Tweed Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Poor off the field decision making is also costing us - a just too thin squad and a decision to renew Stephen Craigan's contract during the close season being but two examples. Hang on. Nobody complained when McGhee decided to go with a quality squad rather than a bigger one. In fact I'm sure its a risk that we'd all have taken and then hope we avoid injuries. With whats happened to Saunders and Hutchinson I really don't see how renewing Craigan's contract was a mistake. And given that he was right up there in the MoTM threads against Kilmarnock, Hearts and St Mirren doesn't suggest he is over the hill yet. In the last four games he has been forming a central defensive partnership with someone he has never ever played with before and who wouldn't list centre half as his favourite position. Now you may argue we should play Page but that decision isn't Craigan's. If Hutchinson had stayed fit and we'd even drawn with St Johnstone and won yesterday nobody would be saying the squad is too thin. Aye its a gamble but if its a gamble between 9th and top 6 it is one worth taking. On last night's game we lost because we made poor decisions on the pitch. I'm sorry but if McCall sets up a team in such a way that we are one on one with the 'keeper three times and fizz six or seven balls across the box and we fail to win the blame lies with the players. While we played well to a degree in the attacking end of the pitch, all our forward thinking players made bad decisions. Law shot to the wrong side of the 'keeper at the start of extra time and should have squared it at the end. Murphy ran when he should pass and vice versa and so on. We had enough chances to win three or four games. Unfortunately with two of our first three defenders out just now we are going to experience frailties at the back. And every club has that and it something, whilst we don't need to like it, we need to accept it. But last night we showed we can create chances and we can score goals though we should have scored more. I know some people may say we should have changed it and i would have still been inclined to tweak it a bit however I think given what we had available were they likely to have done any better? I don't think so. Jennings and Murphy are underperforming though and I think even in a much improved performance these are the two that need a rest. Obviously I'm disappointed we are out but at least last night we looked like we'd played football before, had some idea what we were doing and played some sweet stuff with pace. You also get the impression we might win a game some time before 2020 and on Saturday that looked like an alien concept. Also on Saturday I thought the crowd were quick to turn on the team (I know they were awful) but it really can't help having howls of derision at every pass the moment we are 1-0 down - last night at least we stuck with them even when we went 1-0 down. After Saturday it would have been easy to fold and lose 4-0 and they showed a bit of character to bounce back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yir Elder Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 I firstly have tho say that I thought it was a cracking cup tie! Both sides attacked and created loads of chances, it was dramatic end to end stuff at times and I enjoyed the encounter. I thought overall the team were much better than Saturday, showed much more desire and application and were great going forward, certainly after the initial 20 minutes. It looks like we were undone by a wrong flag when McHugh scored near the end, but our defensive negligence cost us big time before that. Very disappointed to go out, and we MUST address our defensive frailties which are costing us in every game. Yes we probably should've tied the game up in the second half, but with 3 minutes to go you just clear your lines! Before that both Jenno and Clancy were profligate in defensive areas yet we escaped. These incidents of slackness need to stop. Delighted to see Randy play so well, but also irritated that he had so much work to do! That said I though Mark Brown was excellent for Hibs too. Regarding Saturday I may be that Hump is out injured, and I do think that perhaps Jenno and Murph need a spell on the bench. if not then guys like Forbes and McHugh could become disillusoned, they deserve a chance to prove themselves. Ach well, onwards and upwards! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Hang on. Nobody complained when McGhee decided to go with a quality squad rather than a bigger one. In fact I'm sure its a risk that we'd all have taken and then hope we avoid injuries. With whats happened to Saunders and Hutchinson I really don't see how renewing Craigan's contract was a mistake. And given that he was right up there in the MoTM threads against Kilmarnock, Hearts and St Mirren doesn't suggest he is over the hill yet. In the last four games he has been forming a central defensive partnership with someone he has never ever played with before and who wouldn't list centre half as his favourite position. If Hutchinson had stayed fit and we'd even drawn with St Johnstone and won yesterday nobody would be saying the squad is too thin. Aye its a gamble but if its a gamble between 9th and top 6 it is one worth taking. On last night's game we lost because we made poor decisions on the pitch. I'm sorry but if McCall sets up a team in such a way that we are one on one with the 'keeper three times and fizz six or seven balls across the box and we fail to win the blame lies with the players. But