Kmcalpin

Just watched the TV highlights and both goals were totally avoidable being down to defensive errors. For the first the Celtic player arrives in the box and is completely unmarked, not tracked by anyone. Yes, he finishes well but he has the time and space in our box to do what he wants. The second, as has already been mentioned was a shambolic and totally avoidable error down to poor communication. Samson may have been culpable at the penalty, as the Captain has said above but overall his defence and midfield continually left him badly exposed and to that extent he did well. Surprised at the large number of empty seats. Not a midweek game, a 3pm Saturday kick off and not the week before Christmas. I wonder what the official attendance was. Worrying that our injury list seems to be growing again and that our only two left backs are unavailable. Certainly these are the kind of games that traditionally our managers rest players who are not fit. To finish on a positive note, good to see some young lads get an opportunity to gain some first team football.

Given our earlier discussions on this thread an intertesting article from the BBC (The Sun). Celtic will look for protection from world governing body Fifa if any clubs try to entice Karamoko Dembele away from the Scottish champions after the 13-year-old made a substitute appearance for the club's under-20 side earlier this week. Now given that Celtic and many other clubs poach young players, including ours, isn't this blatant double standards?

100% agree. We can debate, discuss and disagree but we're all Well fans and should show respect to one another on these boards.

Good post as usual Sir. I tend to agree that we wouldn't have much, if indeed any say, about if or where young Semple went on a "visit" to learn about different teams. No doubt its giving Benfica an opportunity to assess whether he's worth keeping under surveillance on or not..

We don't know much about Brill and Blyth yet and I think Bowman has something to offer, if played correctly. Belic - who knows? However with regard to midfield your spot on. We've known for some time now that it needed replaced / upgraded but the players we've signed seem to be ad hoc and not what we require. I suspect Pearo's departure caught us on the hop but we've all known that Keith Lasley is at the end of his career and that Marvin Johnson would likely move on. That said, Pearo was a box to box player than a creative one. As for the younger lads I would expect the management team, by the end of last season, to have known pretty well who would make the step up to first team football in August ie nobody.

Teams like St Johnstone, Inverness and Hamilton all manage to be competitive. While its nice to have flair and panache in the side at our level its not necessary. Every team needs a balance of talent, flair, solidity, and hardness. We have some decent talented players in the squad but what we need are athletic, hard working, solid, reliable types and this is what we lack. They're not expensive and can be picked up as Tom Wright at Perth will testify. Players who are not standouts but make few mistakes and can be relied upon not to let you down.

I'm reasonably happy with Moult, MacDonald and Bowman as each brings something different to the team and they have the potential to play well together IF they're played to their strengths which did not happen last night. MacDonald will never be a lone target man and Moult is not a midfielder. Skippy is at his best when playing off the shoulder of a bigger man like Moult or Bowman. To play to their full potential they also need good service and quick support. Our fundamental problems lie in midfield and defence. The midfield in particular lacks creativity and certainly defensive qualities. Most Premiership sides we've met this season can outcompete and outrun us in midfield and that is root cause of most of our problems. Despite their weaknesses, Clay and Lasley are giving 100% but they just aren't capable of putting in an acceptable work rate due to their lack of pace. I don't know that they're the worst s central midfield combination in the league but if they aren't they can't be far off it. Hearts' midfield worked like trojans last night, running all over the park to frustrate, harry and hassle us. Partick were the same as were Accies, Ross County and St Johnstone. They may not be eye catching glamourous qualities but they are badly needed. In one example last night 3 Hearst attackers had Hammell surrounded near his own corner flag. He made a pass under pressure and they immediately darted off to annoy the recipient. We're simply not capable of playing like that off the ball. I think it was Al B who said that until Pearson resigns McGhee hopes that the midfield will muddle through. Yes, we're missing McHugh but Al is right in my opinion. The question is "Is our midfield good enough to muddle through?"

Absolutely - the way we played just asked for trouble. In truth we were beaten by 7.45. I agree with many comments about the wrong formation and tactics. The front three didn't know what they were meant to be doing. Moult was wasted in midfield and for much of the time Bowman played far too deep. MacDonald was on a hiding to nothing in a sometimes 4-5-1 formation trying to win aerial balls. Cadden's enforced departure didn't help as he was our midfield. Samson wasn't the cause of our loss but he looked far from impressive. As MJW wrote we sat far too deep and paid the penalty. Both full backs were poor again and I shudder to think both are on 2 year deals. The midfield simply didn't function - no creativity, no protection for the defence and poor work rate. Lucas didn't impress when he came on and did very little of note but too early to judge him. Hearts ran out easy and worthy winners. Their midfield and defence was way above ours in terms of performance. Not the best Hearts team I've seen by along way but they were clinical in their finishing and worked their socks off when off the ball. They harried, chased and closed us down. I felt sorry for McManus and Heneghan - they have problems behind them (keeper); in front of them (central midfield) and to the side of them (full backs). I sincerely hope that McHugh stiffens our midfield on his return but we're still a creative player short there. Lasley is well past it now and I just don't see what Clay brings to the team. Lucas????

Only one candidate for me...Heneghan. Not brilliant but the best of a very poor lot.

We'll be heading off for the game in the next hour or so. The injury list seems pretty much the same as last week but you can never really tell until the team is announced. Hopefully tonight our midfield will put in a performance lasting more than half an hour. This will be a critical area of the field for us. COYW.

