That Old Chestnut - Do We Move Or Do We Stay

[Kmcalpin]

That old question has resurfaced again following an update at the AGM. In some ways nothing has changed but in other ways it has. The Club Directors had commissioned a report addressing the dilemma as to whether we upgrade Fir Park or whether we move. A Iengthy tome has now landed on their desks and rightly they will take time to digest it. Its interesting now though that a completley new regime is taking a another, fresh look at the issue. I suppose one catalyst is the state of the POD. Anyone sitting in there yesterday will share my concerns. Whatever the directors decide, doing nothing isn't an option. Other parts of the ground also require attention especially the East Stand. However, that can't be redeveloped whilst the school is still there and I doubt if that will close anytime soon. Demolishing and rebuilding the POD will be costly and complicated and disruptive, especially as we don't own the houses at the south western corner. The new regime is maximising the use of every available pocket of land that it can i.e. Mrs Baillies and now the corner between the East and Cooper Stands. But thats a sticking plaster exercise, albeit a creative one. 

Like Spiderpig, I favour moving to a new stadium. That of course, comes with its own problems namely cost.  Whilst the club is now in an extremely healthy position with the prospect of more substantial transfer income to come it certainly won't stretch to constructing a new stadium; nothing like it. If we ever do move in my lifetime, It'll be hard leaving my second home of decades behind but I think that time has come. New generations of Well fans want and deserve modern, good facilities not memories. 

It'll be interesting to learn what the Directors make of the report. Watch this space.         

[weeyin]

i agree about deserving modern, good facilities, but I don't see much of that on offer at the other newer stadiums.

And that is going to be the challenge unless some serious money is available.

[joewarkfanclub]

I think the problem with moving to a new stadium is the lack of joined up thinking when it comes to national or local government and the political will for urban regeneration.

Without this becoming a political post (its hard to avoid) its been more than 30 years now since they shut The Craig and we are nowhere near to realising any re-generation of the site.

The fault of that lies at the feet of governments of all persuasions both at Westmister, Holyrood and locally.

My preference would absolutely be a new purpose built stadium at Ravenscraig.

But we would need buy in from government and local councils to ensure that planning allowed for railway lines, roads, bus links, retail and leisure infrastructure that could support the project as part of the bigger venture of re-generating a community long left behind.

In the absence of such co-operation, the club is left to try and generate the revenue required to build something fit for purpose, whilst allowing us to remain competitive on the pitch.

Thats a big ask.

Looking forward to seeing what the feasability studies say, but my feeling is that the path of least resistance will be to demolish and rebuild the POD.

The other 3 stands can be maintained in the short to medium term and a new POD would allow us to generate further revenue and bring down some of our costs.

Not gonna be an easy fix, but a league win and Champions League money might help!

😉😉😉

[dennyc]

If the best option is to re-locate then lots of avenues need to be approached before that final decision can be made. Can a supposedly cash short Local Authority assist in any way? Community Club etc etc with initiatives already in place that improve the lives of locals and lessen the burden on the LA. You would hope the LA would therefore try to find some ways to assist us. Providing the land itself as a start and then ensuring the new ground is reachable by local transport. Could MFC provide modern facilities within the ground to support the LA in their own local initiatives?

How about Government ....Scottish and UK....Development Grants? I don't know if Lanarkshire was included in the UK Government's allocation of millions to assist deprived areas. Lottery funding perhaps? A major Company securing naming rights and providing up front funding? There must also be other areas way beyond my understanding. Perhaps the Feasibility Study will have addressed what is available beyond MFC?

Clearly none of the above, if available, would cover the full cost. But they might just reduce the Club's commitment to a level that is bearable.

My own view is that we should have moved years ago when the Economic climate was much better and LA's were in a far better situation. I still think re-locating is the best solution as we must have already spent millions just keeping Fir Park within safety requirements. Hopefully our now forward thinking Board can come up with a proposal acceptable to all of us.

 

 

[texanwellfan]

At Austin FC opening game this afternoon. Their 25000 capacity stadium built in 2021 cost $260 million and was privately funded. 

[Inthebasement]

I very rarely post but have posted on this a few times in the distant past. I love Fir Park dearly and believe we must preserve our history and stay / redevelop if at all possible. If we leave Fir Park we will lose something we will never get back. Realistically, we would not get anything special or architecturally interesting, it would be Almondvale with different colours and a bigger away end. That is the economics.

I don't know the ins and outs of course, but surely rebuilding the POD from scratch would provide a platform to modernise the stadium / facilities while addressing the worst of the problems, and though expensive would be a more manageable project than a complete move to RC?

[FirParkCornerExile]

A new roof on the East Stand and rebuild of the Main Stain should be within financial limitations of the club.

Last I read somewhere upgrading the Main Stand would be circa £2million a complete rebuild £5 million. Ayr Utd built a new stand with excellent corporate suites / Function Suite for £3 Million. However only 800 seats.  Unless substantial outside investment is available a new ground would be very difficult to realise.    

 

[grizzlyg]

Rebuild POD stand for me.   New stadium in ravenscraig a no for me, no infrastructure at all and no transport links 

[wellfan]

Rebuild and refurb please. 

[bobbybingo]

Rebuild, remain. It's home.

[Spiderpig]

Given that the pod was built long before the complex planning, and environmental rules and regulations we have now, is it realistic to expect that the pod can be demolished and rebuilt to the same size and capacity on the same footprint.

For me i dont think it can be, the cooper stand was halved in size due to residents objections as it was originaly supposed to be the same as the McLean stand.

For me a refurb is not an option given its wooden construction, and the difficulties that creates with saftey regulations etc and im not convinced a total rebuild would be allowed under todays regulations etc.

