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I said in an earlier post that he needs time, however we could be 2nd bottom next week..at what point to the board pull the pin after that?

I'd probably believe the whole outdated "he's never played the game, so he doesn't have a clue" angle if our team was made up of "good honest laddies" who "run their socks off", but it isn't. It's made up of players who have been, for the most part, brought in because they understand the modern, progressive style of football we're looking to implement. They should be familiar with the type of coaching they're getting, and the modern analytical approach. And that includes a modern coach whose resume isn't built on playing for Luton Town, Bristol City, or any of the middling to lower-level clubs we have up here. What we're going through is absolutely a process. We've lost a fair amount of our best players in the summer. We've had to replace them with new players, and unlike last year, when everything clicked and our purchases paid off big time mostly, we're not seeing as easy a transition this time around. It was always bound to happen, in my opinion. What we did last season is basically unsustainable for a club our size, but some fans are insisting on comparing the current team and manager to one of the best teams and managers we've probably ever seen at the club in modern times. Remember back when Kettlewell was manager? And fans were saying that they simply expected a team on the park who can at least try to play some attacking football, give us something to be excited about, and look to challenge for top six? That's what we have. We were taken apart today by a team that has the resources and ability to bring players like Jota off the bench. Celtic were on their game, and could easily have taken four or five off us. If they play like that against the teams around us, they'll likely hand out a fair few hammerings. But at least we somewhat gave it a shot. I remember watching us under previous managers just sit back and hope to grab something. Today we at least had some flashes of football to watch, and a team that tried to do something. It didn't work out, but that's how it goes. In short, the football isn't anywhere near as eye-bleedingly bad as it has been, and we're still one of the better sides to watch in the league. I'm interested in seeing how the new players eventually settle in, see who makes the cut, see who really grasps the opportunity to replicate what others have done before them and win a big move, and see who will become a quiz question in 10 years time. At least watching Motherwell is enjoyable again. I'm liking how we're playing. Add in some decent results and we're all good.

Very poor today and a bit concerning it feels we are getting progressively worse. Look like conceding in every game, we are too easy to defend against and when we lose possession we don't seem to work like we did last season to get it back. Could not understand Vogt being in from the start and found it even more baffling he came out for the second half. Not blaming the guy because it's not him that decides he starts but he seems lost and devoid of confidence. Today won't have helped him.

Anyone who claims that they ‘see’ it that way is either utterly clueless about football or else is using self assuring bravado to try and convince themselves that it wasn’t as bad as it was because we only lost by two goals when it should have been at least six.

How anyone cant see that Celtic opened us up time and again I find truly astonishing. The keeper saved us from a hammering.

If that £11M striker Høgh wasn't such a diddy with the first touch of an elephant we would have lost that by a much higher scoreline. They cut us open at will especially down the left and he got in numerous great positions only to completely mis control the ball.

You and I definitely watch different games. Celtic opened us up time and again 6 or 7 goals to Celtic would not have been an injustice.

Which he did, he brought Turnbull and Scott into the team and arguably launched Turnbull’s career. Remind me, who did Alexander bring through? Or at least who did he give a chance to given that he didn’t have the luxury of a Turnbull in the youth system. And what football did he try and play?? We’re getting sidetracked by this trip down memory lane and revisionism, however my core point is that this current team and manager look absolutely hopelessly out of their depth and as a result are attracting legitimate and deserved criticism from supporters. That is all fair enough and it is certainly not ‘toxic’ behaviour as your earlier post claimed.

I mean in general not just today every time Celtic went down our right side they cut us open because Vogt had no interest in defending ( how often did we get cut open on our left? ) they hit the post, we cleared 1 off the line, their forward had numerous chances, keeper made numerous saves ( deflected 1 for example although not sure why he can’t hold onto shots with zero power ) could have comfortably scored somewhere between 5-8 on a different day we’ve watched a different game

I tend to disagree with a few posters, I thought we weren’t too bad today, there are areas though that scratched my head about, namely starting Vogts ahead of Said, and why SOD wasn’t at RB and Knight Lebel at CH with Moorman I never know, agree with posters Sparrow is never right back and got rightly roasted but Vogts is so far out his depth it’s how the fuck did we sign him? Other posters have also nailed on the fact we seem to go to the right side with Vogts n Sparrow when the best crosser we have in Longo gets forgotten on the left…why???? When you see Longo looking to the sky n shaking his head as they go right again you wonder WTF are we doing The best and brightest attacking play came when Said came on, Vogts should have been hooked at 30minutes, I’d start with Said against Killie, stick SOD at RB, Sparrow to bench n start Knight Lebel at CH with Moorman, as for AJ I’m withering but he does need the benefit of a bit more time, we have played well against Hibs, United and in Europe the talent is there but please AJ drop Vogts as far away as possible! Its a must win against Killie now and get some confidence back in the team.

