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It is really difficult to know where to start with this. The third manager in as many seasons suffering the same drop off in performance level from his players as the previous two men. Go back just 3 months ago and this same team had just won away to Hearts with Kettlewell enjoying once of the best win percentage of any manager in the clubs history. Can it really become a terminal situation once again in such a short space of time? Reading the forum last night was bizarre. Not only were there some posters almost relishing the position the team finds itself in once more but there were others showing hostility towards those who have attempted to support the manager over this difficult few months. Some of the language is tasteless and highly emotive, particularly when we consider that Kettlewell is a man who saved us from relegation last season and has clearly given his all to make his time a success. I should not be surprised. Swap out the name of Kettlewell for Hammell/ Alexander/ Robinson/ Baraclough etc.... and it is an all to familiar read on these boards. Last night was a worry but I don't think it necessary means the end for Kettlewell. I think his team selection last night was one of a man who has let the pressure get to him. He has lost his head somewhat as one poster described it. This does not make him a poor manager necessarily, just a guy that is not thinking straight under difficult circumstances. I think this is the sort of time that club chairmen need to step in and do their bit. Help the manager ( in this case Kettlewell) clear his head. Try to help him see clearly once more. What was working so well just six months ago that is not working now? How can we get back to making simple, effective decisions. I want Kettlewell to get the gig on Saturday for four very simple reasons: 1. I would love to see the guy turn it round and give the club some much needed stability. 2. To see the club buck the modern trend of sacking managers at the first sign of trouble. As a club we are quickly gaining a reputation for just that unfortunately. 3. It might just break a culture in the club where players down tools at the first sign of trouble should Kettlewell be able to turn this round. 4. If Kettlewell could turn this round it might silence, for just a little while, those on these boards that offer little by way of support to the manager or the team. It is the easiest thing in the world to say that the manager is rubbish and should be sacked because in all likelihood most managers are now just 4/5 poor results away from the sack. It does not make you a visionary to spout the same negative vibes time and time again to then claim victory when almost enivitably managers are shown the door. I am not saying Kettlewell will turn this round. Actually for the first time last night I think the balance shifted towards him not getting out of this. All I am saying is that I hope every option of support is given to him at the club to help him turn this round. If he gets that chance this weekend we need to back him. The atmosphere does not have to be toxic unless the fans choose to make it that way.

That definitely has to stop. This is where we could really do with the Well Society stepping up. If we really are a fan owned club then we should be able to influence the direction of it. Demanding that the correct processes be put in place for a secure future would be a good starting point.

I nearly spat my tea all over my laptop when I read that!

Some people need to give their heads a wobble and realise that a business decision has to be made here. We're in freefall and have been for a while, and inaction will see us relegated. Putting the poor results aside, the majority of signings and player movements in/out have been questionable, to say the least, and as awful as our form, to put it accurately. With that in mind, to give Kettlewell and Daws another transfer window would be a grossly negligent use of funds. It's that simple to me. Whether that means replacing Kettlewell or Daws (or both), the decision is down to the Board, and they must act before it's too late.

We’ll win 2-1. Based on nothing but hope and optimism.

Not a popular post, I’m sure, but I’m with you. The board need to take him aside and have a word with him. Calm him down, redirect his focus onto the things that worked, re institute a firm grounding in the basics and tweak from there. Do not make radical wholesale changes from week to week. At four games or so into this bad run we were still playing very well and had we continued to play that way we would not be in this mess. However, we now have confidence/mental side of things causing us issues as well. The players and manager need to get the last 11 or so results out of their head. The focus is going forward. Consider the next 17 games as a mini season starting from scratch and focus on that league table. I’m done with sacking managers. We have already have the advantage of hindsight on that, it doesn’t work, it just leads us back to where we were. We are all in it together so the board, the players especially, and the fans need to support and encourage the manager and team. As mentioned, I think it’s very cruciaL that the board Support and guide him to keep his head straight and steer him away from panic actions.

I think before we sack another manager we need to ask ourselves a few questions. 1. Are we realistically going to get someone else in before the end of the month? And by someone else, I mean an actual, proper candidate. Not Stevie Frail or David Clarkson. 2. Will another manager find himself in a position to make wholesale changes in January? Because the chances are that a new manager is going to want to change things up quite a bit, and this current squad is very much built to Kettlewell's specification, including no natural wingers, and very light on actual midfielders. 3. Is sacking yet another manager actually the answer? Is it the correct message to send out to the players, that whenever they find themselves in a situation where they underperform, they won't be held accountable? And that they'll be given a clean slate with a new manager? I think we need to take all of the above into account. For me, unless we have an outstanding candidate who is ready and willing to jump in straight away, there's no point in sacking Kettlewell. One thing we do know is that he's capable of getting something from this group of players. He did it before. Maybe he can do it again? I don't know if a fresh face for the sake of "something must be done!!!!" is the answer. EDIT: Also, I've merged the "new manager" thread with this one. I don't think it's quite right to be discussing a new manager as if it's a foregone conclusion when we still have a gaffer in the dugout.