last night we showed we can create chances and we can score goals though we should have scored more. I know some people may say we should have changed it and i would have still been inclined to tweak it a bit however I think given what we had available were they likely to have done any better? I don't think so. Jennings and Murphy are underperforming though and I think even in a much improved performance these are the two that need a rest. Sorry don't agree with you. The squad McGhee had was bigger than the current squad. Last season the squad was thin but this year its even thinner and many warned that we'd gone just too far. I appreciate that its a quality V quantity decision for us but this season we have gone just too far. It should be a calcucated gamble but this year it looks like an uncalculated gamble. Only one recognised first team striker on our books? I ask you. Craigan should have been replaced last year and his wages spent on bringing a new centre back in. Yes, we made errors on the pitch but also many errors of it. Playing one isolated striker up front meant that we did not thave the firepower to finish good moves off. Thats a managerial decision. Failing to make changes midway through the second half - again an off field decision. Playing Jamie Murphy out of position to the extent that he's being wasted - again an off field decision. Who recruited Tim Clancy as an auxilliary centre back? I could go on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decorator Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Right again Jim...this is becoming like a mutual admiration club. What is especially galling to me is that we are displaying the same weaknesses week in week out and our manager seems unwilling or unable to do anything to rectify them. Poor off the field decision making is also costing us - a just too thin squad and a decision to renew Stephen Craigan's contract during the close season being but two examples. ganno had his number years ago 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmmfc Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 The stick Craigan gets on here is unreal. Aye, he made a mistake for the O'Connor goal last night but O'Connor still had quite a bit to do to score (e.g. who dived in after Craigan and sold himself..Clancy). Craigan won many headers in his own box and aye, his long passing leaves a lot to be desired at times but he's no f*cking Ronald Koeman. He's a solid enough defender for a team like Motherwell so folk should get a reality check. On the other hand, from what I've seen of Clancy, he is a bombscare at centre-half. Was at fault for the first goal last night, played a part in their 2nd goal and in general, stands off a striker far too much. I haven't seen anything to suggest he's any better than Page, so I'd have Page in before him on Saturday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Stall Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Great game, shite result! Absolutley pulsating cup tie, end to end, both teams could have won by quite a few goals. I'de like to think we were the better team, but saying that, Randy had to pull off quite a number of great saves. Our defence was terrible, both goals resulting from errors. When did we decide passing it back to the keeper for him to hoof it up the park was a better idea the defenders just booting it themselves?? First 10 minutes I thought we were poor and in for a drubbing, our confidence was clearly down and we looked to be picking up where we left off on Saturday. Credit to the boys though, they got back in there and played much better. I thought we had 3 stand out players lastnight, Law, Humphrey and Randolph. If Humphrey can develop some kind of consistency and deliver on that level week in week out, he will quickly turn into our main weapon and a fans favourite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Diggle Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 The stick Craigan gets on here is unreal. Aye, he made a mistake for the O'Connor goal last night but O'Connor still had quite a bit to do to score (e.g. who dived in after Craigan and sold himself..Clancy). Craigan won many headers in his own box and aye, his long passing leaves a lot to be desired at times but he's no f*cking Ronald Koeman. He's a solid enough defender for a team like Motherwell so folk should get a reality check. On the other hand, from what I've seen of Clancy, he is a bombscare at centre-half. Was at fault for the first goal last night, played a part in their 2nd goal and in general, stands off a striker far too much. I haven't seen anything to suggest he's any better than Page, so I'd have Page in before him on Saturday. The whole team played a part in both their goals. Clancy wasn't at fault for the first you could equally say the keeper never saved it or Lasley gave the ball away in the first place. Where do you start / stop? It was a great game of football. We had 11 players giving it everything. Some things worked - some didnae We lost on penalties Nae need for a witchhunt Lets get behind the boys on saturday against the wee bastard broon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fal_Dosser Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Amazing how we all see the game slightly differently with regards to players, but without doubt, last night was a huge improvement on Saturday. Thought the team, after the initial 20 mins of the game, suddenly got their act together and played well, but we are killing ourselves with mistakes defensively, and not getting players in the