Former Motherwell Fc Players Thread

[Happy Dosser]

11 minutes ago, bobbybingo said:

My like wasn't 👍

🤣

Of course, on reflection, Clarke's record in the finals of international tournaments does speak for itself: we are unquestionably dire 😱.

[SteelmaninOZ]

And all that I knew was the hole in my shoe was letting in water 🌧️ 👞

[Kmcalpin]

Gavin Miller replaces John Park at St Mirren. Can Keith Lasley not think for himself?

[star sail]

1 hour ago, Faddyisgod said:

I’m sorry but as someone who is immersed in Serie A I can’t agree with this. Miller has played over 1000 minutes this season in a strong Udinese side with an excellent midfield. The coach has said numerous times what a strong player he is and his team mates have said how shocked they are that he has adapted so quickly to the game here. He is 19, moved to a different country by himself, playing at a much higher level and didn’t speak the language (as an aside I heard him try an interview in Italian recently and was impressed)

 

I moved to Italy 20 years ago, the same age as Lennon. It’s a very different place from Motherwell and can be very lonely at times. Playing high level sport (as I was also doing at that time) also makes the transition even more difficult. I have been very impressed with him and expect him to get more game time next year. 

Slightly nosey question but what was your sport? Did you move to Italy because of the sport?

I agree with what you say. I remember feeling slightly sorry for Lennon Miler at the time because it did seem like a big move for such a young guy.

Italy can be just as dark, just as wet, just as cold in the winter months and for a young guy to have the motivation to do it speaks highly of him. All the more reason that it is a real shame that his commitment has not been rewarding by a Scotland call up.

In nobody"s world is a regular Serie A midfield player an inferior option to a Manchester Utd reserve with little to no first team experience yet here we are. 

If as Weeyin suggests Clarke has picked Fletcher to make some sort of point then he should be nowhere near the Scotland managers job because he is effectively putting his own interests in front of the national interest. 

I suspect that Lennon's comments about wanting to be the best Scotland player will not have helped. In some cultures that type of ambition would be celebrated but I am certain those comments will not have gone down well with the ever frowning Mr Clarke.

 

[Happy Dosser]

1 hour ago, Faddyisgod said:

I’m sorry but as someone who is immersed in Serie A I can’t agree with this. Miller has played over 1000 minutes this season in a strong Udinese side with an excellent midfield. The coach has said numerous times what a strong player he is and his team mates have said how shocked they are that he has adapted so quickly to the game here. He is 19, moved to a different country by himself, playing at a much higher level and didn’t speak the language (as an aside I heard him try an interview in Italian recently and was impressed)

 

I moved to Italy 20 years ago, the same age as Lennon. It’s a very different place from Motherwell and can be very lonely at times. Playing high level sport (as I was also doing at that time) also makes the transition even more difficult. I have been very impressed with him and expect him to get more game time next year. 

Thanks for the inside track on Lennon: great to hear of his development on and off the pitch from someone who knows Serie A. Haven't heard him speaking Italian yet but Ferguson at Bologna sounded ok.

 

1 hour ago, weeyin said:

I'd also add that as bad as I feel for Miller I also feel bad for Billy Gilmour too. It's every player's nightmare to be selected for the World Cup finals and then get injured in a warm up game. 

I'm partly convinced that Clarke didn't pick Baron or Miller as a replacement to annoy all the fans and journalists who said he should.

Yes, I felt the same. I feel he's really thrawn and blinkered  and I feel he didn't like Lennon's naïve/misreported comments a while ago, probably especially  coming from a "diddy team" player at the time.

A four-year contract for Clarke  before a WC tournament is insane but sums up the SFA's cosy cartel of useless blazers who have failed to produce any improvement in the Scottish game domestically or internationally  since the 80s.

[Pettywulliegrew-2]

12 hours ago, mio said:

Totally agree. I might be wrong but I dont think Clarke has been to Fir park this season? He’s not interested in clubs like ours. He might have came once the year before to see Miller but I don’t remember the game.
His treatment of Miller is an utter disgrace, to bring in a boy with no game experience before the likes of Miller is a crime. I find it annoying we are at a World Cup and I have no excitement about it as I know we’ll watch 3 games of anti football and embarrass ourselves yet again at a tournament in front of the world.