OK, we'll start with the score and then you can add all the sitters on you think Celtic should have scored. Go.

Yeah but both their goals were gifted by us. They hit the bar and I think it was Hassan should scored a tap in but other than that it was mostly routine stuff that was either speculative or that the goalkeeper would be expected to save. I said Celtic dominated possession and deserved to win but they didn't tear us to shreds. If it wasn't for O'Donnell's pass back it would have been 0-1 and who knows, we might even have got something out the game.

Don’t think this manager looks like he’s got the answers I’m open to hearing though what positives you’re currently seeing though wild to say we weren’t ripped apart by 1 of the worst Celtic teams in my life time all the same 😂

Had to be Paulsen. If you want to be super critical he maybe was a bit slow to get down to the first one but it was against the post going in and his other saves prevented a severe tanking. Said gave us a bit of a threat when he came on that was rarely there before.

I was negative about Robinson for a period, mainly because he ignored excellent youth players and played hoofball. But, no, you are right, I was way off to advocate bringing guys like Turnbull in and actually play some football.

We all see the game differently. For me Celtic had 25 shots, 15 on target v's our 2 shots. If they won 4-0 today I'd have had no grumbles.

Completely and utterly relieved to get out at 2-0, should have been far far more. My god we were so passive. To only commit 3 fouls at home against a team with 66% possession is a disgrace. McGregor could have played with his slippers on apart from 1 tackle that Hodge was carded for. We had to get closer and put some physical pressure on them. Playing through us with easy. Vogts can’t be seen again and we should not be starting games with SOD at centre half again. Next week we need to go back to basics and get our best players in their best position on the pitch. Would be great to see Priestman back, we’ve missed him massively. I fear if we lose next week Alfred will lose the majority of the support and we’ll be heading into a relegation battle.

He might be a dud. But we are 8 games into a league season. Our average points total this decade after 8 matches is 10 points. We are 2 points behind that having played both Rangers and Celtic. BTW our best start under any manager this decade was under Stuart Kettlewell and our worst start was under Askou. So just ponder on that for a bit.

That’s what you said about the last time we managed to reach the Scottish Cup Final under Robinson, who you were very vocal in being negative about and heaping pressure on as I remember. But now you’re getting up on your high horse again about supporters voicing legitimate concerns about the current team, manager and the performances which have brought about four losses in a row with very little to be positive about?? Just like your passionate defence of Graham Alexander and the shite he was serving up and your jumping on Stuart Kettlewell’s bandwagon after he opened his arse and spewed nonsense about the support? Contrary much?

That was possibly the worst performance we have turned out since Kettlewell. What is baffling is that we have the same coaching staff as last year but we are churning out abject shite. This wasnt a hard luck story today, we were pounded & a 2-0 defeat flattered us. Tried to play our game at the back but then long ball after long ball in their half. Completly forgetting we have the tools to cut them open. Not using longello more - mental Starting vogt when youv got Said, Tawanda & kanga on the bench Midfield totally bypassed today. Never really noticed much from levit. Really need priestman back. Always busy & can break the play up & provide a solid base Very few runs to the byline & crossing back to the big striker Pretty much everyone scared to take a shot on Starting the second half with the same 11 Despite getting horsed, not changing the shape and personel until we were 2 down through an hour Both the goals were mistakes we made, but celtic should have been out of sight. 😢

It’s a transitional period which we’d expect signs progress and patches of inconsistency - not linear improvement but nor should it be a consistent decline . we’re getting worse as each week passes . we started well in Europe , played well against Hibs but in my mind it’s not just 4 defeats - since the Dundee Utd game we’ve not played well and continue to regress. most of us expected to see an improvement today - signs of something better - that didn’t happen .

Your last paragraph is just a blatant lie.

You are not wrong in anything you've said but it still doesn't mean the manager isn't a dud. A transitional period doesn't always end happily

Seb for his endless energy and having wille playing beside him contributing fuck all.

The gaffer said