League Cup Semi Motherwell v St Mirren 1/11/2025

[Spiderpig]

14 hours ago, gaz7 said:

I always think it's an easy cop out saying hampden is a shit hole. Park head and ibrox are no better facility wise and are only better in their seating behind the goals. Murrayfield behind goals is as far away as hampden imo so saying it's not worthy of a final is harsh.

Yes I'd love a Wembley or millennium but the constant knocking of our national stadium is as I said harsh.

Where would you say is worthy of a final in Scotland 

If the money had been spent on Hampden for a proper upgrade, ie bringing  the west and east terraces closer to the pitch to improve the view then yes it would be worthy.

But as the SFA have been a shambles for years, too busy making sure their own interests and expense paid jaunts all over the world are sorted first nothing ever gets done.

So year after year thousands of fans are paying for a ticket at the front of the east or West stands to get a severely restricted view if at all of the game.

[Kmcalpin]

It all boils down to the fact that the original refurbishment of Hampden in the 1990s was a cheap and nasty sticking plaster job.  That said, finances were tight at the time (aren't they always?) but not nearly enough effort was put into fund raising. Ye reap what ye sow. 

[joewarkfanclub]

8 hours ago, Spiderpig said:

If the money had been spent on Hampden for a proper upgrade, ie bringing  the west and east terraces closer to the pitch to improve the view then yes it would be worthy.

But as the SFA have been a shambles for years, too busy making sure their own interests and expense paid jaunts all over the world are sorted first nothing ever gets done.

So year after year thousands of fans are paying for a ticket at the front of the east or West stands to get a severely restricted view if at all of the game.

There WAS supposedly a deal in place to properly upgrade Hampden years ago, but the bulldozers were pulled away from the door by Thatcher in 1979 after an underhand deal was allegedly done to try and promote Ibrox as the new venue for internationals and Cup Finals.

Just one of the many reasons she was booed roundly when she presented that years Scottish Cup.

The SFA get a hard time over this but they have done what was possible with the money that they had.

The FA didnt rebuild Wembley with their own money. Private enterprise did most of the work with significant input from the government and National Lottery.

Same deal with the Millenium.

If there is any blame to be apportioned at the SFA it would be in not being politically astute enough to play the game.

[Kmcalpin]

2 hours ago, joewarkfanclub said:

There WAS supposedly a deal in place to properly upgrade Hampden years ago, but the bulldozers were pulled away from the door by Thatcher in 1979 after an underhand deal was allegedly done to try and promote Ibrox as the new venue for internationals and Cup Finals.

Just one of the many reasons she was booed roundly when she presented that years Scottish Cup.

The SFA get a hard time over this but they have done what was possible with the money that they had.

The FA didnt rebuild Wembley with their own money. Private enterprise did most of the work with significant input from the government and National Lottery.

Same deal with the Millenium.

If there is any blame to be apportioned at the SFA it would be in not being politically astute enough to play the game.

Some merit in what you say Joe, but the SFA received many brickbats, deservedly, for not doing enough and leaving it to others. Many positive suggestions were given to them, but as always they knew best. 

[joewarkfanclub]

1 hour ago, Kmcalpin said:

Some merit in what you say Joe, but the SFA received many brickbats, deservedly, for not doing enough and leaving it to others. Many positive suggestions were given to them, but as always they knew best. 

They absolutely aren't faultless. Particularly when some former office holders may have had a vested interest in the Ibrox plan.

As usual, the murky world of politics never favours Scotland kindly.....

 

[FirParkCornerExile]

6 hours ago, joewarkfanclub said:

There WAS supposedly a deal in place to properly upgrade Hampden years ago, but the bulldozers were pulled away from the door by Thatcher in 1979 after an underhand deal was allegedly done to try and promote Ibrox as the new venue for internationals and Cup Finals.

Just one of the many reasons she was booed roundly when she presented that years Scottish Cup.

The SFA get a hard time over this but they have done what was possible with the money that they had.

The FA didnt rebuild Wembley with their own money. Private enterprise did most of the work with significant input from the government and National Lottery.

Same deal with the Millenium.

If there is any blame to be apportioned at the SFA it would be in not being politically astute enough to play the game.

100% correct , Rangers along with the Tories killed a full scale rebuild,  remember it like it was yesterday. Rangers lobbied the Tory Govt who just needed and excuse to back out as Rangers wanted Ibrox to be the home of Scotland games.

[wellfan]

6 hours ago, FirParkCornerExile said:

100% correct , Rangers along with the Tories killed a full scale rebuild,  remember it like it was yesterday. Rangers lobbied the Tory Govt who just needed and excuse to back out as Rangers wanted Ibrox to be the home of Scotland games.

Ironic, considering most Rangers fans don’t even support Scotland.

[FirParkCornerExile]

21 minutes ago, wellfan said:

Ironic, considering most Rangers fans don’t even support Scotland.

In those days it was a role reversal . In the mad confused world of the Old Firm bigotry many Celtic fans supported the Republic of Ireland over Scotland and you never saw the hatred some Rangers fans now have for Scotland.

[wellfan]

9 minutes ago, FirParkCornerExile said:

In those days it was a role reversal . In the mad confused world of the Old Firm bigotry many Celtic fans supported the Republic of Ireland over Scotland and you never saw the hatred some Rangers fans now have for Scotland.