 

From BBC gossip 

Scotland head coach Steve Clarke says he had to go with his gut feeling when calling up Manchester United teenager Tyler Fletcher for the World Cup - and revealed he has reached out to Lennon Miller after the Udinese midfielder was snubbed as a Billy Gilmour replacement (Scotsman)., external

Scotland head coach Steve Clarke says he had to go with his gut feeling when calling up Manchester United teenager Tyler Fletcher for the World Cup - and revealed he has reached out to Lennon Miller after the Udinese midfielder was snubbed as a Billy Gilmour replacement (Scotsman)., external

 

[well_said]

49 minutes ago, Pettywulliegrew-2 said:

 

From BBC gossip 

Scotland head coach Steve Clarke says he had to go with his gut feeling when calling up Manchester United teenager Tyler Fletcher for the World Cup - and revealed he has reached out to Lennon Miller after the Udinese midfielder was snubbed as a Billy Gilmour replacement (Scotsman)., external

Scotland head coach Steve Clarke says he had to go with his gut feeling when calling up Manchester United teenager Tyler Fletcher for the World Cup - and revealed he has reached out to Lennon Miller after the Udinese midfielder was snubbed as a Billy Gilmour replacement (Scotsman)., external

 

Reached out with two fingers.

[Lobey_Dosser]

23 hours ago, Faddyisgod said:

I’m sorry but as someone who is immersed in Serie A I can’t agree with this. Miller has played over 1000 minutes this season in a strong Udinese side with an excellent midfield. The coach has said numerous times what a strong player he is and his team mates have said how shocked they are that he has adapted so quickly to the game here. He is 19, moved to a different country by himself, playing at a much higher level and didn’t speak the language (as an aside I heard him try an interview in Italian recently and was impressed)

 

I moved to Italy 20 years ago, the same age as Lennon. It’s a very different place from Motherwell and can be very lonely at times. Playing high level sport (as I was also doing at that time) also makes the transition even more difficult. I have been very impressed with him and expect him to get more game time next year. 

I welcome your insight into Serie A and it’s reassuring to hear that you have been impressed by him. For one reason or another however, Steve Clarke hasn’t. 

It was reported today that Clarke had a conversation with those at risk of missing out in the WC during the March camp. Lennon would have been one of those. That being the case his last chance to impress would have been at home to Cremonese, That day I was very underwhelmed by Miller and Udinese. 

I of course want him to reach the heights we all think he can and I’m gutted that he is missing out in the opportunity of a lifetime. Accounting for the period of adjustment in Italy, I am searching for reasons as to why i) Miller missed out on the original 26 at the expense of a 5th centre forward and ii) Fletcher impressed the coaching staff more in a few days than Miller has over several camps. 

[David]

21 hours ago, Lobey_Dosser said:

Accounting for the period of adjustment in Italy, I am searching for reasons as to why i) Miller missed out on the original 26 at the expense of a 5th centre forward and ii) Fletcher impressed the coaching staff more in a few days than Miller has over several camps. 

Because Clarke has a hard-on for anyone who plays south of the border? He'd probably take the guy who cuts the grass at the Etihad before he'd take someone like Miller to the tournament.

[fizoxy]

5 minutes ago, David said:

Because Clarke has a hard-on for anyone who plays south of the border? He'd probably take the guy who cuts the grass at the Etihad before he'd take someone like Miller to the tournament.

I dont think it's an English thing, I think he's gone with recency bias and decided in Fletcher because he was looking right at him when a decision had to be made, and allowed that to cloud his judgement. It absolutely should have been Miller that replaced Gilmour. 

On the original 26 he probably looked at Mcginn, Christie, mctominay, Gilmour, Ferguson and mclean as the main group, with the first 3 lilely being the starters. I'm fine with more strikers, you need potential impact players in tournaments. 

The squad has a fair mix of Scottish (at least 7), English, and abroad based players (Italy and Saudi at least, forgot where mckenna is playing), and also some relatively new call-ups in Curtis, Hyam and Fletcher, and while he has his favorites, i dont think that there's many legitimate shouts for guys that have been hard done by.

I'm not as down on Clarke as most, but my gripe with him is the way we play, less than who he selects.

[grizzlyg]

22 minutes ago, fizoxy said:

I dont think it's an English thing, I think he's gone with recency bias and decided in Fletcher because he was looking right at him when a decision had to be made, and allowed that to cloud his judgement. It absolutely should have been Miller that replaced Gilmour. 

On the original 26 he probably looked at Mcginn, Christie, mctominay, Gilmour, Ferguson and mclean as the main group, with the first 3 lilely being the starters. I'm fine with more strikers, you need potential impact players in tournaments. 

The squad has a fair mix of Scottish (at least 7), English, and abroad based players (Italy and Saudi at least, forgot where mckenna is playing), and also some relatively new call-ups in Curtis, Hyam and Fletcher, and while he has his favorites, i dont think that there's many legitimate shouts for guys that have been hard done by.

I'm not as down on Clarke as most, but my gripe with him is the way we play, less than who he selects.

Mckenna with Dinamo Zagreb and doing well.

