Neil Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Good post Ya Bezzer, at the end of the day, Motherwell, like every other SPL side (outwith the Edinburgh 2 and Old Firm) are never going to dramatically strengthen their squad and pay fees, it's always going to have to be loans and freebies, and at this time of year there aren't many clubs willing to give loans and freebies. January is a sellers market and we are not in any position to offer big money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orinoco Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 clock is ticking down yet again to another window, where the squad is in danger of being weakened further. Yes, it costs money to run a football club, but to continually cut and keep cutting the playing staff budget will eventually catch up with us. Even allowing for extensions to contracts to current players & staff, given the amount of wages free'd up by releasing players or selling them, then surely the wage budget aint that much different from previous seasons. Time will tell i supose, when the accounts come out, but it's certainly going to be interesting to see what has happened to the increased revenue from the increase in season ticket sales, higher prize money, european football etc etc. This season promised so much, but in typical Motherwell fashion, our club's ambition and progress has went backwards. Mr Boyle is ment to be a very good business man, with very intelligent people around them, yet from a position of scratch, i.e position to start again, where are the ideas or initiatives to progress our club forward? That german guy we were talking about the other day, had proper ideas, i.e. build a youth academy and build up slowly. What we got and continually get is overpaid diddies, and a crumbling stadium. If their is really no money within the club, stop this pursuit to bring in loan signings and give our youth players a proper chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfcmainstand Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,12876_4874291,00.html worth looking at? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaag Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 possibly... but if there's league one teams involved, then I'd say not much chance of matching wages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juan Kerse Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Just me? Or was McGhee not quoted as saying he wanted to bring in 3/4 players this window to bulk up the squad? I'll give him Klimpl. technically a 'new' signing. The keeper doesn't count as the other loanee went out the door as he opened it. Now it looks as if we are onto plums unless Porter goes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Or now we are unbeaten in 2009 and playing half decent, Melvin Bragg needs to find something else wrong with McGhee to moan about. I know, he's even dropped McGarry. How am I supposed to get a good moan going? Seriously, though, as others have pointed out we have a thin squad. Thinner than most in the SPL (look at what an understrength Kilmarnock did at Fir Park - could we win away missing key players?) and it has to be addressed. What happened to the list of 50 players?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 If Porter goes and we get decent money for him, we're now being told none of that will be re-invested in the squad. I think that's a bit of a joke. The money from Faddys sell on clause, the money from McDonald, the compensation money from McCormack, the money from Paterson, the 3rd place finish, the Euro ties, the continual giving of the Cooper stand to the Old Firm. I don't understand Milo. We've a financial gap to plug this season. I'd guess, as many have said before, that all Faddy's sell on money has gone to creditors. MacDonald's money? Much of that will have gone to the Treasury in VAT and perhaps some to the player himself. MacCormack's compensation of £50k will have been swallowed up in ground improvements no bother. Jim Paterson's cash - a fair chunk of that will have gone on VAT and funding Steve Hammell's transfer. I'd guess we didn't even break even on Europe. Thats the reality of running a provincial SPL club I'm afraid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Stall Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 I'd guess we didn't even break even on Europe. Right, I've had a few pints after work, granted however I just can't see logic with this. How can you not break even in europe?? Expenses - flying the first team out to France - 8000 thunder stix Income - Europe money - tv money, 2 live games including money from French tv stations - full house at fir park - hospitality, both home for the big game and the £500 punters who flew on the claret and amber flights - european tour merchandising, (all the t-shirts, flags, scarves, photos of fir park etc etc) Maybe i've missed a few things, and hands up im not well versed in the financial implications of european participation, but I really can't see how we lost money on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motherwell Fan Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Mark Archdeacon has moved to Albion Rovers on loan. Official site Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 'Flow Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Expenses - flying the first team out to France- 8000 thunder stix If only that were the only expenses incurred when getting to Europe... The club had to spend a significant amount of money upgrading certain areas of the stadium to be compliant with UEFA standards. This included things like increasing the lux levels of the floodlights, installing a new female changing room, installing a new drug testing room, UEFA branded fixtures and fittings amongst many other things around the ground. That is just some of the things... Not saying for a second that the club ran at a loss on Europe but expenditure ran much greater than just flying the team and thunder stix... 