Alexander.

[Yabba's Turd]

1 hour ago, Welldaft Mk1 said:

Not sure I understand this comment.  Unless everyone is lying most Managers and players I recall have said this is a very stable club with a supportive Board. 

Finances tend to dictate overall and we simply don’t have the budget to get the better or best Managers or players. 

The reality is that as a result most of the players we bring to the club will not be a Moult, Kipre, Marv Johnson. Probably one in 7-10 players will have that impact or probably even lower odds. 
 

We have one of the worst supports in football, no patience and one of the most toxic.

[Welldaft Mk1]

44 minutes ago, Yabba's Turd said:

We have one of the worst supports in football, no patience and one of the most toxic.

That we are agreed on. 
I was in Sligo and the abuse at the Manager and players was OTT.

The high (low) point came when a fan launched a foul mouth verbal tirade at Liam Kelly for a full on two minutes during the 2nd half. Kelly was clearly at a loss how to react other than to roll his eyes and hold his arms up.  Their reaction if told to shut up is usually to threaten physical abuse or as some sadly witnessed actual physical abuse !! 

[grizzlyg]

48 minutes ago, Yabba's Turd said:

We have one of the worst supports in football, no patience and one of the most toxic.

We do have an element whose behaviour is embarrassing and can be toxic but you have an element like that at every club.

We need an appointment that can really get the fans on board. I don't think someone like say Tommy Wright is going to get the fans excited and thankfully the Robbo one looked like a non story.

 

[grizzlyg]

2 minutes ago, Welldaft Mk1 said:

That we are agreed on. 
I was in Sligo and the abuse at the Manager and players was OTT.

The high (low) point came when a fan launched a foul mouth verbal tirade at Liam Kelly for a full on two minutes during the 2nd half. Kelly was clearly at a loss how to react other than to roll his eyes and hold his arms up.  Their reaction if told to shut up is usually to threaten physical abuse or as some sadly witnessed actual physical abuse !! 

That just beggars belief...like I said....we have an element whose behaviour is an embarrassment 

[Yabba's Turd]

1 minute ago, grizzlyg said:

We do have an element whose behaviour is embarrassing and can be toxic but you have an element like that at every club.

We need an appointment that can really get the fans on board. I don't think someone like say Tommy Wright is going to get the fans excited and thankfully the Robbo one looked like a non story.

 

I would say, when fans of other clubs comment on the state of our home fans berating the team you have a bigger problem than an element like that.

[grizzlyg]

6 minutes ago, Yabba's Turd said:

I would say, when fans of other clubs comment on the state of our home fans berating the team you have a bigger problem than an element like that.

Will take your word for it pal, I don't read comments from other fans. But can't disagree that there is an element where behaviour is shocking 

[Stuwell2]

We appear to have a proven working academy which produces a couple of players a year. There is a clear pathway to the first team but unfortunately, as we all know, the cream of the crop leaves before we even see them and all we can hope for is that they generate future income but at the moment it seems like it’s the Well society that’s paying for the academy. 
The other youngsters who make it through to the first team are the hard working young players who will become professional players at or around our level, decent players who sometimes make mistakes but on the whole put in a shift and hopefully don’t get to much abuse. There very unlikely to be stars who go on to greater things but if we’re lucky they might just exceed everyone’s expectations. 
As said these guys need more experienced guys around them and this is where the club has to target it’s small resources alongside taking a punt on one or two guys who can generate a return. 
Bottom line is that free flowing exciting football plays second fiddle to the reality of trying to stay in the premiership. 

[fizoxy]

Ideally everyone promoted from the academy can go on to have a decent professional career, whether it's for us or elsewhere.

There will be some that get plucked before getting a game for us, and others that will excel and go for a few quid after a good season, maybe two. But we could really do with bringing through a few that are decent at our level and can rack up 100+ games. I'd rather have players we've brought through filling those roles than an endless cycle of English lower league jobbers.

[Winning by Name]

8 hours ago, grizzlyg said:

We do have an element whose behaviour is embarrassing and can be toxic but you have an element like that at every club.

 

 

Yes, but we are talking about OUR club!

[pretzel]

2 hours ago, Winning by Name said:

Yes, but we are talking about OUR club!

TBF though the guy's comment was targeting a posters comment on how "we have one of the worst supports in football", which is an absolutely wild opinion IMO, yes we have arseholes in our support but considering the regular behaviour of the Old Firm and some of the behaviour of Aberdeen, Hibs and St Mirren fans on their respective visits to Fir Park last season we are no where near being the worst in our own country.

 

[Onthefringes]

11 hours ago, Welldaft Mk1 said:

That we are agreed on. 
I was in Sligo and the abuse at the Manager and players was OTT.

The high (low) point came when a fan launched a foul mouth verbal tirade at Liam Kelly for a full on two minutes during the 2nd half. Kelly was clearly at a loss how to react other than to roll his eyes and hold his arms up.  Their reaction if told to shut up is usually to threaten physical abuse or as some sadly witnessed actual physical abuse !! 

This was a separate issue and nothing in the context of this debate. Appreciate its not a good look & regrettable for both parties but, matter has been concluded amicably.

