott didn't enjoy writing the story (or the fact that his name was attached to it, which, again, is not his choice), but wee all have things we are asked to do in our jobs that we don't like - if we could pick and choose the good bits of our jobs, wouldn't life be great? For the record, if you'll pardon the expression (!), I am not saying that people shouldn't be able to come on here and give their opinion, just that the criticism of Scott personally, without knowing how it works, was unfair. I don't know the guy, but 20-odd years ago I was in his position, and it's a harder and worse job now than it was then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottW1886 Posted July 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 The previous post was halted because it went down the road of naming and shaming the 2 guys....... For what it's worth, the press read these message boards, and there was a huge thread on the matter - I'm surprised it wasn't reported sooner. We have 2 posters who don't hide the fact that they are journalists, and neither they should by the way, but a story of this nature was bound to end up in the papers eventually. Would it have been worth the club getting their retaliation in first and issuing a story to the press agency expressing their disappointment at the incident and outlining their decision to ban the culprits? I don't know if that would have been positive or not right enough..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Jeez, give the guy a break. Now I don't know Scott or even knew what he did for a living before opening this thread, but as far as I can see that story is FACTUALLY correct. Does it warrant a mention in the local press? Absolutley. National? I would say so. I have a close mate who works freelance and it causes him no end of annyoance that what he submits isn't what gets printed. Would Scott have a say in the story getting picked up at a national level. I strongly doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numpty Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 To be fair to Scott, we also don't know what he actually wrote. By the time a story has been sub-edited to match the available space and the paper's idea of what makes a good story (and this is The Sun we're talking about here), it doesn't necessarily bear much resemblance to the original copy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WishyWell Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Would it have been worth the club getting their retaliation in first and issuing a story to the press agency expressing their disappointment at the incident and outlining their decision to ban the culprits? Definitely, but they will have been unable to do so once the arseholes had been arrested (sub judice). This may also explain the delay in the Wishy P and Sun reporting on it, as the article said that the pair have been released without charge, so the reporting restrictions would not apply from that point on. The club would have to weigh up the possibilities: would there be a chance that the nationals would miss the story, and would MFC then want to bring it to their attention; or would it be better to bring it to them from the angle the club want it presented... although, as has been said, the paper would then take the angle they wanted, if they saw it differently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milo Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Can anyone else not beleive the two guys were released without charge!?!?! If that wasn't deserving of being charged with a whole host of things then I don't know what is! I guess the police and courts would rather pursue those vicious litterers and bald tyre drivers...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punk_in_drublic Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 How many people complain that Old Firm loving journalists don't write enough about the despicable behaviour of their fans? Bit of hypocrisy here, in my opinion. Can't believe people are so outraged at what's been written. One of our most loyal supporters has been viciously assaulted, and we're supposed to sweep it under the carpet and keep it hush-hush?! The only guilty party in this whole sorry fiasco are the two scum who initiated the assault. He reported the truth, which is pretty uncommon it appears. He reported that the club have shown care and condolence for one of their most loyal supporters. Exactly what problem has Scott caused here? Agreed mate, i cant see the bad in whats been written, the primary source of displeasure in the article is the event itself. The story is true, its a fact we all know about, and stories like this make the papers every single day, nothing should make Motherwell FC stories exepmt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star sail Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Did the reporter mis report anything? No. Basically he did his job and arseholes on a forum being judgemental over someone legitimatley earning a crust is just pathetic. I agree that he has every right to print the story and that infact he should. That he may be a Motherwell Fan actually makes it more commendable in many respects. The only thing I don't understand is why, when there is a chance to print a balanced story of the good and the bad do we only get the bad? The arguement that bad news is more sellable may be true but thats all in the headline. There can be no reason why there was not a mention of the good aspects of the Wales trip (the march, fanzone etc) further down the article. There can be no suggestion of hidden agenda either because why would a Scottish Editor want to mindlessly rubbish a Scottish team in Europe? I fully understand the need to print the story, I just dont understand why it was not more balanced. If the writer of the article does contribute on hear it would be interesting for him to give us an insight into the working of such a story. After all he is the pro and knows more about it than any of us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frazzie Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Just to re-iterate, there's not a lot wrong with what's been written, although it could be more balanced. The disappointment stems from it being a 'Well fan who wrote it and, rather than spinning it from an angle that two yobs attempted to tarnish the otherwise excellent behaviour of our fans, and that the club acted swiftly and professionally in dealing with it, the focus is on "Motherwell fans attack pensioner" which is a shame. In no way, shape or form am I saying that the episode itself should be swept under the carpet. Without wanting to turn this into the last thread, I still believe these two idiots should be named and shamed, and I hope justice (of some form) is served. