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I think other teams fans forum are the same ( apart from some walloper always trying to cracking jokes! 🤪🤪) Every time we lose a game there is always a post mortem . Despite fact we were unbeaten in 6 games before that with a new team still being formed ( one being approx £500,000). Plus a horrendous injury list. Yet.......we are 2 games away from group stage of European football which is incredible. Yes a tough ask but with a bouncing fir park on Thursday right behind AJ and lads then hopefully it keeps us in with a chance. Once we please get a striker in and get injured players back i think we eill just fine. COYW

As you say He didn't give up one cup for the other, his hand was forced. Some fans dont want to see the reasons, just want someone to blame. Like them we are disappointed too but acknowledge the situation.

But lets be honest the squad on a whole isnt good enough to compete because we should have enough depth to beat Stenhousemuir.What if by some miracle we get to the group stage?How is that going to pan out. And the way its going unless we get bodies of a standard then its going to be a very very long season I would also add it doesnt help at all when a few first team players are not at the races aswell ie Vogts and Maswanhise.It felt like we started with nine men on Sunday. My point is do I blame the boss no however I think we need bodies right now that can do the basics to the level required we dont have to be down to the decimal point for every signing.

Don't forget he set up the team for :- Helsinki at Fir Park and we played them off the park. Never got beat by our jinks team Falkirk. Beat Hibs away. Stenny team picked to suit injurys and a shitty pitch, hands tied a bit on this one. All after some of our best players had been sold He has come in and followed on pretty seemlessly. He's doing a great job already.

Agree,but watt,just and slattery absolutely huge loss for us,i never expected us be anywhere near last years performances,if we lose fadinger,priestman,said were in big shit,attacking mid and front men we need recruited.

The job at Motherwell after JBA left was probably one of the toughest you could get . Not sure many would have fancied that gig . Not only replacing one of if not our best ever managers imo who took us to 4th place and some of the best football I’ve seen played at FP . So he comes over having not played at a high or even decent level and fully commits by bringing his young family over then sees his best players leave and a major injury list headache . In my humble opinion that’s takes a lot of b**ls to be able to deal with these early issues and he’s only what 35/36 ? im not expecting a similar season as last but if we finish the season still playing the same way and still in this league I’ll be delighted . For me anything else will be a bonus so as it is I’m fully behind Alfie and I feel the majority are although as is life nowadays there will be a few out there getting twitchy on the seats at the game or the same on their keyboards ready to pounce when it’s not going well . Thats life I suppose but as proved last year if we’re all in it together the good AND the bad times well be fine Alfie will find his feet and with new signings hopefully enjoy the rollercoaster of the MFC.

Jba team didn't set the Heather on fire initially , we have lost 3 top players from our midfield so does anyone really think we should be as good as the team that finished last year. I dont think we will lose many goals next year so that may balance the loss of our midfield. Some Fitba fans love to catastrophise as well as be unrealistic

I dont think up until the last few years I appreciated how much of a leveller a plastic pitch was..the one on Sunday was the worst ive seen and shouldn't be allowed at senior level...good luck to Stenny , use everything to your advantage

I think the manager does have free reign to pick the team. However, given our current injury situation, he would be mad to go against the sports scientists and risk picking up more unwanted injuries. Imagine if something had happened to Koutroumbis & Longelo and we went into the Freiburg game with Ross and Wilson as fullbacks? This place would go into meltdown. Folk are more than entitled to their opinions on players, but the realities of modern day football means sometimes a managers hands are tied. Hopefully we can put together a stronger team for Freiburg and consign this episode to history.

I mean, feel free to scroll right past if long posts aren't your thing. Or even if my particular posts aren't your thing. God knows I scroll past plenty on here without passing comment. It's a football internet forum. Discussion and opinions, arguments, debates, all that, is exactly what it's for.

This might help with the ground making money Motherwell’s first drive through bottle shop

We've had a number of posts which would rival the gettysburg address in length and verbosity, to try to communicate a simple fact, ie Wilson, Ross, whyte and Booth are not at the standard we need in the team, despite having several opportunities to prove otherwise. Will they ever make the standard, im not so sure as there is scant evidence to support that assumption from what we have seen so far. If there is anything good to be taken from the shambles at Ovhilview on Sunday its that the aforementioned players are nowhere near ready to be starting first team games, so i hope AJ has learned this for the future, especially when we have a fit squad available.

A bad day at the office

Since the latest we can change the list is Thursday morning, I’d imagine that some on the list won’t be fit for Thursday but might be fit enough for the following Thursday and are added for that reason.