Seeing all the usual suspects being chucked about as potential contenders for the manager's job, I have to say that I'm completely underwhelmed by most of them. It seems the approach is to copy & paste what we've done lately and continue as is. We appoint someone new, they get a bit of a bounce out of the players and we stay up, they then get the gig for the following season, and tear up the squad in the summer because they don't have the same philosophy as the previous manager, which results in players at the club who aren't being utilised properly, contracts being ended, "punts" on players being taken, and a patchwork quilt of a squad for the following season. We may or may not start quite well, but inevitably the wheels come off and we're back to square one. As boring and painful as it may be, we need to actually look at the processes that got us into the position we find ourselves in recent times. If we don't address those, we'll just keep doing the same thing over and over.

1I was all for giving SK a chance but this run we are on is brutal and he's showing no signs of getting us out of it, the players don't look interested to be honest, has he lost the dressing room I don't know but the team has that look about it. If SK does go then whoever comes in is stuck with the same dross, we could have Guardiola, in charge and he would never turn the likes of Bair, Obika, Shaw, etc into decent players. For me the whole club needs a reset from top to bottom to build a decent stable team and club Iinstead of the rebuild every season we seem to have With the quality deteriorating every time.

His time is up. Failed at County. Failing big time here. Clueless doesn't begin to describe him. Any manger making 5 tactical subs in a game has lost the plot and is just desperately trying anything. If it was any other club rather than the Mickey Mouse team and set up we have become he would have been sacked right after the game. County did it with Big Malky and got Adams. Not saying he is a great manager but he has 635 games under his belt and has won four promotions. Kettlewell has 60 games as a manager. We are simply becoming a joke club. Our squad, board and manager are nowhere near good enough to be in the Premier League.

Start with the Board. That's where the problems stem from. Their management of the club and decisions will finish us as a top flight club. As soon as we became fan owned that was the end. Haven't replaced Burrows yet, probably because they don't have the money and if they did who the fuck would touch it. They have stewarded over a revolving door of managers. As for most of the signings they wouldn't get a game in my five a side team. There is nothing concerning the club that is professional in any shape or form.

Agree re Daws . It’s a joke that 30 players signed only 7 left and the could see there 4th manager in small space of time . the article on bbc could have been written by @David , very similar points that he outlined last week . chairman needs his backside kicked , can’t be that hard to get a ceo , not hard to spot recruitment issues and that’s 2 rookie managers that he’s hired . dont blame SH or SK for going for the role but club are being lazy . it’s clear that recruitment is brutal , clear that if smaller squad we should pay higher salary for better talent . sadly it’s also clear that SK has lost the plot with formations and the 7 players who have cost other managers their job don’t have the quality required to save SK . quite a bit needs to happen beyond just sacking a manager https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67636847

I voted. Hopefully for individuals that would push for change......

Are you MJC are you MJC are you MJC in disguise...........arrrrreee youuuu MJCCC in disguise 🤣🤣🤣

I'm actually going to issue a bit of a rallying call here. Having been one of the unfortunate few who suffered an 8 hour round trip to Dingwall to suffer another 90mins of absolute dross I had made my mind up to give Saturday a miss to save what's left of my sanity. I said elsewhere that I hope Kettlewell gives them the morning off and gets them in this afternoon, locks them in the dressing room and no-one gets out until the current problems are thrashed out. Might not be pretty but I think it's reached that stage now. Having slept on it I now realise that would be the easy coward's way out and I will be there. My worry is that with all the negativity on the forums there is a toxic atmosphere even before the game starts so I think it's important that the fans show their support right from the start and get right behind the team. I support Motherwell as a club first and foremost and the 11 on the park are only the present holders of the jersey.Happy clapper stuff maybe. HOWEVER if they can't get up for this game then I think we're well and truly fucked and I would be one of the first outside the stand shouting sack the board/manager or whatever, but hopefully it doesn't get to that point and we're all talking about a performance and win on Saturday night. Whether or not we stay up or get relegated this season I think a major rethink of how the club operates is needed as we surely can't keep going on the way we are and that includes reviewing every function in the club, listening to every stakeholder and fans views in an open and transparent way and coming up with an affordable and workable medium to long term strategy.

Then that maybe speaks to the people you associate with, because I know of no one, in "real life" or on this forum who would advocate for McFadden to get the job.

We could pick up nothing between now and new year and i still think he will be given time i cant see a transfer window making any difference unless they can shift out all the dross that Kettlewell and Daws signed in the summer. However what i find intresting is wasnt it the same Stuart Kettlewell the other week saying the sacking of managers in Scotland is an utter disgrace?Maybe that is playing on our boards mind giving them food for thought.

