Kmcalpin

Pretty much agree with that. In principle I too would like to see more home grown Scottish talent coming through our ranks but the reality is a bit more complex. We mustn't forget that Robbo has also been charged with keeping us in the Premiership. If he overplayed his hand by playing too many youngsters and we went down most fans would not be too forgiving. Be in no doubt that if our competitors thought they could steal a march on us by signing up a squad of non Scottish players they'd do so in a minute. Some of our young lads might well go out on loan to toughen them up and give them competitive gametime. However when looking at our Under 20s we have to look, not just how good they are but also what kind of players they are. A simple question to start - should Peter Morrison have been clear second choice for goals? In terms of centre backs and left back, what youngsters could step into the team right now as cover and do a job? Midfield? I would see Alan Campbell as back up to Carl McHugh in terms of position. He's not an attacking midfielder. Should we prefer Ross MacLean and Jake Hastie to Elliot Frear and Craig Tanner (back up maybe)? What young strikers are pushing through just now? These questions may throw up potential shortcomings in our past youth development set up. Its unlikely that our Under 20s will produce 11 great prospects for all positions at once. Historically we've maybe produced a maximum of 3 at any one time eg Hammell, Faddy and Pearson. Recruitment from Scottish lower leagues is difficult and any decent prospects won't come cheap. There are also far fewer clubs and therefore less choice in Scotland's lower leagues as opposed to England's lower leagues.

Sorry, I don't understand. I don't see the connection.

Basically agree. However over the course of 12 draws, the only equally unlikely combination is 12 aways. 11 homes and 1 away is slightly more likely.

It could just be that a larger proportion of our core support has bought season tickets. I hope not and that there has been a real increase.

Other things being equal ie Heneghan is passed fit then McHugh has to play in midfield. He'll do more good there shielding the defence. Thats asuming there's no more injuries and we don't sign another defender who is match fit.

An interesting game. It'll provide a different kind of stress test (an in phrase just now) for us. The striker, whoever he is, may get more room but less service; the midfield's defensive capabilities will be tested more; the defence will be tested more rigorously; and Carson will be tested. Hopefully the team will benefit from playing the group stages of the League Cup as we did, strange though it was at the time.

Maybe splitting hairs Weeyin but aren't you comparing permutations as opposed to combinations? The odds of being drawn at home 12 times out of 12 will be somewhat less than the odds of being drawn at home 6 times out of 12? For example the permutation you cite has the same combination ie 6 home draws as H,H,H,H,H,H,A,A,A,A,A,A. There will be a number of permutations which result in 6 home draws out of 12 but only which results in 12 out of 12.

Am I right in saying that the probability of 12 home ties on the trot is 1 in 4,096? Maybe the statisticians on this board could verify this?

Not unhappy with that. We're only playing with one out and out striker anyway. If thats our system how many do we need? On admittedly very limited evidence, Newell does seem a wee bit above Under 20 level.

Yes, the system doesn't seem right does it?

Yes, thats by no means unlikely Greg. As you say its the Motherwell way.

I've been slagged off in the past for wanting us to be more physical and I've had a hard job convincing some posters that I didn't mean hammer throwers, thugs and hatchet men. Your description of Kipre above is exactly what I meant. He was strong enough to hold off 3 opponents in the corner and as far as I've seen hasn't resorted to any nasty stuff. He can also play a bit of football.

Potentially some very hard ties in prospect. Hibs away, Partick away, Ross County away or either of the Dundee clubs away don't excite me.

Our midfield is definitely better than it was last season although the mix wasn't quite right when McHugh stepped back into defence. Had he been available I think Campbell would have been the perfect deputy. A few have been bemoaning recently the lack of first team exposure for young up and coming players like Campbell. Thats all very well but they have to slot in to a position for which they are suited. As we've seen last season its no good having 3/4/5 central midfield players if they are all slow and defensive. Its too early to judge Carson in goal as he's had little to do and in 3 games I've only seen him flap at a cross once. If the defence and midfield do their job its purely academic anyway as he'll only be required to deal with crosses once in a blue moon as Andy Goram pointed out several times. I think Carson is entitled to expect more aerial protection than Samson was ever afforded. As the midfield is not only better but better balanced, that will give the defence more protection and the strikers more support. It will also ensure that Moult, or his successor, is not the only source of goals, as we've seen. However, we are over reliant on Moult and that has to be addressed.