The joys of West Central Scotland. 

[weeyin]

There were all sorts of complications surrounding the Hampden redevelopment, from the Taylor Report requirements appearing mid-plan to the city council withdrawing support. Not the mention the fundamental issue that Queens Park owned the stadium and had zero funds to contribute.

The people in charge, however, didn't make things any easier.

It is also very true that - to quote the Time article here, the "Tories Planned to Destroy Hampden Park".

It's rare to find a government that doesn't treat football and fans with contempt, but that particular government was worse than most.

 

[Big Stall]

27 minutes ago, weeyin said:

There were all sorts of complications surrounding the Hampden redevelopment, from the Taylor Report requirements appearing mid-plan to the city council withdrawing support. Not the mention the fundamental issue that Queens Park owned the stadium and had zero funds to contribute.

The people in charge, however, didn't make things any easier.

It is also very true that - to quote the Time article here, the "Tories Planned to Destroy Hampden Park".

It's rare to find a government that doesn't treat football and fans with contempt, but that particular government was worse than most.

 

Got a cut& paste? Not paying the times any money

[bobbybingo]

Probably missed something, but are you supposed to receive the bus tickets by email or pick them up from the office? 

[robsterwood]

Who will earn the right to play football?

[weeyin]

On 10/18/2025 at 9:31 AM, Big Stall said:

Got a cut& paste? Not paying the times any money

I must have good blocking in place, because it opened fine for me (and I've never paid them).

Usually pasting the URL into a private browser window does the trick.
 
Anyway, here  it is.

 

Quote

 

Tories planned to destroy Hampden Park

 

Marc Horne

Sunday December 13 2009, 12.01am GMT, The Sunday Times

Just when it seemed the reputation of the Thatcher government in Scotland couldn't sink lower, newly declassified documents reveal ministers plotted to bulldoze Hampden Park.

Correspondence from 1979 shows Tory ministers considered allowing Scotland's national football stadium to be razed.

While senior Conservatives acknowledged that demolition would provoke public anger, they planned to "sweeten the pill" by proposing that international matches be rotated in grounds across the country.

The loss of the home of Scottish football would have been a huge blow to the country, coming just months after the national team's dismal exit from the 1978 World Cup finals and the narrow failure of the Callaghan government's referendum on devolution. The plan is revealed in letters between Teddy Taylor, a former shadow Scottish secretary whose Cathcart constituency included the stadium, and Alexander Fletcher, then under-secretary of state for Scotland.

Taylor, who had just lost his seat but was advising the government, urged ministers to abandon Hampden after Glasgow district council withdrew funding for a planned revamp of the 76-year-old stadium.

"If the Hampden scheme isn't going ahead, wouldn't it be wise to call it a day, offering to sweeten the pill by indicating that the big international matches would be played at various grounds, not just in Glasgow, with Aberdeen, Dundee and Edinburgh all getting a share?" he wrote. "There would be the remaining problem of what to do with Hampden, but I have a feeling it would be better for this to be faced up to now rather than just allowing the massive ground simply to deteriorate. I think you'd be surprised to find how many folk would welcome it after the initial burst of protest."

Fletcher, who was also Scottish sports minister, replied: "If Glasgow district council does not reverse its decision, there is no doubt that the [redevelopment] scheme would have to be abandoned. In the event, it would be for the football bodies to decide what to do about big matches. It would be natural and appropriate for them to think in terms of using the bigger grounds in Glasgow and other parts of Scotland."

The minister, who died in 1989, used the council's decision to renege on the government's pledge to put £5.5m towards Hampden's redevelopment, noting that it presented an ideal opportunity to "cancel with honour".

An internal memo stated: "Mr Fletcher is anxious that the Scottish Office should not be seen as the cause of the project's abandonment and has spoken to the secretary of state in this sense."

However, officials stressed that the minister had publicly pledged his support for a revamped Hampden in the programme for a recent Scotland international, so there was a potential for "very critical press and public opinion".

Denied public funding, it took strong public support and some minor repair work to keep Hampden open until the 1990s, when the ground was finally rebuilt and reopened.

Alex Salmond, a keen football supporter, was surprised to learn that Hampden came close to being lost forever.

"It says it all for the Tories' attitude to Scotland that they seriously considering scrapping the national stadium - just as they bulldozed jobs and industry during their 18 long years in power," said a spokesman for the first minister.

Iain Emerson, editor of the Famous Tartan Army Magazine, said his readers would be appalled by the disclosure.

"It is well known that Thatcher had little love for Scotland, but demolishing the national stadium would have generated a Hampden roar loud enough to rattle the windows of Westminster," he said.

"The backlash would have made the poll tax protests seem like a picnic."

Richard McBrearty, the curator of the Hampden-based Scottish Football Museum, said: "There is a real emotional bond between Hampden and the people of Scotland, and any attempt to close it would have caused indignation across the country."

Taylor, who stepped down as an MP in 2005 and now lives in Southend, said he stood by the plan. "I still think it would have been terribly good to replace Hampden by having international games shared throughout Scotland," he said.

Hampden was the world's largest football venue until the 1950s, and still holds the European record for the largest crowd, when 149,415 people saw Scotland beat England 3-1 in 1937.