[0Neils40yarder]

Can't think of many things worse than a flat-pack effort of a stadium at that desolate Ravenscraig

[Spiderpig]

1 hour ago, grizzlyg said:

Rebuild POD stand for me.   New stadium in ravenscraig a no for me, no infrastructure at all and no transport links 

Im sure if a new stadium was built at the craig, upper crust would open a 2nd outlet, or would more infrastucture be  required?

[stv]

1 hour ago, Inthebasement said:

I very rarely post but have posted on this a few times in the distant past. I love Fir Park dearly and believe we must preserve our history and stay / redevelop if at all possible. If we leave Fir Park we will lose something we will never get back. Realistically, we would not get anything special or architecturally interesting, it would be Almondvale with different colours and a bigger away end. That is the economics.

I don't know the ins and outs of course, but surely rebuilding the POD from scratch would provide a platform to modernise the stadium / facilities while addressing the worst of the problems, and though expensive would be a more manageable project than a complete move to RC?

Seems simple to me . Move to a soulless new stadium like all the other horrible new stadiums built in the last 30 years . Ruining the history and wiping out the legacy of our home Fir Park. Or keep the three existing new refurbished stands ,knock down the main stand and rebuild it from scratch as a modern base for a modern club to our required specifications. We have a great playing surface and three modern sides to the stadium 75% of a good stadium already in place .

Obviously a lot of disruption ,planning and organisation required for this but the best one . Nowadays history and tradition seem to go for nothing in the corporate world and the sporting world.. Surely its a matter of pride that we have been at the same site for over 100 years and worth presrving. So what if you need to park in a street n walk to the ground on match day ,its all part of the matchday tradition . Everything has got to be so new , sanitised and shinny these days .  You could have a stadium in the middle of no where with a carpark right next to it costing £10 to £20 park every home game and an hour to get out of after the game ,no thanks

Redevelope the Main Stand for me.

 

[weeyin]

12 minutes ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Can't think of many things worse than a flat-pack effort of a stadium at that desolate Ravenscraig

This.

[joewarkfanclub]

17 minutes ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Can't think of many things worse than a flat-pack effort of a stadium at that desolate Ravenscraig

Agreed.

And if we have to build on our own, with no help or support from outside agencies, thats what we will end up with.

We have done well to get control of our club and get a young enthusiastic forward looking board in place that reflects the aspirations of the support.

We also have the prospect of some serious finance coming into the club by way of player trading / prize money coming soon.

A good decision now sets us up for the future.

A bad one can have us back scrambling around to make ends meet.

 

[Spiderpig]

15 minutes ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Can't think of many things worse than a flat-pack effort of a stadium at that desolate Ravenscraig

I see the luddites are out in force tonight, we have two srands at Fir park that are not fit for purpose by todays standards and expectations from the paying public, bolting seats to old terracing and having people pay to sit on seats in the pod stained with pigeon crap, every 2nd or 3rd one broken, turnstyles that were modern the last time we won the league, unsafe congestion in public areas etc and people are getting teary eyed and sentimental about it, aye ok then.

Would you accept sub standard and or potentially unsafe conditions in a theatre, restaurant etc, football grounds are no different.

[grizzlyg]

24 minutes ago, Spiderpig said:

Im sure if a new stadium was built at the craig, upper crust would open a 2nd outlet, or would more infrastucture be  required?

If we build a new stadium there then transport links poor, local businesses suffer also.   I think we all have different opinions.  Not wanting a new stadium doesn't make you a luddite. 

If a new stadium was built it would need to be unique and not the bog standard like usual new builds

[purestate]

9 minutes ago, Spiderpig said:

I see the luddites are out in force tonight, we have two srands at Fir park that are not fit for purpose by todays standards and expectations from the paying public, bolting seats to old terracing and having people pay to sit on seats in the pod stained with pigeon crap, every 2nd or 3rd one broken, turnstyles that were modern the last time we won the league, unsafe congestion in public areas etc and people are getting teary eyed and sentimental about it, aye ok then.

Would you accept sub standard and or potentially unsafe conditions in a theatre, restaurant etc, football grounds are no different.

I wouldn’t suggest those against are luddites as such, perhaps overly sentimental?   
personally I’ve been going for well over 40 years with season tickets in East stand and now PO’D.   
I wasn’t born in Motherwell, have never lived there and so have no real connection to the place other than the ground itself.  
 

I was a Well fan in EK in late 70’s / 80’s while most around me were Old Firm because my dad took me to Fir Park after visiting friends in his home town, Wishaw.  
Maybe my lack of direct connection to the town but also having had an uncle who worked at the Craig explains why I wouldn’t be adverse to moving to the old site of the steelworks as a reasonable alternative.  
However I will also be perfectly happy to stay where we are and while improved facilities of all kinds would be ideal it’s not a deal breaker for me to keep being a supporter. 

[weeyin]

19 minutes ago, Spiderpig said:

I see the luddites are out in force tonight, we have two srands at Fir park that are not fit for purpose by todays standards and expectations from the paying public, bolting seats to old terracing and having people pay to sit on seats in the pod stained with pigeon crap, every 2nd or 3rd one broken, turnstyles that were modern the last time we won the league, unsafe congestion in public areas etc and people are getting teary eyed and sentimental about it, aye ok then.

Would you accept sub standard and or potentially unsafe conditions in a theatre, restaurant etc, football grounds are no different.

Nice internet debating technique. Don't want a substandard stadium build then you are a luddite.

It's possible to hold two (or more) thoughts at once. I don't want a substandard new build and don't like the substandard facilities we have now.

Maybe there are other options that are better, and that's why we have invested in reviewing options.