Today's game was very similar to the one in Edinburgh earlier this week. In both we enjoyed plenty of possession, played cross after after cross into the opposition box and frustratingly lacked a cutting edge. All 3 goals came from low crosses, Davie Cooper style. Still we won and remain undefeated. Thats the bottom line. A strange starting line up which didn't last long due to Hammell's injury but even in that short time we looked very disjointed down the left. Like Ropy I was and still am very concerned at the lack of central defensive cover and to play McHugh back in defence was a throw back to last season and weakened the midfield. Was McManus punished for a poor defensive display in midweek? I just couldn't figure out playing with one striker against a side who came to park their bus. I assume, for no other reason than I can't think of a feasible alternative explanation, that Robbo set us up this way simply to practice this formation for the coming league campaign. He would have played this way irrespective of the opposition. To field one solitary striker against an ultra defensive outfit doesn't make sense unless all your strikers are injured. It rendered Tanner's role largely meaningless and unnecessary. It also affected Rose's game too. Frear was my MOTM although Kipre continues to impress. Dunne too looked good and although his passing wasn't 100% he was very quick and looks to be an excellent defender with good positional sense. Tait didn't have a bad game although he was done for pace quite a few times. McHugh was badly missed in central midfield and on 2/3 occasions Berwick found a direct opening on goal in the middle which better sides would have taken advantage of. Despite us having a bigger team than last term Berwick proved no physical pushovers and more than held their own unless Kipre or perhaps Dunne was involved. We continue to have problems up front but to be fair Moult looked far from being match fit. He is also no target man - never was and never will be. Fisher again failed to impress when he appeared. Newell? Looked very sharp and energetic although a little frail. We still need another striker, be it Newell or someone completely new, and most certainly another central defender - like now please.

Frear for me although Kipre wasn't far behind.

Spot on. Dylan Mackin scored a few goals for the Under 20s but was never a prolific scorer. he never really played for the first 11 bar a single appearance as a sub I think. If I'm wrong correct me. I assume therefore that management did not think he was good enough to promote to the first team squad. He may fit in fine at Livingston and that might be his level. Very few youngsters fail to make the grade at Fir Park and then move on to bigger and better things. I'm just using Mackin as an example to back up Superward's point.

Can we set up a separate thread for Well Fans II please? Discussion is starting to go well off topic. We have a game tomorrow; what sort of team should we field? Our strongest 11 with a view to the following weekend or give some fringe players game time?

My you've a long memory.

Rightly or wrongly, thats how Mark McGhee referred to him.

Pretty much agree with that. If Bowman had scored early on it would have been a different game. The pitch was absolutely horrific; I didn't realise just how poor until half time. Two City subs were passing the ball 10/15 yards on the deck to each other and l couldn't believe how much the ball bobbled about. City were always going to park their bus and play out of their skins. An indication of their intentions was that, at times, they tripled, not doubled up on Frear. We created a lot of chances but their keeper was only required to make one decent save in the whole game. Cross after cross went into our opponents box but we couldn't finish them off. Irrespective of the line up we should be able to beat a team like Edinburgh City. Given a free choice, I doubt if Robbo would have chosen the team he played. Some players missed out because of the pitch while others were played in unsuitable roles eg Rose. Cadden and Tanner made a difference when they came on and that turned the game in our favour. As the game wore on I thought it more and more likely that City would score and it was no surprise when they did. We've seen that scenario play out many times before in games which we've dominated. But, we were the better team and we won. letdown but we can't judge him on last night. Still last night it was job done and the fixture gave some more players game time.

I think Tanner might meet your requirements for a No 10. Still a question mark over Frear being played as a wing back for me. Otherwise I agree.

Agree with all of that. Don't forget he's been out of the game for months.

By all means play 2 or 3 other experienced pros from the start but we should do the business first then bring on the young lads. Albion Rovers anyone?

I think part of the problem is that he's being played out of position and by that I mean too deep. Many teams also double up on him. I like him but he has got to be played to his strengths for him to be fully effective.