box when it matters. I actually thought Clancy had a good game last night, but there's no doubting that when teams have the opportunity to put pressure on the defensive partnership, we look vulnerable. As for the attacking side, felt Higdon had a cracking game, and Humphrey came on to a really good game, and put in some quality balls (as did Daley when he came on). My gripe is that when these balls into the box are delivered, more often than not, Higdon is the sole player that's in the box, with at least a couple of defenders to deal with. I know from playing and now coaching teams, that we try and reinforce the idea of an attacking player moving to the front post area, with others attcking the middle\back post area. Are my ideas firmly in the past (seems so ). Still mightily impressed with Nicky Law, but time to work hard in training on getting the finishing shot away with purpose. Last night he got himself in great positions, but he almost seemed to take stage fright when it came to pull the trigger. I appreciate getting the ball in the net is a skill in itself, but if he could only finish the good work he sets up. Well done Randolph for standing up and being counted when it mattered - credit also to Mark Brown who kept Hibs in the game when needed. Finally, massive well done to the guys up the end of the East stand - after seeming quietish on Saturday, you were all immense last night - was it my imagination, or is the buzz slowly spreading along the East stand MON RA DOSSERS 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelboy Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 The whole team played a part in both their goals. Clancy wasn't at fault for the first you could equally say the keeper never saved it or Lasley gave the ball away in the first place. Where do you start / stop? you definiltely don't start with lasley who wasn't involved. our last touch before their first goal was higdon heading the ball to no one then they hooked the ball up the park to griffiths who crossed and clancy stood still watching griffiths ball come into the box and o'conner running by him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 For the First goal Craigan has had to drift out wide to pick up Griffiths and no one has made an effort to get back in and cover that space he has left. After that the ball into the box there is indecision between Randolph adn Clancy - one of them needs to take the responsibility and go get the ball - blame can lie with either of the 2 of them - I would be looking for my centre half to take ownership and put the ball over the east stand but if i was a centre half the minute the ball goes into the 6 yard box i would be expecting my goalkeeper to claim it also. 2nd goal is jsut a catalogue of individual errors - we need to concentrate more and learn to do the simple things. All in all we did ok - created enough chances to win the game 3 times over!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superwell87 Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 The result aside, I thought it was a great game last night. Getting knocked out the way we did was hard to take, even more so, given Bob was onside when he scored late in Extra Time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welldaft Mk1 Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 The whole team played a part in both their goals. Clancy wasn't at fault for the first you could equally say the keeper never saved it or Lasley gave the ball away in the first place. Where do you start / stop? It was a great game of football. We had 11 players giving it everything. Some things worked - some didnae We lost on penalties Nae need for a witchhunt Lets get behind the boys on saturday against the wee bastard broon Agree totally with this post. The players were Soooooo much better than last Saturday. Posters talk about getting cover in and more players and I for one would have liked to see at least 1 extra recognised Striker. Possibly should have held on to Jeffers. He could have had a field day last night. The reality is the finance is not there to have that much of a bigger squad. So we can moan all we like, but thems the facts. I also would like to see Murphy and Jenno given a wee rest even for just 1 half. Never been a big fan of McHugh but he looked OK last night and should have had a goal for his efforts. I don't know what people are xpecting these days. It is only natural after a few decent seasons expectations rise, but talk of us being P1sh last night is way wide of the mark. We are attacking at will and providing great entertainment, even if that means we are going to come a cropper every now and then. Rather that than sit back, defend and hope for a draw. Onwards and Upwards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fal_Dosser Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Agree totally with this post. The players were Soooooo much better than last Saturday. Posters talk about getting cover in and more players and I for one would have liked to see at least 1 extra recognised Striker. Possibly should have held on to Jeffers. He could have had a field day last night. The reality is the finance is not there to have that much of a bigger squad. So we can moan all we like, but thems the facts. I also would like to see Murphy and Jenno given a wee rest even for just 1 half. Never been a big fan of McHugh but he looked OK last night and should have had a goal for his efforts. I don't know what people are xpecting these days. It is only natural after a few decent seasons expectations rise, but