New Investment Options

[steelboy]

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/ryan-reynolds-loses-millions-wrexham-29084611.amp

Wrexham are 9 million in debt now. They borrowed £6 million in one year.

They get fuck all from the TV show. 

[StAndrew7]

41 minutes ago, steelboy said:

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/ryan-reynolds-loses-millions-wrexham-29084611.amp

Wrexham are 9 million in debt now. They borrowed £6 million in one year.

They get fuck all from the TV show. 

Interesting at the end that they've apparently sold a 5% share of the club to Necaxa, as well.

[StAndrew7]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/cd1qzn95ez5o

 

Double post but there's St Johnstone's deal gone through. Interesting to hear their terms/valuation.

[wellfan]

4 minutes ago, StAndrew7 said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/cd1qzn95ez5o

 

Double post but there's St Johnstone's deal gone through. Interesting to hear their terms/valuation.

According to Wiki, the 16 acres that McDiarmid Park sits on was worth £400K in 1986. What's it worth now? Will it be sold from under them once/if it all goes wrong?

[StAndrew7]

1 minute ago, wellfan said:

According to Wiki, the 16 acres that McDiarmid Park sits on was worth £400K in 1986. What's it worth now? Will it be sold from under them once/if it all goes wrong?

Nae idea. The guy named is/was involved in Cambridge United purchasing their stadium back, based on what some StJ fans are saying on P&B.

[steelboy]

19 minutes ago, wellfan said:

According to Wiki, the 16 acres that McDiarmid Park sits on was worth £400K in 1986. What's it worth now? Will it be sold from under them once/if it all goes wrong?

It's apparently worth £20 million. There will be a side deal with the Browns to develop it. 

I'll be surprised if they don't end up with something like the wee temporary stadium Edinburgh Rugby play at. 

[Spiderpig]

18 minutes ago, wellfan said:

According to Wiki, the 16 acres that McDiarmid Park sits on was worth £400K in 1986. What's it worth now? Will it be sold from under them once/if it all goes wrong?

I would think It all depends on what conditions Mr McDiarmid the farmer who gifted the land to St Johnstone put on the transfer at the time. Maybe there are restrictions preventing it from being used for other purposes etc, so effectively rendering it unsaleable.

[wellfan]

24 minutes ago, Spiderpig said:

I would think It all depends on what conditions Mr McDiarmid the farmer who gifted the land to St Johnstone put on the transfer at the time. Maybe there are restrictions preventing it from being used for other purposes etc, so effectively rendering it unsaleable.

Besides a crematorium and a Tesco Extra already being built on that land, another portion of the land is also allocated for development in the Local Development Plan, which suggests there may not be restrictions on the site, but who knows?! See allocation H71 in LDP: https://www.pkc.gov.uk/media/45477/Perth-West/pdf/Perth_West.pdf?m=157926405488. Given the likely value of the land beneath and immediately surrounding the stadium, I'd be very concerned if I were a St Johnstone fan. 

[Kmcalpin]

Everything has gone very quiet hasn't it. Possibly down to the non disclosure agreement. 

Any further word of the Well Society proposal?

[wellfan]

1 hour ago, Kmcalpin said:

Everything has gone very quiet hasn't it. Possibly down to the non disclosure agreement. 

Any further word of the Well Society proposal?

Erik Barmack has been posting tweets of himself and his family following the games from the US on MFC TV, so I assume he's still interested, but the NDA prevents either party from reporting anything further.

On the Well Society proposal, I can only assume they're either still trying to pull a rabbit out of a hat or are busy focussing on the Live the Dream event.

[Spit_It_Out]

Just curious forgive me I am out the loop ilon this other than it pretty clear we need an investment to progress  but what can the Well Society offer now that it couldn't offer the club years ago?

It's a bit strange to me that soon as someone takes an bit of interest in us then suddenly a master plan is unearthed.

 

[Kmcalpin]

Other things being equal, which they aren't, I"d prefer the Society to devise its own investment plan. However, its going to have to come up with the goods. That's the bottom line. 

[wellfan]

55 minutes ago, Spit_It_Out said:

Just curious forgive me I am out the loop ilon this other than it pretty clear we need an investment to progress  but what can the Well Society offer now that it couldn't offer the club years ago?

It's a bit strange to me that soon as someone takes an bit of interest in us then suddenly a master plan is unearthed.

 

Yep, this is it for me as well. I’m sure I wrote somewhere here that it seems the external interest has given the WS a kick up the arse, but that it’s concerning that it’s taken them until now (when under threat) to attempt to devise an improved funding/membership strategy to benefit them and the club. 