You're talking nonsense right there. Don't make the naive error of believing that because someone is a supporter of the club, isn't overly negative, and tries to see the positives that they're absolute morons. No one I have spoken to would want Faddy to get the job. At all. If he did get it, would they support him? Absolutely. Big difference there though.

I don't think we need another young and ambitious guy. We need someone with experience and a modicum of proven ability at a similar level.

The problem is, we've gone from having nine midfielders in the squad last season, to having five. One of which is out injured for a fairly lengthy amount of time, and another who seemingly can't buy himself a game despite being signed in the summer. Kettlewell and the recruitment team have painted themselves into a corner in that regard. We can't get more bodies in the middle of the park because we don't really have any.

That is the only silver lining here, and it also means we're unlikely to be willing to offer his replacement anything more than 18 months until we're confident that we're out of this current rinse/repeat cycle.

You're right, and I was pissed off. The defeat was disastrous, which we both acknowledged would be the case should that happen.

Ive defended Kettlewell on here and being honest I thought he would turn it around, however last nights team selection after what we watched on Saturday was crazy, if anything we should have been looking at how we get more bodies in the middle of the park, not less! To start with only Spittal & Slattery as proper midfield players playing away from home was mad! However to suggest he’s lost the dressing is nonsense (last night apart) the one thing we have shown in recent weeks is a great spirit to get back into games! St Johnstone away, County at home and Celtic away, all in recent weeks. i think he’ll get Saturday, but with confidence shot to pieces, injuries piling, and a manager that seems to have lost the ability to set us up hard to beat I’m not confident to say the least.

I’m not a Liam Kelly fan but in fairness, even greats like Yashin or Banks would be made to look bad playing in this team.

Last time I have cheese at supper time, what a nightmare!! Dreamed we lost a goal in the first minute and then were rank rotten and got pumped 3-0!!, thank goodness it was all a dre.............aw baws!!!

I can offer no suggestions as to who our next manager will or should be but it is patently obvious that changes and a fresh approach are needed. In this respect we must stop going back to ex-players as coaches or appointing from within because it has not, and is not working.

No we don't Cornelius isn't any better than the pish we have now, he got off lightly very often because he was a Motherwell fan same as McKinstry

I thought he'd be gone by now. I reckon they're gonna give him Saturday as well. Unbelievable.

We only deserve to be in a lower league if we end up bottom of the league at the end of the season and anyone who thinks it's a good reset opportunity is off their head.

You won't get any arguement from me. Would rather eat my own bollocks than have that horrible cunt at the club.

Personal view - hire someone who’s already in a job. pay the signing on fee rather than forking out compensation . someone like Ian Murray who’s done well in the championchip or Dave Challinor who’s worked wonders at Stockport managers who have hundreds of games with +40% win record in lower leagues but still hungry to do more is where I’d look .

I've tried to support him I like him. However 4 points from 36 would get a manager sacked in any team in any league. There's no hiding place. I'll be amazed if he's not sacked tomorrow. That said the players are an utter disgrace.

There's no chance of that happening. If Ricky Foster ever manages Motherwell it'll be time for an Italian style training ground riot.

As soon as he signed Obika and Paton I knew we were fucked. He then followed up with Wilkinson who can't run and Davor who is utter shite. Then he brings Souare who is basically Samuel L Jackson in Unbreakable. Then tops it off with Theo Bair who was laughed out of St Johnstone. The only conclusion you can come to is that he's thick as mince. We are lightweight in midfield and start a 5 man defence every game yet have by far the worst defence in the league. Take out the Old Firm games and we are currently conceding on average 2 a game which is horrific.

Tam courts ?? Are you having a laugh. It’s bizarre he’s managed to get any management gig. Apparently he was a terrible car salesman too. lambert doesn’t want it, he’s said that twice before when it was on offer. mccall is on gardening leave is he not now? so he’ll want to continue to get a hefty wedge from Sheffield for the next 2yrs we are getting stuck with frail and foster, and we’d be idiots to think otherwise

Tam Courts, Paul Lambert or Stuart McCall. Kettlewell has to go.

I just think we can't keep changing manager and genuinely thought we could turn things round but I think this downward spiral continues but the players also need to have a look at themselves,

Modern life is rubbish eh. People don't have any patience anymore and everything needs to happen now for their own benefit and apparent well being. Social media helps the minority to whip up a crisis, when in the past it was a blip. Club success anywhere rarely happens overnight and managers need time to build a team, especially clubs who don't have much money. Every teams fans forum, say the same. Sack. The manager as he's hopeless etc etc. Perhaps we can be different for once and our fan base can be a bit more realistic about our level in the game and support the manager/players.

You should pause this thread as I bet the Board fails to act (again) and Kettlewell gets the St Johnstone game to throw more darts at a map.