You say 5 strikers but bear in mind three of them are Dykes, Adams and Hirst!

[purestate]

The choice of Fletcher over Lennon or indeed any of the others with far more first team experience is last straw for me with Clarke and his overall judgement as a manager.  

Fletcher may turn out to be as good or better than his dad and will have plenty of opportunities to demonstrate this in upcoming campaigns but there can’t be any serious expectation that he will play any part in this WC.  
 

Maybe Lennon wouldn’t have either but has at least been involved with squad and (unless has pissed off some senior players - doubtful) would have contributed far more to preparation and training. 

As it is I can realistically see Scotland finishing in last place either losing all three or a single shitfest point so perhaps Lennon is well out of it. 

As some others have said my enthusiasm for this WC is at an all time low.  

[grizzlyg]

2 hours ago, mio said:

🤣🤣 exactly this. We are 100% not qualifying with that five card trick in charge of us.

im not even sure I want to watch this friendly tonight, I’d much prefer watching Elijah v England on the other channel.

Hope elijah plays and has a great game to put himself in shop window for English teams.   Obviously I want him to stay but if chance to get great money then we cant turn it down

[grizzlyg]

18 hours ago, purestate said:

The choice of Fletcher over Lennon or indeed any of the others with far more first team experience is last straw for me with Clarke and his overall judgement as a manager.  

Fletcher may turn out to be as good or better than his dad and will have plenty of opportunities to demonstrate this in upcoming campaigns but there can’t be any serious expectation that he will play any part in this WC.  
 

Maybe Lennon wouldn’t have either but has at least been involved with squad and (unless has pissed off some senior players - doubtful) would have contributed far more to preparation and training. 

As it is I can realistically see Scotland finishing in last place either losing all three or a single shitfest point so perhaps Lennon is well out of it. 

As some others have said my enthusiasm for this WC is at an all time low.  

For me it doesn't make sense especially when Clarke is very loyal ( ridiculously overloyal to some)

I still think its to get Fletcher capped so england cant pinch him but i sometimes think maybe our squad is too cliquey and Clarke being very influenced by senior players

[mio]

10 minutes ago, grizzlyg said:

For me it doesn't make sense especially when Clarke is very loyal ( ridiculously overloyal to some)

I still think its to get Fletcher capped so england cant pinch him but i sometimes think maybe our squad is too cliquey and Clarke being very influenced by senior players

I think this has a lot to do with it. A lot has to do with who the more influential players want to go on a two week trip with. Cos it won’t be any more than 2 weeks.

i hate feeling like this about Scotland but that last tournament put the tin lid on it for me. Apart from the last Denmark game (which we stunk the house out for about 70mins of) we were awful to watch throughout that campaign. 
I still want to go in hoping we can do ok but I fear the worst…. Again.

as for Fletcher, I’m sure the boy will turn out a good player but he’s had 17mins of first team football…. It’s a fkn scandal 

[weeyin]

If Glimour wasn't injured, what was Clarke going to do to stop England pinching him?

Whatever that was he could have done exactly the same and picked MIller or Baron.

And if you're a player happy to be pinched by England, I don't want in you a Scottish team.

[grizzlyg]

7 minutes ago, weeyin said:

If Glimour wasn't injured, what was Clarke going to do to stop England pinching him?

Whatever that was he could have done exactly the same and picked MIller or Baron.

And if you're a player happy to be pinched by England, I don't want in you a Scottish team.

Agree 💯,  if he was tempted by England he shouldn't be there but i don't think that is case as fully committed to Scotland .  However...This is why we have been lumbered with gunn, Adams, Hirst.  Guys that weren't least bit interested in playing for Scotland until we qualified for a tournament or in guns case suddenly made himself available when Gordon had double leg break

[grizzlyg]

20 minutes ago, mio said:

I think this has a lot to do with it. A lot has to do with who the more influential players want to go on a two week trip with. Cos it won’t be any more than 2 weeks.

i hate feeling like this about Scotland but that last tournament put the tin lid on it for me. Apart from the last Denmark game (which we stunk the house out for about 70mins of) we were awful to watch throughout that campaign. 
I still want to go in hoping we can do ok but I fear the worst…. Again.

as for Fletcher, I’m sure the boy will turn out a good player but he’s had 17mins of first team football…. It’s a fkn scandal 

Also clique environment summed up with Liam Kelly being there who is apparently good round the dressing room! ( to quote Roy Keane........does he do card tricks....good at quizzes) 🤣🤣

[David]

I've gone ahead and moved some of the World Cup chat to the World Cup thread in General Football so the Former Players thread can get back on track. A few posts around current players and players leaving us in this window have been shifted to the 2025/26 ins and outs thread.