[StAndrew7]

27 minutes ago, wellfan said:

Yep, this is it for me as well. I’m sure I wrote somewhere here that it seems the external interest has given the WS a kick up the arse, but that it’s concerning that it’s taken them until now (when under threat) to attempt to devise an improved funding/membership strategy to benefit them and the club. 

I wouldn't say that's entirely fair on the WS. The new board was elected in October and have been working on their vision since then; before any sort of investment video was released etc. The potential for investment will no doubt have given them that kick to get things moving more quickly, I agree, but that doesn't mean they weren't already working on revamping the WS from where it was.

As @Kmcalpin says, the WS board needs to come up with the goods (sooner rather than later, in my view) given where we are. I'm not a member, so can't comment on if any significant/members only communications that have gone out, but it's been awful quiet considering it's been over 6 months since the elections took place. That doesn't mean there's not a flood of announcements/information to come in the close season, though. There's probably been a fair bit of involvement on the WS end in the negotiations/discussions with EB which could have impacted on progress, given the board are all volunteers with a finite amount of time available.

It's been six weeks since the statement from the club on exclusivity being agreed with Barmack and Co. and other than the BBC's interview and Gavin McCafferty's article in the days following, things have (correctly) been kept under wraps. There was the odd social media post of him being at the games and meeting with the WS board representatives, but that's it.

I wouldn't be surprised if we start to hear more after Sunday's game; it would make sense to get the season over and start to announce things from there.

Also, just a final point; there's no reason that the two visions; EB's and the WS' can't work together, if WS/fans retain majority ownership of the club. EB's ideas for promotion of the club etc. could be a fantastic asset to growing the WS membership, beyond our traditional support/markets.

[texanwellfan]

31 minutes ago, wellfan said:

Yep, this is it for me as well. I’m sure I wrote somewhere here that it seems the external interest has given the WS a kick up the arse, but that it’s concerning that it’s taken them until now (when under threat) to attempt to devise an improved funding/membership strategy to benefit them and the club. 

Having an “improved” WS And an appropriate external investor would be great. 

[wellfan]

2 hours ago, StAndrew7 said:

I wouldn't say that's entirely fair on the WS. The new board was elected in October and have been working on their vision since then; before any sort of investment video was released etc. The potential for investment will no doubt have given them that kick to get things moving more quickly, I agree, but that doesn't mean they weren't already working on revamping the WS from where it was.

As @Kmcalpin says, the WS board needs to come up with the goods (sooner rather than later, in my view) given where we are. I'm not a member, so can't comment on if any significant/members only communications that have gone out, but it's been awful quiet considering it's been over 6 months since the elections took place. That doesn't mean there's not a flood of announcements/information to come in the close season, though. There's probably been a fair bit of involvement on the WS end in the negotiations/discussions with EB which could have impacted on progress, given the board are all volunteers with a finite amount of time available.

It's been six weeks since the statement from the club on exclusivity being agreed with Barmack and Co. and other than the BBC's interview and Gavin McCafferty's article in the days following, things have (correctly) been kept under wraps. There was the odd social media post of him being at the games and meeting with the WS board representatives, but that's it.

I wouldn't be surprised if we start to hear more after Sunday's game; it would make sense to get the season over and start to announce things from there.

Also, just a final point; there's no reason that the two visions; EB's and the WS' can't work together, if WS/fans retain majority ownership of the club. EB's ideas for promotion of the club etc. could be a fantastic asset to growing the WS membership, beyond our traditional support/markets.

I should've caveated my point to acknowledge that the new WS board are trying to affect positive change, which represents a significant improvement on the visionless status quo before them. However, even as a long-term WS member, I think these new efforts, whatever they may be, could be in vain given the number of paying members and the associated monthly income generated for the WS.

An ideal scenario would be a deal between an external investor and a revamped WS, with the latter retaining majority ownership and presenting a sustainable vision. That's perhaps wishful thinking, however. We've all been discussing this for weeks, so let's hope we get some clarity or an update following the season's conclusion.

[joewarkfanclub]

My reading of the situation is that the old board wanted the financial support provided by the Well Society without necessarily having any outside interference in their running of the club.

The Society was set up in a way that it had minority representation on the board and that representation was pretty close to existing board members, making it very difficult for other members of the Society to effect change.

Since the new WS board elections in October, the dynamic has changed somewhat and it feels like there is a drive to have more input into the decision making process.

Given that 2 of the old board are moving on and we now have a new CEO in place who was approved by the Society and an additional Society member on the board, it feels to me like the Society is in a better position to have influence in the direction the club will now take.

