2024/25 Ins & Outs Discussion

[dennyc]

39 minutes ago, steelboy said:

It would have been some afternoon's work if he made zero saves.

Good point. If others had done their job as well as he did his, then he may well have had zero saves to make. Like quite a few games this season.

Aberdeen were hardly world beaters and we let them off the hook. Bar a 25 minute spell in the second half we were at least their equal. Even then we were inches away from a headed equaliser from Moses late on as Aberdeen were in panic mode..

[FirParkCornerExile]

1 hour ago, dennyc said:

Good point. If others had done their job as well as he did his, then he may well have had zero saves to make. Like quite a few games this season.

Aberdeen were hardly world beaters and we let them off the hook. Bar a 25 minute spell in the second half we were at least their equal. Even then we were inches away from a headed equaliser from Moses late on as Aberdeen were in panic mode..

Aberdeen were the same pile of shite they've been in every one of the games that they've taken 10 points off us. Losing 10 points to them tells you more about us than them.

[Onthefringes]

4 hours ago, FirParkCornerExile said:

Aberdeen were the same pile of shite they've been in every one of the games that they've taken 10 points off us. Losing 10 points to them tells you more about us than them.

Can’t disagree. Outthought by Peter Leven. Twice.

[weeyin]

13 hours ago, Onthefringes said:

Can’t disagree. Outthought by Peter Leven. Twice.

Outhought in what way? Did he infiltrate our training last year to make us bang average all season?

 

[wellfan97]

Stefan Scougall signed a new contract with Alloa now so those rumours are untrue. Wouldn't have expected it to happen anyway.

[Onthefringes]

6 hours ago, weeyin said:

Outhought in what way? Did he infiltrate our training last year to make us bang average all season?

 

Bravo

[TheoBair14]

Kevin Nisbet apparently leaving Millwall would you take him at Motherwell? 
I would play him next to Bair if we went in for him 

[well_said]

42 minutes ago, TheoBair14 said:

Kevin Nisbet apparently leaving Millwall would you take him at Motherwell? 
I would play him next to Bair if we went in for him 

We can't afford him.

[grizzlyg]

49 minutes ago, TheoBair14 said:

Kevin Nisbet apparently leaving Millwall would you take him at Motherwell? 
I would play him next to Bair if we went in for him 

Yes but no chance we could afford him.   I would rather we tried for Simon Murray who is out of contract with Ross Co

[MelvinBragg]

27 minutes ago, grizzlyg said:

Yes but no chance we could afford him.   I would rather we tried for Simon Murray who is out of contract with Ross Co

Apparently we offered Simon Murray a contract when he was at Queens Park and he laughed at our offer...

[weeyin]

1 hour ago, MelvinBragg said:

Apparently we offered Simon Murray a contract when he was at Queens Park and he laughed at our offer...

Difficult to compete with Roy McGregor's deep pockets.

[pretzel]

10 hours ago, weeyin said:

Difficult to compete with Roy McGregor's deep pockets.

I seem to remember Alan Burrow's saying in an interview that County typically needs to pay an extra 20% to entice players up to Dingwall due to the location. It was mentioned as well that we competed with them to sign Jackson Irvine back in 2015 and they doubled our wage offer, they sold him 12 months later for a decent fee.

I was never really impressed with Simon Murray, he always seemed to run about like a headless chicken and he never really set the heather on fire previously in the Premiership with Dundee United, Dundee, or Hibs. However, he is probably enjoying his best season.

It'll be interesting to see how our rebuild goes from this point on.

[StAndrew7]

I wasn't at the game on Saturday but had a few mates report on some of the rumoured signings, most of which are on P&B now too:

- "experienced" keeper

- Shaun Rooney

- Ayo Obileye

- Dylan Easton

- A left back 

Now we've got safety sorted, will be interesting to see if we make any announcements on incoming players. Personally I'd only want them to be announced if they're finished their seasons. I don't think it's right to declare a signing who's still playing for a club/has games remaining.

[wellfan]

17 minutes ago, StAndrew7 said:

I wasn't at the game on Saturday but had a few mates report on some of the rumoured signings, most of which are on P&B now too:

- "experienced" keeper

- Shaun Rooney

- Ayo Obileye

- Dylan Easton

- A left back 

Now we've got safety sorted, will be interesting to see if we make any announcements on incoming players. Personally I'd only want them to be announced if they're finished their seasons. I don't think it's right to declare a signing who's still playing for a club/has games remaining.

