Motherwell v Celtic 09/11/2022

[bobbybingo]

Just now, Spiderpig said:

OK here you go just for you, Fifa IFAB laws of the game, its law 15.2 by the way The throw in

An opponent who unfairly distracts or impedes the thrower (including moving closer than 2 m (2 yds) to the place where the throw-in is to be taken) is cautioned for unsporting behaviour, and if the throw-in has been taken, an indirect free kick is awarded.

and the VAR team said nothing to see hear you honestly could not make up nonsense like that.

So you can stop talking pish now, the goal should never have stood.

I've read it. He was walking back onto the pitch - he didn't move towards Penney, and unless you expected him to stay off the park till we took the throw, he wasn't unfairly distracting him. I'd say the one complaint we could have is if he wasn't on the field of play when it hit him, and that's what Hammell seems to be claiming. 

[joewarkfanclub]

I thought first half we were reasonably well organised and defended well for the most part without really offering anything going forward. The only notable attempts were KVV rounding the keeper and hitting the post (although I think he was marginally offside anyway) and Slatterys effort from halfway. 

Im not particularly critical of the first half tactics as its the trade off you make to prevent yourself being cut open by a very good Celtic team as we were in the League Cup tie. But we need to be better on the ball when we have it and everything was very rushed and we made too many misplaced passes.

Second half was much better. Not sure it was by design or default, but we managed to get personnel on the pitch that allowed us to push further up the pitch and we created a number of good opportunities.

Decision wise I think we got away with one on the Jota goal as that was borderline. The throw in decision before the Maeda goal I cant fathom. Its a yellow card and a free kick all day long. 

Morris, very lucky to get away with a yellow. If there had been more contact I think he was gone.

Overall, a better defensive performance as Kelly didnt have a lot to do, but we still need to use the ball better in transition.

Plenty to give us encouragement for Saturday, but I think our biggest problem will be getting 11 fit players to start.

[Yodo]

Any thoughts on Hatate kicking SoD 

[joewarkfanclub]

9 hours ago, Spiderpig said:

  it's not going to be deliberate cheating so that just leaves incompetence or not checking properly,  given the bargin basement VAR we got I suspect they never had a camera on it, either way its unacceptable.

I watched it on tv and was immediately shouting for it.  I cant see how the VAR with the same pictures could fail to see it.  They obviously see nothing wrong with what happened which is bizarre. However, we did get away with one on the Jota goal and Morris yellow card so I guess we cant complain. But VAR isnt really solving anything.

[grizzlyg]

Watching highlights, van Veen miss poor and dugs dinner from Slattery from first goal 

[grizzlyg]

And for controversy of 2nd goal to be honest Jotas goal should have stood

[joewarkfanclub]

1 minute ago, grizzlyg said:

Watching highlights, van Veen miss poor and dugs dinner from Slattery from first goal 

Thought he was unfortunate.

Did very well to intercept and must have felt the Celtic player had no chance of taking it from him without fouling him from behind. 

Maybe should have cleared it first time, but I cant fault him for trying to keep possession and playing a more constructive pass.

[texanwellfan]

Yea we probably got away with more than we lost out in.  Not sure how they figured Jota was offiside. Morris was a red card.  They got the break on the throw in. O’Donnell and the other guy was rightly ignored by the officials. So they got one right out of four. 

[texanwellfan]

3 minutes ago, joewarkfanclub said:

Thought he was unfortunate.

Did very well to intercept and must have felt the Celtic player had no chance of taking it from him without fouling him from behind. 

Maybe should have cleared it first time, but I cant fault him for trying to keep possession and playing a more constructive pass.

He had a guy out wide for a quick simple pass the way he was facing. Don’t hold the ball in your area when under pressure. 

[Yodo]

6 minutes ago, texanwellfan said:

Yea we probably got away with more than we lost out in.  Not sure how they figured Jota was offiside. Morris was a red card.  They got the break on the throw in. O’Donnell and the other guy was rightly ignored by the officials. So they got one right out of four. 

Bit of luck Morris will get suspended for 5 year retrospectively 

[Alpha1886]

1 hour ago, bobbybingo said:

Fair enough, different interview. I'm pretty sure they did look at it though, kept replaying it while the goal was being checked. They've obviously decided his head was on the field of play when it hit him. One of his feet certainly was.

You should take another look at it on Sportscene. None of his feet were on the field. His big toe of his front foot might just have been touching line. Considering most people’s head is positioned vertically midway between their legs there is no way the ball is in play when it hits off him. Hammell threw ball back to Penney and shouted to take it quickly to McKinstrey who was free up the wing. Celtic player moved to stop quick throw in. Should have been booking and retake. Booking would have been worth it for Celtic player since McKinstrey was in good attacking position. Fourth official and stand side linesman and Collum should have seen it and VAR. Nothing changes. 

[Alpha1886]

1 hour ago, grizzlyg said:

And for controversy of 2nd goal to be honest Jotas goal should have stood

For what reason? Linesman gave it. And look at body positions and shadows on Sportscene.

[SteelmaninOZ]

The gaffer 

 

[Yabba's Turd]

5 hours ago, joewarkfanclub said:

 

Morris, very lucky to get away with a yellow. If there had been more contact I think he was gone.

 

Agree, however in 1990 play on.