'Flow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Maybe i've missed a few things, and hands up im not well versed in the financial implications of european participation, but I really can't see how we lost money on that. No one can say for sure of course Stall, but remember that the game at Fir Park was cut price. Say 10,500 punters at £11 = £115,000. Off that deduct say £40,000 for expenses and say £18,000 for VAT. The players and management of course would all be paid handsome bonuses. As far as the club shop is concerned, remember that a fair proportion of the income would be due to Provan Sports. Expenses for travelling to France would not be cheap. If we did make a profit on our travels it wouldn't be much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well Up For It! Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Right, I've had a few pints after work, granted however I just can't see logic with this. How can you not break even in europe?? Expenses - flying the first team out to France - 8000 thunder stix Income - Europe money - tv money, 2 live games including money from French tv stations - full house at fir park - hospitality, both home for the big game and the £500 punters who flew on the claret and amber flights - european tour merchandising, (all the t-shirts, flags, scarves, photos of fir park etc etc) Maybe i've missed a few things, and hands up im not well versed in the financial implications of european participation, but I really can't see how we lost money on that. Did the clun not charter three flights for Nancy? One for the players and the two £500 a pop corporate flights? If that's the case, and due to the short booking time - 2weeks before after the draw was made - that would have cost a considerable amount - prob approaching the £200,000 mark at least! And all the £500 together fees wouldn't have covered that cost - so there is your first loss. The full house at Fir Park was irrelevant as the cheaper admission prices plus the wages of staff (more than normal) meant that it wouldn't have been much profit if any. The stadium upgrades would have cost in the region of £20,000 at least. The club shop is leased, so the merchandise cut wouldn't be as big as you'd imagine. As for \TV money - that's the bit that confusses me. Surely it would have been at least £100k - £200k for both legs? It's all a bit suspect, but all this coupled with the increased expenditure in wages, etc would have taken an estimate from European money into account. End result - not much, if anything, was made from Europe. And that money was spent in advance of the draw being made on wages, etc - hence coffers being tight now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteelman Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 If only that were the only expenses incurred when getting to Europe... The club had to spend a significant amount of money upgrading certain areas of the stadium to be compliant with UEFA standards. This included things like increasing the lux levels of the floodlights, installing a new female changing room, installing a new drug testing room, UEFA branded fixtures and fittings amongst many other things around the ground. That is just some of the things... Not saying for a second that the club ran at a loss on Europe but expenditure ran much greater than just flying the team and thunder stix... 'Flow I'm sure the "Skippy" money would have covered that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeyin Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 I'm sure the "Skippy" money would have covered that. That barely covers Boab's pie allowance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelvinBragg Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 Dave, did you just get a massive bill for VAT cos you seem obsessed by it at the moment?? Your point is a valid one in that these transactions will be subject to tax. What I think tends to rankle with some Motherwell fans is the fact that all clubs are subject to taxation, yet almost every other club in the SPL has managed to strengthen during this window. Now either our revenue streams are not what they should be in comparison to those of other clubs our size or our scouting network is not what it should be. Either way, I think fans are entitled to ask questions at this time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bop Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 I'm confident. A Winger/Midfielder, Striker or a defender and i'm happy aslong as they are of good calibre. There is absolutely 0 chance that we wont sign someone immediatly in this window. I dont believe for a minute that McGhee hasnt got his iron in fires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmcalpin Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 Dave, did you just get a massive bill for VAT cos you seem obsessed by it at the moment?? Your point is a valid one in that these transactions will be subject to tax. What I think tends to rankle with some Motherwell fans is the fact that all clubs are subject to taxation, yet almost every other club in the SPL has managed to strengthen during this window. Now either our revenue streams are not what they should be in comparison to those of other clubs our size or our scouting network is not what it should be. Two separate issues here Greg. VAT - No, its just that very few fans appreciate that much of the club's transactions are subject to VAT from the tickets we buy to transfer fees and no-one appear to take this into account. From time to time we've seen various calculations on these boards eg "A 5,000 gate @ £15 a time = £75,000, where did all this money go?" Its not appreciated that of that hypothetical total perhaps £11,000 doesn't go the club at all. I think though that possibly the biggest source of misinformation amongst fans is transfer cash. Understandably these deals are cloaked in secrecy but how many times on these boards has someone asked - "Where did Faddy's sell on money go, why wasn't it spent on a new player?" Your second point, I agree with 100%. Our revenue streams are not what they should be. If the club wants to move forward then it needs to boost income. No argument from me there. You only need to look at clubs such as Falkirk, Inverness and Hamilton and the efforts they have made to strengthen this month although in some cases the term "strengthen" is questionable. It