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I cant believe some of the comments some of our fans make about Turnbull. He was under no obligation to sign a contract extension . He knew he'd be leaving but signed on to ensure the club that looked after him were taken care off. We therefore got good money for him. Lennon Miller is the same he knows he won't be with us for long but extended his contract which again will give the club a chance to get some payback for for that investment. I will never give guys like that a hard time. There are so many badge kissing fuckers who take the club for a ride. I wouldn't piss on Tom Boyd, Chris Cadden or Declan Gallagher if they were on Fire. Those cunts actively did all they could to either bad mouth the club or ensure we got fuck all.

I think there are certainly areas where we could be smarter. That is the case no matter which Club you look at. And, yes, there are comparisons that can be made to Brighton but only in respect of their "weight" in the Division they are in. Purely on a financial basis, the level at which they can enter the recruitment market (players and staff) is way above the level at which we can. So although they cannot compete with the Chelsea's and Man City's of this world, they are still operating in a different world to us. And the level they operate at makes the possibility of recruitment success more likely and the impact of failure less ruinous. In short, in the market we operate in, the chance of failure is much more likely and the financial impact of any failure is greatly magnified. We are scraping the bottom of the barrel when we take a punt on Bair. Brighton are scraping the bottom of their barrel when they take a £5m punt on some unknown South American youngster. Regarding youngsters being allowed to leave, if giants such as Chelsea, Man City, Rangers, Celtic cannot retain star prospects due to riches/attractions on offer elsewhere, then it is a bit naive to expect Motherwell to be the exception. There comes a time when it would be madness for a youngster to sit tight. These players might be Motherwell fans, but first and foremost they are professionals with a career to manage. And would any of us refuse a tenfold wage increase (minimum)? I actually think we do pretty well regards income from youth development. I would prefer the kids to stay but that is just not realistic The Board were also very open. As a fan owned Club we must complete at least one decent player sale a season to compete at our current level. With top ups from youth sales as required. If either does not happen, then Budgets will be cut and as a result squad quality will reduce. Every one of the Managers who has left in recent years hit that exact barrier, with the most scary thing being that each time the timescale reduced. Not saying those Managers did not have faults, but the quality reduction did for them. Everything comes down to finance at the end of the day. Unlike Brighton, we cannot afford to make mistakes.

There is always room for improvement, and as I said, we could be looking to make those improvements rather than doing the exact same thing we always do, which is throwing money away every January trying to rectify ridiculous mistakes made the previous summer. Saying that it's easier with hundreds of millions of pounds to throw at it is a cop-out in my opinion. Sure, we won't be attracting the real top-level youth talent that those clubs you mention can, but we could look at the way they go about their business and adapt it to fit within our financial capabilities. Some of it will not be doable, but a lot of it will be, or at least a version of it. A club our size has to box clever, otherwise we will come undone at some point. We cannot continue the process of throwing shite against the wall every summer and hoping some of it sticks. That's not sustainable. One area that is a real leveller when used correctly is data analytics. We could be doing way better in that department, with the following being areas I personally think we could improve. Integrate Analytics into Decision-Making: Embed data-driven decision-making into the club's culture. This means utilizing analytics not only in player recruitment but also in tactical analysis, injury prevention, and performance optimization. Invest in Analytics Tools: Even with limited resources, invest in basic analytics tools that can provide valuable insights. This may include software for performance analysis, player tracking, and statistical modelling. Collaborate with Experts: Consider partnerships with external data analytics experts or firms. This can be a cost-effective way to access advanced analytics capabilities without the need for an in-house team. Focus on Market Inefficiencies: Smaller clubs can benefit from identifying market inefficiencies that larger clubs might overlook. This could involve targeting players from specific regions, leagues, or age groups where value can be found at a lower cost. Monitor Player Progression: Use analytics to track the development of players within the club. This involves not only assessing first-team players but also monitoring the progress of youth academy prospects. Feedback Loop: Establish a feedback loop that involves continuous evaluation and refinement of the analytics process. Learn from both successful and unsuccessful player acquisitions to improve the effectiveness of future recruitment efforts. Adapt to Changing Trends: Stay abreast of advancements in sports analytics and be flexible in adapting strategies to changing trends. This adaptability is crucial in maximizing the benefits of data analytics in a dynamic football landscape. I know that some of the above may already be in place, but quite honestly, I've seen very little evidence of this being the case. We could be way better in this area. And we don't need to spend a fortune to get there. I'm not an expert on Brighton, and I never said they were perfect in all aspects. I'm sure they're doing what every team down there is doing, which is spending a lot of money on players. They have to in order to compete with the best teams in the world, but they are also well-known for their ability to identify talent on the upswing before the bigger clubs recognise them. We could certainly look to do that, albeit at a lower level. From my research, there wasn't an astronomical amount spent on their youth development or analytics in relation to the league they're in and their competition. There's a ceiling in what those who are experts in that area are paid. It's not as if a Head of Analytics at Brighton is on £5 million a year or anything. The only nonsense is your claiming that any attempt to be "forward thinking and ambitious" costs serious cash and would have us bankrupt and out of business. That's absolute nonsense. You refuse to see that there's a middle ground between constantly chasing our tail and trying to rectify poorly thought-out signings and managerial appointments and spending our way to oblivion like John Boyle did. Absolutely no one I've seen on this forum is advocating for us to spend silly money on players past their best like we did during that era. What we're talking about is looking to change things up and focus on avenues that won't cost a fortune, and that should help us put not just a better team on the park but also set us on a road to being a more consistent, healthy club. Make no mistake, the points I mention above can be implemented at a club like Motherwell, and we wouldn't need to break the bank to do so. In reality, we're likely spending the money in other, less effective ways already.