The entire issue of safety and fan behaviour at football grounds is riddled with inconsistency and vested interests. As far as the cup final was concerned we had an absurd situation of one of our 2 footballing authorities investigating itself - with totally unsurprising conclusions coming from the report. Furthermore the legal representative of one of these bodies was engaged to fight the corner of one of the clubs against the other body. Bizarre or what? Going back to the end of last season, we had 4 games which involved pitch invasions, with one club even encouraging fans onto the pitch and yet nothing was said about them. As far as our own club was concerned it was taken to task over a number of issues including inadequate stewarding (not an issue at last season's cup final obviously). As most of you know the bible on this is the Green Book. Our club not only adhered to the level of stewarding set out in these guidelines but indeed doubled it. Despite this, the SPFL kangaroo court deemed it to be inadequate. I've never ever come across another organisation taken to task for doing something which was well in excess of the agreed industry standard. The Scottish Government has just said that its concerned at the lack of outcomes from the Cup Final Inquiry. Thats all very well and good but if it does take things further it might have to face up to very controversial and uncomfortable issues that have dogged our game in Scotland for years, unless it does so at arms length, which Scottish and UK governments tend to do.

Its difficult to make much sense of that to be honest as its certainly not written in plain english. However, I have yet to establish how Rangers were held to account for the behaviour of their fans at Fir Park ie throwing missiles, including ripped out seats onto the pitch, albeit under provocation. Again as far as Rangers were concerned what steps did the club take to identify those who indulged in sectarian singing at the cup final? Once again complete inconsistency from the authorities.

It was more complex and wide ranging than that. If I recall the main charge was that we were deemed to have taken insufficient action to prevent fans from running onto the park (work that one out if you can) and allowing an untrained steward to extinguish a smoke bomb; and a range of other issues.

Certainly blatant double standards here. The footballing authorities' inconsistent treatment of the issue of fans behaviour and strict liability is nothing short of short of shocking and unacceptable.

Was he pressurised to play? Some managers don't like players who play it safe with injuries.

"Every Scots football fan loves Partick Thistle" - quote from BBC about 10 years ago. It stuck in my memory.

OK, but where do you play him given that Cadden plays "widish" right?

This has been a very frustrating feature of our play for quite some time now and it leaves our defence, including the keeper, very exposed. Why? I suspect its a combination of tactics and the way our midfielders play. I never like to see our midfield defend deeply as any mistake can be costly and leaves defenders only limited time to react and recover. It also leaves Samson exposed to an unchallenged potshot from the edge of the box - Edwards yesterday? We do lack a mobile hard tackling defensive midfielder, someone to delay opponents attacks until we're organised at the back; get in their faces and close them down. If we had someone like that it would take the pressure of our defenders and cut down the likelihood of mistakes. We can but hope.

Pretty much agree with this. Its often a significant contributory factor when the strikers don't do much or the defence is having an off day. Admittedly McHugh's injury has affected us but the midfield just doesn't seem right in terms of balance or personnel. I like Cadden and I'd exempt him from criticism. However with the exception of right sided Ainsworth and the "Jury's still out" Thomas we have no width, especially on the left hand side. Chalmers is more of a defensive player and you could argue he's due a run at left back. In the middle, Clay although a decent all rounder, sits very deep and lacks pace whilst the committed Lasley lacks pace and is 37. We don't yet know much about Belic or Lucas. Maybe Pearo will return at the turn of the year? In short we lack a left winger; lack pace in central midfield; and lack an out and out attacking midfielder. The engine room doesn't seem capable of lasting for more than 30 minutes. The balance just isn't right. That said, we must be doing something right if we can get draws at Dingwall and Firhill and beat Accies at home.

Just watched the TV highlights - a few observations. A shocking pass by Hammell for Thistle's goal but I don't think Samson can be apportioned blame - he's on a hiding to nothing. I can't see why MacDonald's first "goal" was chalked off - he was clearly onside. So, although there's much talk about us being lucky Thistle also benefitted from a slice of good luck. As the Captain said, Tait's cross for the goal was an absolute peach. From admittedly brief clips it seems as though our midfield wasn't competitive enough. Still an away point isn't a bad result.

I wasn't at the game but it sounds as though our midfield was outfought and outplayed again. Although the strikers seemed ineffective was it down to lack of service?

No need to tell us about parking in streets near Fir Park as we've attended games there for decades. Most of us were also brought up in these very streets. The cost to us per head per game is about 50p and how we choose to spend our money is our concern. By way of comparison, we don't indulge in pre match drinks before games for example, unlike many fans (thats their right and their own business) - how much beer or spirits do you think they would get if they asked for 50p's worth before a match in a local hostelry? Unlike donations to local publicans, who benefit from MFC's support but don't put much if anything back in return, our cash goes to the club and doesn't line third parties' pockets. Presumably you also think that buying a weekly lottery ticket for example is a sign of reckless financial extravagance? Our money is our concern not yours and how we choose to spend it is our business. You have no idea about our finances and its of no concern to you. However I don't think spending 50p or thereabouts per home game on parking is throwing money about. We also have other reasons for parking where we do but I'm not prepared to discuss them in a public forum. How people spend their hard earned cash is up to them - live and let live I say.

Would you care to explain???

Just for the record I don't but I'd be ever so slightly put out if someone nearby did and the driver drove his vehicle at me or mine. Footballers are only human and I don't see the harm in "low level" banter but some of these chants are in bad taste. There's still no excuse for belting the ball at the crowd though.

I don't think that its a good idea for anyone to be smacked in the face irrespective of age but yes, perhaps some of us have overplayed the children argument. I agree that there will always be a risk of being hit accidentally by a ball in stadia and yes, sometimes the authorities do go overboard on H & S. However I draw the line at a player deliberately smacking the ball at fans - that is tantamount to assault in my book. All of us walk along pavements and roads and we accept that there's a risk of being hit accidentally by a vehicle but we don't expect to be deliberately targeted by drivers.