Kmcalpin

I can only second that. The management and players have done us proud on a low budget. However the Directors and Chief Executive must also take a lot of credit for appointing the right manager and setting a decent and realistic budget. Folk on here are quick enough to criticise them when small things go awry but we must have one of the best sets of Directors in the country. I wouldn't swap them for their counterparts at Pittodrie, Tannadice, Easter Road or Tynecastle.

Unfortunately we witness several instances of diving week in week out and like foul throws action is very rarely taken. Once in a while, for reasons unknown, a referee will single out one particular incident and take action.

Why is he suspended next week if it wasn't a straight red? Has he breached the points limit?

Was Henrik's red card a straight red?

Firstly, as far as MJW is concerned, my reply was perhaps clumsily worded. I was not suggesting that he/she was attempting to stoke up a "better fan" debate. Unfortunately many discussions like this in the past have wound up as just that. I was simply trying to get across that I was not getting at anyone/was posting in peace however you choose to phrase it. I was trying to avoid falling into this trap. To their credit neither MJW nor Brazilian did so. Now as to the points you make Iain. I agree with the point made by Steelboy to a degree. Fans have made the effort to get to games and I'll freely acknowledge that some on this Board and indeed others bought season tickets in the full knowledge that they would not be able use them. Good on them. My point was more about the club 12 initiative than attendances. As far as I know and was led to believe the Club 12 initiative was a damp squib. Many with a ST said that they'd pay in but in the event this was forgotten about on the day. Before anyone has a go at me yes, there were some who did exactly what they promised to do. But in the main it was a flop. Thats not my opinion its a fact, as I was told by someone who knew. However that is the nature of these things. Some people make pledges for charity appeals, collections whatever, probably in good faith but in the event don't come up with the goods. Again I feel it necessary to state that some folk would have made these pledges but in the event were too ill to do so, lost their jobs, hit financial trouble and the like. As far as I know the Board have not been making negative digs about fans - I've heard perhaps one comment (in a specific context) in the last 11 months about fans not pulling their weight/doing what they'd promised - however you choose to phrase it.

I've no intention of getting embroiled in "we're better fans than you" debate. Its not an accusation its a fact and some of our own fans, who have no time whatever to do with Sevco have said that to me. However, live and let live. If fans wanted to contribute a bit more and could they did and if they didn't or couldn't well they didn't. That said you're right in that the club could have promoted the Steelmen Forever far harder. That I don't understand. Between now and the end of the season I'll take a long hard look at myself and ask what more I can do.

That was always going to be the case. To be fair though some fans did dig a bit deeper or used their cash more effectively for the club's benefit.

The regulation/custom is that home teams pay the expenses (however they are defined) of the visiting teams.

For the year ended 31 May last year about 33% of our income came from gate receipts. About 43% came from TV and radio, with the remainder coming from other sources. .

To quote but one example I reckon our share of the Pittodrie gate would be about £36k - hardly a fortune. We would have made a loss on the replay.

Don't forget that a higher league placing will mean higher bonuses paid to players. Also, players who will remain with us next year will be entitled to wage rises so the situation is not entirely clear cut. Add to that the cost of reseeding the pitch and a potentially healthy profit is whittled away. We were warned of this months ago. Other clubs too though are having to reduce their budgets.

Prices, the fact that it was on TV and that it was Celtic. Our home crowd was always a good 500 - 1,000 down at Celtic & Rangers games.

Thats my exact recollection too Andy. The money is to be used as a returnable overdraft/cash float in times of need, usually in late winter or early spring. Its was mentioned at the Club's AGM that it was likely that temporary loan(for want of a better term) would be required in the spring. That said, the club has to use the cash for something - it would be pointless asking for the temporary loan and then not using for some purpose, be it wages, repairs or whatever.

I think thats also worth pointing out to the media. What a shocking way for any organisation to treat its customers.