I guess this means the following, but I'm happy to be corrected by those in the know.

- Kelly must be away.

- St Johnstone fans seem keen on bringing Rooney back. Where would this leave SOD? McGinn will hopefully sign a new deal, and I assume the mysterious Elliot will be away.

- Obileye didn't have a good game for Livi on Saturday, but he is likely an able replacement for Butcher and Mugabi.

- Would Easton fill the Spittal-shaped gap? What about Nicholson? The latter played well in the spaces on Saturday.

- The new LB won't be Gent, sadly. 

I doubt we'll declare any signings until the season's conclusion, and we'll likely announce the clearout first with one of those end-of-season player contract updates. 

[StAndrew7]

4 minutes ago, wellfan said:

I guess this means the following, but I'm happy to be corrected by those in the know.

- Kelly must be away.

- St Johnstone fans seem keen on bringing Rooney back. Where would this leave SOD? McGinn will hopefully sign a new deal, and I assume the mysterious Elliot will be away.

- Obileye didn't have a good game for Livi on Saturday, but he is likely an able replacement for Butcher and Mugabi.

- Would Easton fill the Spittal-shaped gap? What about Nicholson? The latter played well in the spaces on Saturday.

- The new LB won't be Gent, sadly. 

I doubt we'll declare any signings until the season's conclusion, and we'll likely announce the clearout first with one of those end-of-season player contract updates. 

Aye, agreed.

Gent is very much in the mould of someone who Blackburn had never even thought about and is now very much in their plans, or at the very least to be sold off the back of his performances up here (like Furlong, but maybe we'll see him again 👀).

I'd like to keep Nicholson as he definitely has a spark of something we've been lacking at times when Spittal has been off it and if we do and Easton is coming in I guess that signals intention around attacking options. i.e. sticking with a lone striker well supported by two others. Would leave Ferrie and one other (probably to be brought in) as back up to Bair.

[wellfan]

5 minutes ago, StAndrew7 said:

Would leave Ferrie and one other (probably to be brought in) as back up to Bair.

We have Moses Ebiye here next season, and I'm looking forward to seeing what he can do after a full pre-season.

[Kmcalpin]

Some of these rumours articulated on P & B too. Like StAndrew7, I hope we don't announce any names until their seasons end, but that may be outwith our control i.e. the now infamous Tom Wright announcement.  Certainly we do have a good track record, as a club, in this regard.

I watched Obileye very closely indeed on Saturday and it was mixed bag.  He saved a couple of potential goals with fantastic interventions but also made a few blunders. Bevis MK2?

I'm actually optimistic for next season. Clearing a fair bit of deadwood will free up wages and SK has now had ample time to to fully assess his squad. There are virtually no players I'd hate to lose - maybe McGinn and possibly SOD but thats about it. If Bair and/or Miller move on so be it but we shouldn't overrely on those moves financially. The chances of retaining Vale and Gent only become realistic if you've been using a hookah.

The defence needs 100% strengthened, not just with positional requirements but also with personality/character ones as well.  A commanding goalie; commanding central defenders; mobile defensive midfielder for starters. We badly need oprganisers/leaders on the pitch. By my reckoning we need anywhere from 14-16 new lads but that doesn't take into account internal promotions from the Academy.

Strikers: as things stand we probably need another couple and certainly one with the physical attributes to replace Bair, in a lone role, should he get injured or suspended.

A few issues to be clarified:

Ewan Wilson - worth a new deal?

Sam Nicholson - worth a deal in my view

Ross Tierney - mutual or punt out on loan again?

Mark Ferrie - needs another year in the development squad, although he is 18. 

 

 

[StAndrew7]

4 minutes ago, wellfan said:

We have Moses Ebiye here next season, and I'm looking forward to seeing what he can do after a full pre-season.

Aye, point well made. I think he'll be fine. Would be pleased with 10 or so goal contributions from.

Quite a few folk have written him off already.

He's averaged 12.5 mins on the park over 4 appearances, scored one and should have had an assist if it weren't for Oli Shaw being OLI FUCKING SHAW.