talk of us being P1sh last night is way wide of the mark. We are attacking at will and providing great entertainment, even if that means we are going to come a cropper every now and then. Rather that than sit back, defend and hope for a draw. Onwards and Upwards Agreed, and fair point about Jeffers. A big difference for me last night, was the nature of how we played - constant balls from back to front like Saturday, only has Higdon alienated and figting for 50\50 balls - when we play through the team, we look a much more dangerous outfit. We didn't get to our position in the league by hopeful punts up the park. MON RA DOSSERS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WellTiliDie Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 It was a disppointing end to an entertaining cup tie but we can take a lot of positives out of the game as well as some negatives. We started sluggishly and deserved to go behind. Thought Craigan should of made it harder for Grittiths to get the delivery in though and was he was lucky not to give away a penalty and red card when he was pulling back the wee diving scumbag c**t moments later when they should of made it 2-0. Once we scored we looked threatening every time we ventured forward and Higdon's goal was well worked with a good finish from the big man. We should of went on from there though and killed them off but a lack of composure in front of goal cost us dearly. Defensively we were weak and Jennings abscence in midfield meant that Lasley had the work of two men to carry out, which he did very well. Humphrey had a much better game but was still frustrating at times although he did create half a dozen good chances. Law looked the best player on the park again. Murphy was shocking and is showing the lack of consistency that will win him a move to a biggar club. Not keen on McHugh but thought he did extremely well in the 2nd period of extra time that should justify him a place in the starting line up for Saturday ahead of Murphy. Would also bring in Forbes for Jennings who has been woefully off the pace so far this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfc88 Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Am I the only one who thought craggs was fucking dire last night? Griffiths should never ever have been given that much space to cross for the first goal. And when the ball approached craigan even he knew what was going to happen...one up in a cup tie, 87th minute - he should have done what he does best and stuck his boot through it but no, he tried to control it with his bollocks and made an arse of it. Dont get me wrong I like craigan, he has been a great player and ambassador for the club but the fact we are quite heavily relying on him gives me the fear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Little consolation, I know, but losing to another SPL side isn't nearly as bad as Rangers, Hearts and Aberdeen all getting papped out by lower league teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted September 21, 2011 Report Share Posted September 21, 2011 Rangers the only SPL team humbled by a lower league team within the 90 minutes as well. Nae 'luck' of the shoot out needed for Falkirk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian-in-Oz Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 I just think it's funny how when the draw was made i was criticised for saying it was the second hardest draw we could get as they are an SPL team. But everyone said i was talking pish & it was a great draw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 It WAS a garbage draw. The irony is though Aberdeen, Hearts, and Rangers fans would have been more than content with theirs. I'm probably a bit biased here but I think we would have beaten any of their opponents home or away. A defeat to any one of them WOULD have been sorer to take right enough. No disgrace getting put out of a Cup to one of the City SPL teams on penalties regardless of league positioning. Getting put out at home by the team who are bottom of the Second Division? Total riddie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickoza Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Or a Falkirk side 10 of whom were under 20 in the starting line-up!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
postiejim Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 (edited) next round draw...st mirren v ayr...dundee unt v falkirk....hibs v celtic...killie v east fife. I know were not in it but thats it. And you would have to say the draw has been kind to the Premier clubs. Edited September 22, 2011 by postiejim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Apart from Hibs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellfan1984 Posted September 24, 2011 Report Share Posted September 24, 2011 The draw was seeded. With Hibs being the only non-seeded SPL then Celtic are probably right now complaining about the draw... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finlay Posted September 24, 2011 Report Share Posted September 24, 2011 I thought the seeded part of the draw stopped for the QF stage. Certainly last year we got Dun Utd in the QF and our league placing the season before was 3rd and 5th meaning we should both have been seeded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellfan1984 Posted September 24, 2011 Report Share Posted September 24, 2011 Looking at it again, it wasn't. Unlucky then for the SFL clubs as there is no all SFL tie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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