annoys me a bit when I hear peolple like Bill Reid or John Hughes spout forth in December saying that there's no cash for new players - aye right. Finally, and straying a bit off track I know, it worries me to read some threads about our new stadium, whenever that might come to fruition. So much effort, imagination and skill is devoted to new stadia designs (nothing wrong in that by itself) but how are we going to pay for it? I'd guess there will be a massive funding deficit between what we receive for Fir Park, a brownfield site, and what we will need to erect a new stadium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Grew Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 I think in relation ot Billy Reid and John Hughes, because of the precarious situations their respective clubs are/were in, gambles were being taken on the bringing in of new players. They have to weigh-up the cost of this against the cost of dropping out of the SPL so maybe feel it is worth it. Given their respective results today, it may be paying off for them. As for our own situation in terms of finance, I think that fans maybe expect too much. Where is extra income to come from? In the current financial climate and perhaps for a long time to come, it will be increasingly harder for us to run with an overdraft at the bank, attract sponsorship and attract corporate sponsorship. We seem only to be able attract around 4,500 to home games at FP and really unless this were to increase its impossible to see where we could 'generate extra income' from. Next season may be worse, as fans, due to their own personal circumstances, might not be able to afford a season ticket or to attend all games. This will only worsen matters. Personally, I think managers will need to able to do what their predecessors used to do - trawl around the lower leagues and try to unearth players that maybe capable of making the step up. Low risk strategy with possibility of high rewards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazilian Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 Personally, I think managers will need to able to do what their predecessors used to do - trawl around the lower leagues and try to unearth players that maybe capable of making the step up. Low risk strategy with possibility of high rewards. Managers also need to think longer term especially ours or is it the guardian who needs to have a re-think? Who exactly do we have out of contract at the end of the season from our very small squad? Buzz Quinn Hughes Malcolm Klimpl Lasley?? Porter (now gone) not quite sure of all the above and would guess a number of others will be up as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellfan1984 Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 McGhee just gave Lasley a new contract last season Buzz Hughes Malcolm Are those who remain who's contract runs out in the summer I believe. Klimpl isn't our player, and it will be up to the parties if he does sign on or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazilian Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 I'll remove Las from the list as I'm not sure but Klimpl imho stays on the list a first team player who will not be here next season unless a new contract is sorted to replace the loan deal. as for Quinn has he had an extension? from the player database: Again summer speculation had the defender moving away from Motherwell but within days of the departure of Maurice Malpas, Coach had signed on in the summer of 2007 for another two years with the Steelmen. It would seem to have been a significant decision to stay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellfan1984 Posted January 31, 2009 Report Share Posted January 31, 2009 Hmmm... I though Quinn signed on for three. My bad. I would sign him asap too unless his agent has been feeding him bull Shocked we have not signed Hughes up since no one else seems to be sniffing at this time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickoza Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 From the Scotsman..... Motherwell manager Mark McGhee lamented the loss of in-form striker Chris Porter to Derby. "I wished he was out there," admitted McGhee. "We missed his ability. I'm quite sure he could have done enough to tilt it in our favour." It's how you react to a setback and McGhee will now put his contingency plan into action. "I expect we'll be there at five o'clock making sure the faxes have gone. I think it'll go to the wire." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motherwell Fan Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 News of the World Well home in on Teale deal WINGER LINED UP IN SHOCK LOAN MOVE By Kenny MacDonald, 31/01/2009 MOTHERWELL are set to land Derby winger Gary Teale in a shock loan move. Sport of the World can reveal that Well boss Mark McGhee negotiated the move for former Ayr star Teale as part of the £400,000 deal which took Chris Porter to Derby. The wing king will beat tomorrow’s transfer deadline to join up at Fir Park until the end of the season. Teale, right, joined Derby from Wigan for £600,000 in January 2007, but he’s had loan spells at Plymouth and Barnsley since moving to Pride Park and looks to have drifted out of new boss Nigel Clough’s plans. Teale, 30, has won 11 Scotland caps and gaffer McGhee hopes he can boost his side’s European bid. Meanwhile, Well have netted the same amount of money for Porter even though Derby’s fee was £25,000 less than Cardiff offered. Well made the same profit because Porter waived money still due to him from Fir Park to ensure the switch south went ahead. Porter won’t make his Rams debut in the FA Cup replay at Nottingham Forest because he is ineligible. He could make his bow in Saturday’s Championship match at Plymouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanMFC Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 Cue more "he's pish!" comments. Not the greatest player by any stretch, but hardly pish. My only concern is that he's hardly a replacement for Porter, and that's what we should really be looking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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