[wellfan]

9 minutes ago, Kmcalpin said:

The defence needs 100% strengthened, not just with positional requirements but also with personality/character ones as well.  A commanding goalie; commanding central defenders; mobile defensive midfielder for starters.

It could also be argued that our defensive coaching needs to be addressed. The staff have got something out of our attacking plays via coaching Bair, whereas our defensive plays are pathetic and predictable. For example, we have a dedicated goalkeeping coach and an analyst who seems to have spent a lot of time with Bair on attacking improvements, so why not a defensive coach (maybe we do?), particularly given it's been our Achilles heel? Behind the scenes, technical tweaks can be the difference between a bang-average team like ours finishing top or bottom six. We quite simply cannot afford to concede as many cheap goals as we do on an ongoing basis. 

[Kmcalpin]

Yes, coaching does need to be improved. Clearly attempts have been made to address our achilles heel, but they've mainly unsuccessful. I've no idea why. 

[joewarkfanclub]

We have only won 9 games this season.

But we have drawn 13 and lost 9 by only 1 goal.

That tells me we have been competive in the majority of our games this season.

That being the case if we had prevented just a handful of the really poor goals we have lost this season we would be much further up the league.

Fine margins.

Given that SK hasnt been able to coach these mistakes out of the team, I think its inevitible our defence will be overhauled close season.

We need different personnel and/or a different system if we want to improve next season.

Whether that possible or not on our budget remains to be seen.

[bobbybingo]

Bair has clearly taken the dedicated coaching on board, learned from it and improved. Defensively, maybe we do need better coaching, or maybe the players in question just aren't capable of applying the lessons during matches. Maybe both. It must be nigh on impossible to ensure someone isn't a dozy bugger, no matter how often you drill it into them.

[weeyin]

1 hour ago, Kmcalpin said:

Yes, coaching does need to be improved. Clearly attempts have been made to address our achilles heel, but they've mainly unsuccessful. I've no idea why. 

From what I've watched, the issue with many of the soft goals we've lost (and it has been many) is often down to individual mistakes. That is really difficult to resolve through coaching. If you drill the defensive unit on set pieces etc. all week and then somebody switches off for a second, it can be very expensive.

Contrast that with coaching someone like Bair or Spittal. If they make a positional error or switch off for a second, then the ball dribbles out of play or the don't connect with a cross. It can still cost us a goal in the credit column, but it never feels quite as damaging - unless it's missing a last minute sitter to win a game.

Some fixes are easier, like making sure we keep passes from the back short and simple. For players that continue to make individual errors,  it's a more challenging job. Of course there's a valid argument to be made that defending starts from the front and every player needs to be contributing to closing down space, tracking runners etc. - not just the defenders. But it's very frustrating to see strikers get free headers or yards of space to shoot on a weekly basis.

Maybe the answer is to find a coach whose expertise is in defending. Maybe the answer is to line up a different way (wing backs seems the least effective way to defend for me). I'm sure part of the answer is in finding one or two better central defenders.

We do need to solve it though.

[wellgirl]

23 minutes ago, bobbybingo said:

Bair has clearly taken the dedicated coaching on board, learned from it and improved. Defensively, maybe we do need better coaching, or maybe the players in question just aren't capable of applying the lessons during matches. Maybe both. It must be nigh on impossible to ensure someone isn't a dozy bugger, no matter how often you drill it into them.

I think confidence has a part to play as well. Like when you go on a bad run it's tough to pull yourself out of it. I think it was obvious after that defeat to Celtic last Sept that the entire team lost confidence - it was visible that nothing was going right for us. 

The goals for and against aren't that different compared to last year - it's just that obviously we had more wins last season. We've been incredibly unlucky with injuries this season and that can't have helped. 

[Kmcalpin]

A lot of truth in that Weeyin. Coaching can only take players so far. The odd individual error is acceptable but if it happens time after time, albeit only twice or three times per game? 

Sloppy and overelaborate defending almost cost us early on last Saturday. On several occasions, we faffed about the back passing the ball to and fro when Livi players were closing us down quickly. Liam Kelly didn't help matters much though with his poor judgement when passing the ball out to players already under pressure. That wasn't down to individual errors.