Throughout this whole sorry saga, there's only one thing I've been certain about and thats we've not been told the full story and that I didn't know enough to form an informed opinion. The SPL (and SFA & SFL) operates in secrecy and I can understand the reasons why. As far as voting is concerned I did not know until last autumn that there were different thresholds for different issues. I also learned for the first time a few months ago that Aberdeen were against changing the 11-1 voting. Since then I have assumed, very mistakenly as it turns out, that only Celtic and Aberdeen opposed changes to the voting. Now it transpires that clubs like Hibs, Hearts, Dundee United would also oppose any change. Again I can understand why - self interest pure and simple. I'm all right jack! I've known for some time that, in general, SPL Chairmen were a very awkward bunch and that trying to get agreement on anything including what sandwiches to order at working lunches, was almost impossible. I don't think Neil Doncaster (and his two colleagues at the SFA and SFL) has handled matters well but I now appreciate the difficult and trying environment in which he has had to work. For many of us the voting issue was always very clear cut and simple - why don't the other 10 SPL members gang up on Celtic and Aberdeen and change the thresholds. Now is the moment. In reality there was only ever limited support for it because of self interest. As for the issue of cherry picking the best points of the proposals I now suspect there are none which would garner sufficient interest to be passed. For example, Neil Doncaster is not going to come out and state publicly that amalgamation of the 3 governing bodies will be taken forward on its own as Clubs X,Y and Z will not support it.

An interesting interview with Stewart Milne. Text on 11-1 voting is revealing. http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/stewart-milne-fears-for-scottish-football-1-2904067

Quite shocking and totally unacceptable. Paying customers should be treated with much more respect. Such an attitude would not be tolerated in most organisations. If we are wrong then United should tell us that and explain their reasoning.

The first step is to contact Dundee United and find out why the bottom tier was closed and why there was no prior warning of this. Incidentally the home "shed" was also closed. Its a very poor show if they closed the bottom tier without any prior notification. Had they wanted to close it for safety/cost cutting reasons then they could have offered those who wanted to sit there cheaper entry to the Upper Tier (there must have been a way of administering this). The amount of money involved would have been less than £200 in all likelihood. At the very least they should be asked to explain themselves.

Well done Bop for organising this. A very poor show from United both before and during the game. Glad the event was a success and at least our own club benefitted financially. The 3-1 result also helped.

I noticed this too, however it stopped after a short while. Searches took place on the street and not on private property. Home fans were not being searched. Interestingly, the notice of rules and regulations stated that excessive noise eg use of transistor radios was not acceptable. Presumably that includes drums and other musical instruments. What about singing or shouting? Certainly the PR system was loud enough. On the park a great evening with some tremendous goals. United fans moaned and whined from start to finish as usual.

A bit like Brian MacLean - will play solidly well (at worst) for 88 minutes but then make 2 or 3 horrific blunders in the space of a few minutes. Prone to sudden rushes of blood to the head.

Fair dos, but that service comes at the price of awkward kick off time and the like. We can't have it both ways.

Its a win win situation. If there was a mass switch in Scotland, they might just might listen. If they didn't, then KO times would revert to 3pm on Saturday and live attendances would increase. Its not just Sky of course but also ESPN. Why not boycott pubs and clubs while live footie was being shown? I know that not everyone on here does have access to live TV footie but many will do.

There's no doubt that TV is having a seriously detrimental impact on the game up here - from inconvenient kick off times to derisory financial offers. But there's no point in us whingeing and moaning about it when we are probably the root cause of the problem ourselves. There's no point in blaming everyone (SFA/SPL/SFL/the club) but ourselves. The solution is in our own hands - unsubscribe. Hit Sky & ESPN where it hurts - in their pockets.

A good post Netherton - well balanced. I too am disappointed at the attendance and there could be many reasons for that but we may have to face the fact that many fans simply may not care either way. Maybe we are guilty of assuming that our support is either for or against but in reality many just turn up to watch the football and don't care about the politics.