[bobbybingo]

5 hours ago, Alpha1886 said:

You should take another look at it on Sportscene. None of his feet were on the field. His big toe of his front foot might just have been touching line. Considering most people’s head is positioned vertically midway between their legs there is no way the ball is in play when it hits off him. Hammell threw ball back to Penney and shouted to take it quickly to McKinstrey who was free up the wing. Celtic player moved to stop quick throw in. Should have been booking and retake. Booking would have been worth it for Celtic player since McKinstrey was in good attacking position. Fourth official and stand side linesman and Collum should have seen it and VAR. Nothing changes. 

If you watched it on Sportscene you heard McFadden say he thought the Celtic player did nothing wrong and the only complaint we have is whether he was on the park when it hit him.  And if Collum, the linesman and VAR screwed us on that one, they saved us with Jota's goal, which was just as clearly onside. 

[Richie]

I'm not so sure Jota's goal was onside.
Apparently VAR has 6 angles, but not all of them are broadcast on TV etc. Also, he just needs to be a bawhair offside. Its probably very marginally is, similar to KVV v Hearts.
For the throw in, should have been retaken as the ball technically wasn't in play as it was the Celtic player who played the ball onto the field.
Its one wich 99/100 the ref will just blow on.
Morris I was expecting a red.

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[Mad Dog]

8 hours ago, Yodo said:

Any thoughts on Hatate kicking SoD 

Was watching it on TV and thought it could have been punished but the cameras didn't stay on them long enough to clearly see what happened. You'd think that the VAR cameras would have picked it up.

[bobbybingo]

5 minutes ago, Richie said:

I'm not so sure Jota's goal was onside.
Apparently VAR has 6 angles, but not all of them are broadcast on TV etc. Also, he just needs to be a bawhair offside. Its probably very marginally is, similar to KVV v Hearts.
For the throw in, should have been retaken as the ball technically wasn't in play as it was the Celtic player who played the ball onto the field.
Its one wich 99/100 the ref will just blow on.
Morris I was expecting a red.

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The question is, when they have 6 cameras filming it, what possessed them to show the one from the back of the stand at the other end of the park as proof he was offside, when it actually makes it look like he was onside? Surely they used another angle to make the decision, so show that one to the fans. If the SPFL or SFA ever launch a rocket, duck.

[gaz7]

3 minutes ago, bobbybingo said:

The question is, when they have 6 cameras filming it, what possessed them to show the one from the back of the stand at the other end of the park as proof he was offside, when it actually makes it look like he was onside? Surely they used another angle to make the decision, so show that one to the fans. If the SPFL or SFA ever launch a rocket, duck.

That is the answer bobby. They have other cameras and an offside decision is really black and white with the lines added so there is no debate. Morris foul is debatable as down to refs perception. Throw in incident again is no debate and if he wasn't on park throw-in to celtic if he was free kick to us. 

It seems as if people on here are trying to say some for us some against but that's only case with Morris foul other 2 are quite simple in they were spotted and referee/var applies rules . 

Anyone get good view on bevis injury?

[wellfan]

9 minutes ago, gaz7 said:

Anyone get good view on bevis injury?

Looked like a high impact ankle collision with Mooy. A sore one. 

[GrahamH]

2 minutes ago, wellfan said:

Looked like a high impact ankle collision with Mooy. A sore one. 

I thought it was more that his knee jot jarred in the collision with Mooy.  Looked as if his foot was planted and he took the impact hyper extended his knee. However, I didn’t see what the physio was treating so it may have been his ankle.

[Great Balls of Shire]

2 hours ago, bobbybingo said:

If you watched it on Sportscene you heard McFadden say he thought the Celtic player did nothing wrong and the only complaint we have is whether he was on the park when it hit him.  And if Collum, the linesman and VAR screwed us on that one, they saved us with Jota's goal, which was just as clearly onside. 

I think jotas goal was marginally off, although if you were giving benefit of doubt to attacking player, it could have stood, not unlike vv on Sunday

They really are managing to make even more mistakes than pre var which seems illogical.

[bobbybingo]

2 minutes ago, Great Balls of Shire said:

I think jotas goal was marginally off, although if you were giving benefit of doubt to attacking player, it could have stood, not unlike vv on Sunday

They really are managing to make even more mistakes than pre var which seems illogical.

Goal line technology is the only sure thing because it's just a line between 2 fixed points. Offsides should be far more conclusive, though it's debatable how good their angles are at times. Handballs and everything else are still up to refs, and as we've seen week-in/week-out in England, repeated viewings don't stop them making laughably shit decisions, they just highlight them more.

I thought VAR was a good idea at the start, but I got sick of it long before it arrived here. Should've known any attempt to introduce logic into football was doomed.

[Pepper]

I'm a bit surprised at folks willingness to accept the Jota goal was onside on the basis of the camera angle shown - it's nowhere near as definitive as some are making out. People also get caught up looking at a players feet - Jota was leaning forward as he was on the sprint and with O'Donnell being practically vertical it wouldn't surprise me if another angle showed Jota's head was offside. 

It doesn't help when the VAR freeze frame puts the line in the wrong place either which also happened with the Tierny goal which had the line on Tierney's outstretched hand. That's incredibly misleading. 

[bobbybingo]

12 minutes ago, Pepper said:

....it wouldn't surprise me if another angle showed Jota's head was offside. 

His hair was definitely offside.