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swordfish Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Agreed mate, i cant see the bad in whats been written, the primary source of displeasure in the article is the event itself. The story is true, its a fact we all know about, and stories like this make the papers every single day, nothing should make Motherwell FC stories exepmt. Agree with this, I see nothing to complain about in the article. So what if we get portrayed in a bad light, the fact is, it was our fans that did it, no getting away from it. No need to be so precious about our club or our support. The fact that every other fan apart from these 2 morons was well behaved is just not news, especially not to rags like the Sun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KirkySuperSub Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 We seem to be going round in circles here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodge Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Would it have been worth the club getting their retaliation in first and issuing a story to the press agency expressing their disappointment at the incident and outlining their decision to ban the culprits? I don't know if that would have been positive or not right enough..... The club dealt with it the way they should have, by dealing with it quietly and effeciently. The ones to blame for making this newsworthy are those who contributed to the first thread on the subject with everyone lining up what they thought should happen to the individuals concerned. As you say we know the papers read these boards and everyone should thiink on this when they post in future as did folk really need to read 50+ threads on how folk thought it was out of order. The club've dealt with it effectively without wanting any praise or putting any positive spin on it as they were forced to take action because of the actions of a few. Instead the posters on here have contributed in making sure this negative story was reported much wider than it should've been. In saying that, its always disappointing when the club is being shat on in the press and its all the more disappointing when its one of our own who's doing it. Some folk are trying to pin it on the editor or whoever else when the truth is that its Scott's name beside it. As factual as the story maybe, its the last thing the club needed or wanted. I don't know the reasons why Scott chose to write the story but there are a couple of Well fans in the media who've managed to stay away from putting their own club in a poor light so lets not make up any excuses for Scott. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WishyWell Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Just to re-iterate, there's not a lot wrong with what's been written, although it could be more balanced. The disappointment stems from it being a 'Well fan who wrote it and, rather than spinning it from an angle that two yobs attempted to tarnish the otherwise excellent behaviour of our fans, and that the club acted swiftly and professionally in dealing with it, the focus is on "Motherwell fans attack pensioner" which is a shame. In no way, shape or form am I saying that the episode itself should be swept under the carpet. Without wanting to turn this into the last thread, I still believe these two idiots should be named and shamed, and I hope justice (of some form) is served. The 'Well fan who wrote it was also, I am sure, disappointed he was given this to do. Neither would he decide the angle that was taken. He probably feels the same way as the rest of us, but also has to put up with varying degrees of stick for having his name on it. On your second point, that is now an interesting matter. Now that they have been released without charge, I don't believe there is any restriction on anyone on this forum or anywhere else naming them, as long as anything you say is factually correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frazzie Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 The 'Well fan who wrote it was also, I am sure, disappointed he was given this to do. Neither would he decide the angle that was taken. He probably feels the same way as the rest of us, but also has to put up with varying degrees of stick for having his name on it. On your second point, that is now an interesting matter. Now that they have been released without charge, I don't believe there is any restriction on anyone on this forum or anywhere else naming them, as long as anything you say is factually correct. Surely then they could've been named and shamed in the article, which would have correctly put the disgrace of the incident onto the individuals, rather than 'Motherwell fans'? Also, if the journalist is told what story to write about, and how to write it, what are these people being paid to do? I just don't buy that, I'm afraid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trucks Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Its the journalists fault. Fucking hell, the guys doing a job. If it came to my job and Motherwell, I'd be nowhere near Fir Park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nony Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I don't think Scott probably had much of a choise on the matter, he was probably just assigned to write the story. And even then, it's probably been ripped appart, sensationalised and published. The fact that they asked a Motherwell fan to write such as story about his own club says more about them testing the limits than it does Scott. As was previously mentioned, his refusal could have severly damaged his career - not so easy to say no when your mortgage/bills being paid culd be put at stake. Another witch hunt against him isn't necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nethertonwellfan Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Can anyone else not beleive the two guys were released without charge!?!?! If