MelvinBragg Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 What would people like to see for the next five games? I would be in favour of playing the youngsters in every game to see if they can cope in the SPL. By playing them in every gamewe avoid being accused of favouring any of the teams fighting relegation. I'd make a point of telling them it's performances rather than results is what we're looking at. To that end I'd like to see a team of Coutts Saunders Quinn Page Hammell Slane Lasley© Fitzpatrick O'Brien Murphy McHugh The experienced guys that I have left in there are there because I don't know of any young players coming through in their positions and the fact that they are guys that are under contract next season. If you wanted you could alternate front twos, one week play Clarkson and McHugh, the next Sutton and Murphy. I think most of the support would at least cut this team some slack and we will get a chance to find out who might make the grade better than giving these guys half an hour in the last game of the season. What do results matter right now? I know this won't be the case but it's what I'd like to see. What do others reckon...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmac Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Totally agree that we need to play some younger guys but with the fact that all of these teams are sides that purely on footballing ability we should beat however with ourselves being the only ones with nothing to play (to throw them in at the deep end for a sink or swim type idea) for I'd still go with: ------------------------------------Coutts ------Saunders-----------Mclean-------------Craigan----------------Reynolds -------------------------------------Lasley ------------------Slane----------------------------Meehan ------------------------Murphy------------Clarkson ----------------------------------McHugh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky79 Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Not sure I'd be quite so whole sale with the changes. Would certainly like to see younger players that are on the first team fringe, Murphy and Saunders spring to mind certainly. Is there any point in giving Fitzpatrick and Smith a run unless they definately part of first team plans next season? If so get them in for a few games also and other youngeters that impressed for u19's/reserves I'd at least like to see get a run out off the bench if not starting. So at a push I guess the team I'd like to see start on saturday would be something like Smith Saunders Quinn McLean Hammell O'Brien Lasley Klimpl Fitzpatrick Clarkson Murphy Despite expecting Smith to be away I get feeling our young keepers aren't about to breakthrough so stick with him. I don't forsee that line up as a team for next season but given we need to have a versatile squad a few games in centre for Quinn might be useful and Saunders given a few games seems fair enough afte a couple of decent showings earlier in season. Definately think Murphy also deserves a few starts to try and make an impression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted April 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 The reasons I'd start the younger guys rather than just give them 20 minutes here and there is so we get a proper chance to see if they can cut it (20 minutes as a sub tells very little) and it gives them a chance to get a proper feel for an SPL match so if we need to call upon them next season, they've at least seen some time on the pitch. I'd play Coutts simply to see if he's good enough. Might not need another pointless loan signing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Id like to see that as well but think if we blood youngsters,it might only be 1 or 2, with another 1 or 2 getting 20-30 mins each game off the bench. A relegation scrap (I mean other teams scrapping+fighting for points) isnt really where you wanna introduce loads of kids, and it depends on wether MMG gets any further with Hughes,Klimpl + Smith contract situations. Id like to see Jon Page,Steve Saunders,Paul Slane,Jamie Murphy + Bob McHugh feature tho, at a push, maybe the three Stevens, Coutts + Meechan or Lawless Id also like to see Darren Smith + Marc Fitzpatrick play all 5 games, see if they have what it takes. My team would probably be along the lines of Smith (Coutts) Saunders McLean Craigan Hammell (Quinn) (Page) (Reynolds) D.Smith Hughes Fitzpatrick O`Brian (Slane) (Lasley) Clarkson Murphy (McHugh) Page , Slane , McHugh would all get 30 min run outs from bench and maybe 1 start each Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Made Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Sorry folks but I think we need to secure 7thplace before we start putting too many of the young lads in. Remember each placing is worth more money and no matter if the rest of the games are meaningless as regards Europe and relegation, we still have the best of the rest to play for. If we win our first 2 games after the split we can start looking at introducing more young lads but at the minute we need to stick with the best we have and that is from the squad that started on Saturday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colc Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 I'd play Coutts simply to see if he's good enough. Might not need another pointless loan signing... Does anyone know if Coutts is tied down on a long term contract?! Remember reading something in January where apparently MK Dons were checking him out (whilst he was on international duty i think) because he was out of contract this summer. Would like to see him given a chance/gain some experience before the season is out. Even if its just having him on the bench rather that the boy thats on loan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Sure Coutts has 1 year left, sounds like a good keeper, Always sounds good in the reserve + 19`s games and always a pick for the age group he at wi Scotland, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beesher Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Off topic, but how is that goalie getting on that left us for Leeds a wee while back? Think his name was Alan Martin or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted April 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Sorry folks but I think we need to secure 7thplace before we start putting too many of the young lads in. Remember each placing is worth more money and no matter if the rest of the games are meaningless as regards Europe and relegation, we still have the best of the rest to play for. If we win our first 2 games after the split we can start looking at introducing more young lads but at the minute we need to stick with the best we have and that is from the squad that started on Saturday. Being honest here, are we any more likely to pick up points playing Craigan's ageing knees, Hughes and Smith with their minds on deals elsewhere and a couple of guys with holiday brochures in their back pockets? Given the types of games that we're likely to face, it could be argued that we'd do better with young fit guys busting a gut to prove they're good enough for the first team. And if one or two of them turn out to have what it takes right now, we've saved ourselves a couple of signing on/transfer fees. Could more than make up for any loss in revenue from league placings... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