[Yabba's Turd]

11 hours ago, pretzel said:

TBF though the guy's comment was targeting a posters comment on how "we have one of the worst supports in football", which is an absolutely wild opinion IMO, yes we have arseholes in our support but considering the regular behaviour of the Old Firm and some of the behaviour of Aberdeen, Hibs and St Mirren fans on their respective visits to Fir Park last season we are no where near being the worst in our own country.

 

One of the worst for berating mistakes and players instantly, it goes from 0-10 very quickly, no one is questioning whether we have arseholes in our support, we have a reputation for getting on the team's back quickly

 

[Spit_It_Out]

It does blow my mind how a manager saves you from relegation gets you a top six finish but has to put up with regular abuse to a manager Ie Robinson left us in said relegation mess,football was just as bad if not worse gets a standing ovation when he returns with St Mirren Something not right with that.Seem to have a fan base with a very selective mind.

Worst fans I don't think so,some toxic entitled fans it's the kinda folk who have the I paid my money mentality so I can act as I want mindset all clubs have them.

[Great Balls of Shire]

49 minutes ago, Spit_It_Out said:

It does blow my mind how a manager saves you from relegation gets you a top six finish but has to put up with regular abuse to a manager Ie Robinson left us in said relegation mess,football was just as bad if not worse gets a standing ovation when he returns with St Mirren Something not right with that.Seem to have a fan base with a very selective mind.

Worst fans I don't think so,some toxic entitled fans it's the kinda folk who have the I paid my money mentality so I can act as I want mindset all clubs have them.

did robbo not get us out of relegation bother after Mcghee and 2 cup finals and a 3rd place finish? so i suppose , in the main, he will be remembered fondly...

[Spiderpig]

10 hours ago, Spit_It_Out said:

It does blow my mind how a manager saves you from relegation gets you a top six finish but has to put up with regular abuse to a manager Ie Robinson left us in said relegation mess,football was just as bad if not worse gets a standing ovation when he returns with St Mirren

Alexander started well,  saved us from going down, last season got us of to a great start in the league, sitting 3rd by Christmas , then it all went wrong, fallouts with senior players , top goal scorer moving to a rival team mid season and our results were shocking, we will never know what started it but for me the dressing room was gone then.

Due to other teams being a shite as us we managed to scrape into the top 6 with the last kick of the ball at livingston and eventually claimed a Euro spot.  However that only covered up the problems Alexander came across as arrogant and unwilling to change his ways to get results, not playing senior pros ie SOD and generally looking like he did not giving a feck he was out of ideas.

In some ways the Sligo defeats as embarrassing as they were done the club a massive favour by finally getting rid of him, because if he had stayed we would be getting more of the same from him this season.  So will he be remembered fondly if he ever turns up at Fir park with another team no chance, for me he will be remembered as the manager who ruined a potentially good season by his arrogance and inability to manage a team and got us pumped by an Irish league team.

 

[steelboy]

Alexander had the chance to sort things out this summer and blew it. He chose to pick fights with Woolery and O'Donnell that weakened the squad and didn't have the players match fit for a game with a lot of prize money at stake. 

We don't know what his discussions and targets were with Burrows and the board for the beginning of this season but if they weren't telling him we need better results than he's produced since January and we need to show up in Europe then something is very wrong. 

[wellsince75]

I wish him well for the future and glad he's moved on. 

No argument from me with what he achieved. The issue was always how, it was  ugly but people tended not to mind winning ugly. 

He'll go on to another role, prob in the 4th tier of English footy. 

[MJC]

1 hour ago, steelboy said:

Alexander had the chance to sort things out this summer and blew it. He chose to pick fights with Woolery and O'Donnell that weakened the squad and didn't have the players match fit for a game with a lot of prize money at stake. 

We don't know what his discussions and targets were with Burrows and the board for the beginning of this season but if they weren't telling him we need better results than he's produced since January and we need to show up in Europe then something is very wrong. 

This.

In a way us scraping into the top six and ‘Europe’ did us more harm than good because I believe had we not scored that last minute leveller at Livingston in April and finished bottom six then Alexander would have been gone at the end of the season. That way we could have got a new manager in in time for pre-season or the League Cup group stages and made the right moves in the transfer market. As it was we were never going to part company with a manager who got us into the top six and qualified for Europe and therefore the board and Alexander were able to bury their heads in the sand and pretend that the results and the shite we served up on the park since January was remotely acceptable.

[David]

1 hour ago, Spiderpig said:

Alexander started well,  saved us from going down, last season got us of to a great start in the league, sitting 3rd by Christmas , then it all went wrong, fallouts with senior players , top goal scorer moving to a rival team mid season and our results were shocking, we will never know what started it but for me the dressing room was gone then.

 

1 hour ago, steelboy said:

He chose to pick fights with Woolery and O'Donnell that weakened the squad and didn't have the players match fit for a game with a lot of prize money at stake. 

Have to love how these rumours just suddenly become fact.

It seems we've forgotten the calls for O'Donnell to be dropped for being rank rotten, and are overlooking the idea that Woolery is now playing in Turkey most likely making far more coin than we could ever hope to pay him.