that wasn't deserving of being charged with a whole host of things then I don't know what is! I guess the police and courts would rather pursue those vicious litterers and bald tyre drivers...... This time it had nothing to do with the police it was the old man who didn't want to press charges. So the scum that done it got lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frazzie Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I don't think Scott probably had much of a choise on the matter, he was probably just assigned to write the story. And even then, it's probably been ripped appart, sensationalised and published. The fact that they asked a Motherwell fan to write such as story about his own club says more about them testing the limits than it does Scott. As was previously mentioned, his refusal could have severly damaged his career - not so easy to say no when your mortgage/bills being paid culd be put at stake. Another witch hunt against him isn't necessary. I don't think there's a witch-hunt. Talk about sensationalism right enough! Just an expression of disappointment, is all. I know Scott and he's a good guy, but good guys can sometimes disappoint and I'm afraid public criticism is part of the package when you take a job in the media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl_mfc Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 And even then, it's probably been ripped appart, sensationalised and published. The story looks pretty accurate to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_P Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I think there's a few different strands to this. In any such circumstance the aggressors have to accept whatever punishment comes their way for their actions from the authorities, the club and having to face the shame of their actions being reported in the media. I don't disagree that this incident merits a place in the local and national newspapers and there is little that can be contested about the content. For me though there's a feeling of disappointment because its another very public blow to the reputation of our club and our support. It may well be deserved but for those who have travelled all over the UK and beyond representing the club in the best possible fashion its a kick in the teeth that we will all be saddled the same by people unable or unwilling to make any distinction. Readers of the Sun don't get to hear about 2000-3000 Motherwell fans making friends in Nancy and Llanelli - they get the stories about tear gas from Robocops, of racial abuse of black St Johnstone and Hearts players (even if it was a figment of Chic Young's imagination). They hear of supposed racial abuse of James McCarthy. And now they read of a near 80 year old getting a kicking off other Motherwell fans. They must think we are all scum - and we have little or no means to able to refute that or highlight the positives of our support and that's what rankles. And whilst Motherwell fans as a whole will have to take a backlash for the actions of these two I can understand why some feel disappointment that this has not stemmed from Hugh Keevins, Chic Young or Darryl Broadfoot whom we would expect to twist the knife at every opportunity - but this has been brought to public attention by a Motherwell fan! I fully accept the requirements of the journalists job and that much could have happened following his article being submitted, but the thought that its stemmed from the pen/laptop of a Motherwell fan just doesn't seem to sit right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Diggle Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I think Scotts getting a bit of a doing here. I don't have the facts but would like to think the story was balanced before it was handed over to the editorial team. I think we'd have reacted badly / worse if someone else had written it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Stall Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Its the journalists fault. Fucking hell, the guys doing a job. If it came to my job and Motherwell, I'd be nowhere near Fir Park. Agree 100%! I pay Motherwell for the pleasure, sometimes displeasure of watching them. My career pays the bills, pays my season ticket, golf membership, holidays, beer tokens etc etc. Theres no comparison. You do your job first and foremost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Would you have preferred it if an Airdrie fan did the write-up? What if 2 Scotland fans had done this at Hampden? Would all Scottish journalists be betraying their country if they wrote a piece on it? Seriously, if you can't be dispassionate when you write a story, then you have no chance of making it as a journalist. The anger should be directed at the scumbags who hit the old man. Shooting the messenger is pointless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star sail Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I think Scotts getting a bit of a doing here. I don't have the facts but would like to think the story was balanced before it was handed over to the editorial team. I think we'd have reacted badly / worse if someone else had written it. Reading through this thread I would say it's actually fairly balanced. Some defending the journalist, some attacking. Views both ways have been expressed. I agree that had a Old Firm bias journo written this it would be carnage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nony Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Readers of the Sun don't get to hear about 2000-3000 Motherwell fans making friends in Nancy and Llanelli - they get the stories about tear gas from Robocops, of racial abuse of black St Johnstone and Hearts players (even if it was a figment of Chic Young's imagination). They hear of supposed racial abuse of James McCarthy. And now they read of a near 80 year old getting a kicking off other Motherwell fans. You're being a bit presumptous in assuming those that buy the Sun can read Unfortunately it's the old adage of bad news travelling fast. Have a bad meal in a restaurant you tell 11 people or somthing. Have a great meal and you tell about 3 people. People want to read about bad things, people enjoy sitting on their high horse moralising. Like Weeyin said, don't shoot the messenger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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