postiejim Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 one guy who should now be out of the team completely is big sillyyin, he should be on his way back to celtic . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Sorry folks but I think we need to secure 7thplace before we start putting too many of the young lads in. Agree 100% Jim. I'm not expecting to see many young lads in the team for the last 5 games and I won't decry MMcG if that turns out to be the case. Its down to him to decide if he thinks any of our young lads are up to it - he'll know better than any of us. Our promising youngsters may come good in 2/3 years time but are they ready now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC'd Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Off topic, but how is that goalie getting on that left us for Leeds a wee while back? Think his name was Alan Martin or something? They sent him out on loan for the season, to some non-league team. Barrow I am sure. Appeared in the FA Cup earlier in the season on Setanta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colc Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 He also started the most recent Scotland U21 game when they beat Albania 5-2 at Falkirk Stadium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well_Jaggy Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 I wouldn'e be keen on making a lot of changes at once. These youngsters need to be able to play with experienced pros around them to help guide them through. I would say only 2 at a time. maybe 3 at an absolute push. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweed Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 Wholly agree with that - if we bring in 6, 7, 8 youngsters we'll get papped by diddy teams between now and the end of the season and even with the caveat of performances not results that could hammer their confidence. They need to be able to play in the first team with the first team. I'd be inclined to give all those mentioned a shot but only a couple at a time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted April 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 While I take people's point regarding getting papped by diddy teams, I once again say that I can see that happening with our first team due to the fact that the teams we will be playing will be more strongly motivated than us. Playing Graham Smith, Stephen Hughes and Maros Klimpl seems to go against McGhee's declaration that the work for next season starts now given that it is unlikely that all three (maybe any) of them will be with us next season. Let's start trying to shape a team without them using our youngsters and in six weeks time we will at least now where our key weaknesses lie. Craigan is recovering from injry and I see no merit in playing him for the next few games with the risk of causing further damage. I also understand the idea of playing these guys alongside experienced players to help nurse them through games. There is the benefit though of playing with guys you are familiar with. For example, Slane will be more aware of the movements that McHugh and Murphy make up front. In the team I listed in my original post, Hammell, Quinn, Lasley and Fitzpatrick feature. I wouldn't like to guess at how many Motherwell games these guys have played in total (two have captained us on occasions). We flooded the team with youngsters post administration for a full season, and we finished bottom but it was the making of a few of those players. Here we are, in a relatively low risk situation, why not try and discover which of our reserves/under 19s has the mettle to stand up and be counted? As I have said, I understand people's concerns regarding league positions and the money this will cost us. I ask one question. Based on Saturday's performance, would you back our first team to amass more points than young guys and fringe players with a point to prove? I know I wouldn't... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweed Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 We very easily could lose to the first 11 however putting the responsibility onto a team of novices is not fair. Yes we played kids in the admin year it wasn't ideal. You argue it made some of these players - perhaps - where are they all now? Certainly didn't make all of them. You can find players to argue both sides but on balance I'd rather have three of them tops in and if they lose then the experienced pros will have to take most of the responsibility and its a win win for the younger players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted April 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 We very easily could lose to the first 11 however putting the responsibility onto a team of novices is not fair. Yes we played kids in the admin year it wasn't ideal. You argue it made some of these players - perhaps - where are they all now? Certainly didn't make all of them. You can find players to argue both sides but on balance I'd rather have three of them tops in and if they lose then the experienced pros will have to take most of the responsibility and its a win win for the younger players. Other than Dougie Ramsay and Kenny Wright, the guys from that season have all done alright for themselves (half of them are are in our first team squad). The use of the word responsibility interests me. What responsibilty? I know there are certain financial benefits and league cup seeding to concern ourselves with but other than that you are not going to get a situation with less pressure and responsibility. And I've said earlier, the chance of discovering that someone is ready to be called upon next season may well save us a wage and a signing on fee. To go off on one for a moment, the Old Firm are criticised for not blooding their young players and often there is talk of the mentality of fear in football, the culture of playing it safe, avoid defeat rather than take a chance and go for it. We find ourselves in a situation we rarely have. Safe from relegation (that Falkirk team isn't suddenly going to win five on the spin)and with very little to play for. Surely a man manager of McGhee's calibre would be able to get these young guys in a mindset where they could play with freedom and without pressure. If we don't blood them now, then when? We have nothing to gain by playing players who will not be with us next season or who are tiring towards the end of the season. Playing these young guys might actually give a bit of spark back to the fans who felt let down that we didn't make the top 6. A bit more reason to get excited for the games to come. I know I'd be looking forward to the Inverness game more if I thought I'd be seeing 4 or 5 guys who might be the future of our club. And if they flop, McGhee will (hopefully) be able to look and say whether these players simply don't have the talent or whether they just weren't ready yet. Sadly, I know I'm wasting my breath, but it's something I feel quite paasionate about... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well_Jaggy Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 I think we are all pretty much agreed that we want to see the young lads get a chance to show what they can do on the big stage. It's just the manner in which the club does it that we all have ever so very slightly differing oppinions on. End of the day, Mr McGhee is paid to make these choices and I am sure that once we have done enough to secure the 7th spot then he will blood the young lads in a couple at a time. I am not saying that is absolutley the right way, it might be, it might not, but I think thats what will happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted April 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 I think we are all pretty much agreed that we want to see the young lads get a chance to show what they can do on the big stage. It's just the manner in which the club does it that we all have ever so very slightly differing oppinions on. End of the day, Mr McGhee is paid to make these choices and I am sure that once we have done enough to secure the 7th spot then he will blood the young lads in a couple at a time. I am not saying that is absolutley the right way, it might be, it might not, but I think thats what will happen I tend to agree with you that that's what will happen. I'd stake my wages on it. I just think that in doing that we will be missing a great opportunity to see what these players can do to get some fans having second thoughts about coming to the post split games, excited and through the doors to give some of the established stars a rest/kick up the backside (delete as applicable) to start planning now for next season (ourselves and perhaps Kilmarnock are the only two clubs who can do this on the field without too great a risk) have for the next 5 games against teams fighting for their lives, eleven players with a lot to prove working hard for our team But as I have said, I know football is a fear and results driven business. Many of his advocates on here claim Mark McGhee is a breath of fresh air. A willingness to break from the norm and think long term might have even me believing it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inverhunt Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 Does anyone know if Coutts is tied down on a long term contract?! Remember reading something in January where apparently MK Dons were checking him out (whilst he was on international duty i think) because he was out of contract this summer. Would like to see him given a chance/gain some experience before the season is out. Even if its just having him on the bench rather that the boy thats on loan. Coutts is out of contract and NO contract offer on the table despite being recommended for one. Is reading between the lines that season is almost finished, contract not offered and given permission to talk to other Clubs that he is not wanted. Several others in the 19's in the same boat but unfortunately as Motherwell are leaving it to the very last minute to tell them one way or another. This will leave them at a disadvantage when trying to find other Clubs. Other players the same age at other Clubs have been told about their futures and have managed to use their remaining games to put themselves in the shop window. This is 'wells last 19's game today and they have not been told. Feel sorry for all the boys in this position. It sucks!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky79 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 Chances are one win will be enough to secure 7th place. Hopefully we get that in the bag first time out and gradually introduce some younger players and see how they get on. If it means just one guy doing a job and giving the manager something to think about it'll will have been worth it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted April 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 Chances are one win will be enough to secure 7th place. Hopefully we get that in the bag first time out and gradually introduce some younger players and see how they get on. If it means just one guy doing a job and giving the manager something to think about it'll will have been worth it. I honestly believe that our chances of getting that one win to secure seventh are not improved by playing guys like Hughes, Smith, Klimpl and McLean, guys who may not be here next season. Even those first teamers who will be here next year may have one eye on their summer holidays. It also gives us the chance to rest guys whose form is shading, Mark Reynolds being the obvious example... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well Up For It! Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I think the only positives that can be taken from our position - ie bottom 6 well clear of relegation - is to blood the youngsters although I agree that securing 7th is priority first. From what I've heard, Bob McHugh is a huge talent and would love see him make an appearance or two. Same goes for Dario Quinn, Page and Meechan. However, the three I'd most like to see are Murphy, Saunders and Slane. These three guys have been blooded already, and I think it would be a huge benefit to both them and the club to give them the last five games. McGhee hailed Slane as the most exciting porspect he'd seen since Robbie Keane at Wolves. Saunders came in an looked every bit the part. And Murphy is the great hope at the club. That said, in our last home game i'd like all the players who are leaving us (Buzz, Shug, McGarry, etc) to play so we can give them a decent send of - unless ofcourse they are goping to another SPL club!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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