[numpty]

Ultimately he'll go down as one of a few managers in recent times who came in to do a job when we were struggling, did that job pretty well, but then didn't really know what to do next. Here's hoping our next one will leave because of his successes, rather than running out of ideas.

[Yorkyred]

25 minutes ago, numpty said:

Ultimately he'll go down as one of a few managers in recent times who came in to do a job when we were struggling, did that job, but then didn't really know what to do next. Here's hoping our next one will leave because of his successes, rather than running out of ideas.

I don’t think Robinson was any different, he more or said so. He was tired of having to constantly build new squads after losing our best players. It’s certainly my belief that Motherwell is now a very tough gig. Limited budget and a percentage of the fanbase who have the mentality that whatever you do it’s never enough. Both Robinson and Alexander took tons of abuse even when reaching cup finals and finishing top six in the league. Where does any manager go from that point, with our budget it’s only going to be backwards. I think the targets set by the board are very different from the targets set by a minority of the fanbase. For Kelly to get the abuse he did at the Sligo game and online was absolutely shocking.

[David]

Just now, numpty said:

Ultimately he'll go down as one of a few managers in recent times who came in to do a job when we were struggling, did that job, but then didn't really know what to do next. Here's hoping our next one will leave because of his successes, rather than running out of ideas.

The thing is, there's context to be had during his run, like most things in life.

Did he run out of ideas? I'm not so sure he did. He was embarking on a new season where he was looking to bring in fewer players and run with a tighter squad.

He came in and steered us out of trouble, that much is true. But he also had to deal with managing the club during a time of short-notice suspensions and even call-offs due to Covid, which had a pretty substantial effect on recruitment not just for us, but other clubs in the league.

Let's be honest, there's a reason why most clubs in the league last season were terrible. Over the season we brought in 16 players. I think most of the league clubs brought in extra bodies to try and help deal with any potential Covid suspensions, but the kicker is that they had to do it without an increase in budget. 

Basically, we all needed more players on less wages to make up the numbers, which is why I think our squad (and the squads of those around us) were bloated and the quality simply wasn't great. 

That doesn't even begin to address the issues with training and masks and social distancing and all that jazz. 

Those aren't excuses, that's just how it was. It was a really tough time to come into a football club and try to successful manage a squad of players. 

On his record, we finished last season in 5th with a record of 12 wins, 10 draws, and 16 losses. The year before St Johnstone finished 5th with a record of 11 wins, 12 draws, and 15 losses. And in 208/19, Hibs finished 5th with a record of 14 wins, 12 draws, and 12 losses. So, it's hardly as if our record last season is all that terrible. Where Alexander faced issues was in having what was a very good start to the season, followed by a terrible finish. He even snagged a few Manager of the Month awards, didn't he?

Flip those around and he'd be considered a managerial mastermind for changing things up. The result at the end of the season would have been the same though. 

On signings, personally, I think McGinn and Spittal will come good for us. I actually prefer the idea of signing less players, but players who have a decent pedigree in our game, than signing 8-10 new players from down south who are all huge gambles.

Spittal made 37 appearances for County last season, while Mcginn played 34 times for Hibs. We know what we're getting from those two. Neither will be amazing, but they could both be good, solid first team players for Motherwell for a good few years. 

Morris I don't know much about, but last season aside he seems to have a solid reputation in League One down south, playing over 30 games each season in four out of the five he was at Fleetwood and Scunthorpe.

In conclusion, I think Alexander will be fine. He'll get another job down south no problem, mostly because the comments from Gary Neville about how they made a huge mistake in sacking him at Salford, plus his record there, and at Scunthorpe and Fleetwood will hold more authority than him being binned by us in what most down south consider to be an inferior league. I expect he'll pop up in League One or Two before the season is out.

[Kmcalpin]

2 hours ago, steelboy said:

Alexander had the chance to sort things out this summer and blew it.

Thats it for me. Last season was what it was. He achieved the results, albeit with a very poor second half to the season. The football on offer wasn't very attractive but I could live with it. I always had the impression that he wasn' getting the best from the palyers he had at his disposal for whatever reason.  The Sligo games changed it for me. I was looking for some indication, however modest, that he was changing things, but that just didn't happen.  The rest is history. 

[Jeroen]

What do you guys think? Will sondre keep playing this season? He did great last game.. 

[Spiderpig]

1 hour ago, David said:

 

Have to love how these rumours just suddenly become fact.

It seems we've forgotten the calls for O'Donnell to be dropped for being rank rotten, and are overlooking the idea that Woolery is now playing in Turkey most likely making far more coin than we could ever hope to pay him.

How else can you explain it then Watt suddenly wanting a move, SOD getting picked for Scotland and not playing with us, Slattery allegedly injured and not playing for weeks, and then Woolery suddenly fancying a Turkish delight.

He lost the dressing room and as I have said his own arrogance and lack of a plan B gave us 3 wins in 14 games thank feck for Lamie we made top 6.

Yes this might all be conspiracy theory shite but as we will never know the truth it will do for now