What happens next is crucial. Hopefully a joint enterprise between an investor and a rejuvinated Well Society where the future if the club is secured without any long term risk to any of our assets.

[Mintymac]

Shouldn’t be too long now to we here what’s happening and get some meat on the bones .

Now I’ve had a bit of time to think about it providing we can come to agreements with both parties then a joint venture would my favoured option.

The reason I’m saying this is in part due to how other clubs seem to be out manoeuvring us financially by varying degrees . 
The old adage was that money won’t buy you success but maybe not so true nowadays . 
As an older supporter of the mighty Well it probably wouldn’t bother me too much if relegated and playing in the championship as I would still enjoy going albeit it I’d prefer to stay in the top league .

This brings me to the conclusion that financial clout would perhaps keep us up but without it …… who knows but possibly would put us down the pecking order financially and into lower league .

So I’m hoping a mutual partnership would be my favoured option again on the proviso we do due diligence and don’t sell the club down the river . 
Interesting times ahead 

[Kmcalpin]

56 minutes ago, Mintymac said:

Now I’ve had a bit of time to think about it providing we can come to agreements with both parties then a joint venture would my favoured option.

The reason I’m saying this is in part due to how other clubs seem to be out manoeuvring us financially by varying degrees . 
The old adage was that money won’t buy you success but maybe not so true nowadays . 
As an older supporter of the mighty Well it probably wouldn’t bother me too much if relegated and playing in the championship as I would still enjoy going albeit it I’d prefer to stay in the top league .

This brings me to the conclusion that financial clout would perhaps keep us up but without it …… who knows but possibly would put us down the pecking order financially and into lower league .

So I’m hoping a mutual partnership would be my favoured option again on the proviso we do due diligence and don’t sell the club down the river .

I've done a lot of thinking over the past 24 hours and revised my preference a little. I agree with your take Minty.

The danger is, if we don't compete financially, then we drop down the leagues and lose fans. Make no mistake, if we couldn't compete financially with the likes of St Mirren and St Johnstone today, then we wouldn't be able to compete financially with the likes of Dunfermline, Partick and Falkirk tomorrow.  And so it would go on. Such teams will be looking to new investment opportunities sooner rather than later.

Whatever else it does, the Society needs to become more commercially astute and aware. I don't subscribe to the "Bowling Club" mentality that some fans have of the Society, but there's a grain of truth in their concerns. 

[Kmcalpin]

There's been some discussion on P & B about the Society not necessarily needing to put the external investment proposal to a vote, if it deems it to be  pretty unacceptable. I don't know.

However, if it doesn't put the proposal to a vote, it has to come up with a credible alternative financial plan to put to members. 

 

[wellfan]

31 minutes ago, Kmcalpin said:

There's been some discussion on P & B about the Society not necessarily needing to put the external investment proposal to a vote, if it deems it to be  pretty unacceptable. I don't know.

However, if it doesn't put the proposal to a vote, it has to come up with a credible alternative financial plan to put to members. 

Not putting a proposal to a vote would be a surefire way for the WS to lose the goodwill and support of paying members. Democracy is key. 

[joewarkfanclub]

19 minutes ago, wellfan said:

Not putting a proposal to a vote would be a surefire way for the WS to lose the goodwill and support of paying members. Democracy is key. 

I suppose that depends on the detail of the deal on offer and whether there was any room for negotiation on the part of the investor.

If its a black and white take it or leave it offer that clearly isnt in the interests of the club, not sure what the point of putting it to a vote would be?

Just say we think its a shit offer because of x,y and z and move on.

Democracy is definitely important but Id say transparency is the key.

[wellfan]

7 minutes ago, joewarkfanclub said:

I suppose that depends on the detail of the deal on offer and whether there was any room for negotiation on the part of the investor.

If its a black and white take it or leave it offer that clearly isnt in the interests of the club, not sure what the point of putting it to a vote would be?

Just say we think its a shit offer because of x,y and z and move on.

Democracy is definitely important but Id say transparency is the key.

Transparency and democracy are key. There's too much speculation at the moment.

[joewarkfanclub]

1 minute ago, wellfan said:

Transparency and democracy are key. There's too much speculation at the moment.

Agreed. Be nice just to get an announcement and move on. Feels like the whole season has been a holding pattern......

[steelboy]

2 hours ago, wellfan said:

Not putting a proposal to a vote would be a surefire way for the WS to lose the goodwill and support of paying members. Democracy is key. 

If the proposal is shit then what's the point?

If the Well Society board is split then the next steps will be complicated. These sort of repercussions are why it was a stupid idea to let Jim McMahon run about trying to give away a football club that he doesn't own.