As you know, I've never really been arguing that Wilson or Ross are going to become first-team regulars. They might, they might not. My point is that a club like Motherwell needs a squad, and not every player in that squad is going to be of the standard where we'd happily have them starting 30 Premiership games a season. If they were, they probably wouldn't be squad players at Motherwell for very long. Wilson is a decent example. He's 21 and already has a decent number of Premiership appearances. He made a chunk of them for us in 2024/25, got into the Scotland U21 squad and earned another contract. Then JBA arrived and brought in Longelo. Longelo hit the ground running from what I can recall, scored against Rangers and Hearts early on? And went on to have an excellent season, with nine goals in all competitions and a Player of the Year nomination. There's a reason why we're often talking about him potentially being sold on. Wilson went to Raith shortly after Longelo established himself, and JBA actually explained the thinking at the time. We'd added competition in Wilson's position and the club wanted him getting games elsewhere rather than sitting around waiting for the odd opportunity. Does Wilson's failure to completely nail down a place at Raith raise questions about how far he's progressed since that breakthrough season? Absolutely. I think that's fair. But there's quite a jump from that to saying he's clearly not good enough to be part of a Premiership squad. Those are two different standards. Luca Ross is even younger. He turned 20 last week. At 18, he went to Annan, made over 30 appearances, started 20 or so and played every minute of their four play-off matches. We considered that loan successful enough to give him another contract. Last season he made 14 appearances for us if I recall. Again, maybe he doesn't ultimately become a regular. Most academy players don't, sadly. But Motherwell aren't trying to assemble 22 players who are all established Premiership starters. We couldn't afford to do that even if we wanted to. You need your better players, then you need competition for places, experienced cover, younger players developing underneath them and players who can come into the team when injuries, suspensions and fixture congestion dictate it. That's particularly relevant now that we're trying to deal with European football on top of everything else. We've seen the chat of injuries mounting up and it's only mid-August. The obvious downside is that when you make eight changes at once, you're suddenly asking a lot of players who normally perform supporting roles to effectively become the team. That's completely different from Wilson coming into an established side because Longelo is injured, or Ross coming in alongside nine or ten regular starters. That's really all I was getting at about Sunday. Wilson and Ross were poor. So were plenty of others. Nobody is suggesting they should be immune from criticism because they're young. I just don't think a bad performance in a heavily rotated team establishes that they have no value as Premiership squad players. Maybe ultimately they won't be good enough even for that role. That's possible. But there's a fairly substantial gap between "I'm not convinced this guy will ever be a first-team regular" and "this guy has no business being in Motherwell's squad." For a club operating with our resources, that distinction is quite important I think. That's generally how it works from what I know. There would be no point in having all that technology, and the players running around with vests on under their shirts with weird boxes attached to them if we're not going to use them I guess. It truly is a backroom team I think. Expertise across the board. But the manager makes the final call, and the buck stops with him. So he is responsible for the loss, but there will be reasoning behind his choices I'd think.

Thanks for that insight David. I suppose thats what sports science is all about. So, what we're saying is that whilst a manager takes the actual decisions on team selection and and substitutions, the opinions he is presented with by other staff can, in some circumstances (like a squad limited by injuries), pretty well dictate what team he actually puts on the park. For example, "Player A has a minor strain and we recommend he plays no more than 20 minutes". So, whilst ordinary fans like me naively assume that the manager has free rein to pick the team the reality might be totally different.

Said on FB after the Falkirk game there seems to be a little 'emperor's new clothes' feel for me, we're nowhere near as dynamic (Hibs winner aside) as last season. and we're playing without a striker effectively, IF we're are good as we're supposed to be Stenny should have been a formality. Glass coffin situation up by.

The perspective is that one or two are clearly not good enough for the top division despite having been given the recognised route and support to build their career. Not based solely on Sunday but also based on the past two seasons. They have not developed as we all had hoped. Sadly that happens all too often within every club. But for a number of reasons they are what we have at the moment and that's not their fault. More generally, at what age and after how many games does a player stop being regarded as a youngster? When should we reasonably expect to see progress? I think it was you who highlighted that Wilson has played over 100 senior games. Many of those games surrounded by senior players within an established line up. Add some Under 21 International appearances in 2024. Numerous coaches They are all doing their best and that effort is appreciated. For their own good I believe it would be better if they moved elsewhere.....loan meantime or straight transfer. It was painful seeing how much they struggled on Sunday. To be clear, I am not blaming any of those youngsters for the loss on Sunday. I don't think any senior Motherwell player came off that park thinking they had done themselves justice. I am just saying there comes a time to identify when a player is not up to the standard we require. That does not mean a player....youngster or otherwise.... does not have a future elsewhere

Think you’re pretty much bang on the money ( although ur not allowed to say vogts not good enough at this stage 😂) for me a spl teams squad should be good enough to beat stenhousemuir ( I know the injuries but the reality is even with the injured players back the attacking options aren’t good enough & im not convinced who but priestman would have affected it ) managers clearly not chucked the cup, he’s just not got the squad needed & the reality is despite the good start we’re liable to be out of Europe ( just where we are & it’s been a great journey so here’s hoping ) & we’re out a cup we shouldn’t be yet cups for me are massively important to us, we’ve great entertainment but we should really be doing better in these matches hopefully get some players in soon that can make a difference for the record think the manager will be a good appt

Mybe a paper exercise, but our submitted list for Thursday's game is a little more optimistic as it includes Sods, Williams, Thor and Ap Stam. Priestman and Sparrow also on it as well Hodge. How fit some of these players are is another matter entirely of course. Still its a step in the right direction.

Lot of people stating that our fringe players are not good enough for first team squad. I disagree. When a bunch are flung into the foray, then sure, it’s a team lacking quality but when you sub on on one or two playing alongside our starters then they are fine

DennyMC - not only have you one of the coolest avatars wit big Sieb but this post is absolutely top notch and summarises brilliantly where the young players are together with what many of us are thinking about Vogyt. For me it covers exactly where we're at. Great post .

There were, what? Eight changes to the team? When you change that many players at once, you're changing partnerships, movement, communication and most of the structure around them. A young/fringe player coming into a settled Motherwell side alongside nine or ten regulars is a very different proposition from several of them being thrown together at the same time. They can still be criticised for playing poorly, of course. That's football. But I think some perspective is maybe needed there.

You had me convinced 🤣🤣