Completely agree - we saw players like Lambert making a huge success by going abroad. Turnbull would excel and I hope he goes on to much bigger and better things. Class act both on and off the pitch.

Rice, McAlear and McKinstrey were youth players who brought in a total in excess of £1m between them in agreed fees and add ons in lieu of Development Fees. So to say they left us for nothing is just not correct. Campbell and Cadden were established first team players who gave Motherwell a good number of years, served us well and then left under freedom of contract. In the same way that we recruited out of contract players from other teams. Some of whom went on to earn us a pretty penny. Some you win, some you lose. Nowhere did I say that you ever suggested we had similar funds to spend as Brighton. What is weird is that you continue to ignore the fact that the level of each clubs finances means the probability of success in the transfer market for Brighton is greater than it is at Motherwell. Also Brighton can afford to get it wrong. You get what you can afford to pay for and sadly what we can afford is Bair, Shaw etc. So the risk of failure is increased. Brighton at least can buy players with a decent track record. How we have arrived at that financial situation is a whole different conversation. Our risk of failure in the transfer market will always be far greater than any club that can afford to pay millions. I agree that means we need to be smarter in our selections but yet again that lack of finances affects the quality of resource we can allocate to analytical research. So comparing us to Brighton ( or any established EPL Club) is nonsense. Much of what you suggest makes sense in a perfect world. But please tell me how Motherwell would fund the changes and expansion which might certainly be of benefit long term.

I think you are being a bit unfair with your snide comment regarding Allan Campbell. Allan played 135 times and I am sure he never gave less than 100% in every match and I don't know of any well fan who didn't appreciate his time spent at the club and didn't wish him well in his future career. A cracking player.

The only way Turnbull will get back into the Scotland squad is if he moves elsewhere, and I hope he does. Great player.

This, some reality to the debate at last a great post.

When he was ready to move from Fir Park I said at the time that somewhere on the continent would be ideal for Turnbull. His style is tailor-made for leagues where they prefer passing and possession. Even if he ends up leaving on a free and we get nothing, I still hope he gets a move to a team that appreciates his talents. Maybe the recent success of other Scottish players abroad will encourage him to take the chance.

Then maybe the answer is to continue as we have been over the past few years? I imagine there'll be a glut of panic buys this January as usual, and we might even be watching a team managed by Stevie Frail if results don't go our way over the next month or so. Then we get to the summer and rinse and repeat.

I can’t help be cynical that celtic are trying to drum up business and extra cash to sell Turnbull as he’s refused a new contract but I certainly think he is capable of playing in Italy at a good level. I think his style of football is appreciated there. He’s completely unappreciated at Celtic, they prefer the hatate type who charges around clueless at 100mph if he does go for good money and we get 10% that laddie has generated our club a fortune. Some of our support don’t really appreciate the extension contract he signed with us as well when he didn’t have to (take note Allan Campbell ) good luck to him, will look forward to supporting him wherever he ends up.

Are you using reverse psychology on yourself?